6/4 pots Vs 4/4 Pots Braking

Iv had this on my mind for a while, what would be say the difference between

6 Pots Front/4 Pots Rear

And

4 Pots Front/4 Pots Rear

Cheers

Sadly it is not that simple.

There are many good 4 pots (stock Supra for instance) which are better than cheap and shoddy 6 pots.

Even the high end Brembo vs AP shows big differences.

And then there's the question of brake pads.

A set of Chris Wilson race spec pads on j-specs could probably match a set of Uk spec 4 pots on stock pads.

So many variables.

I was always under the impression that rears must be smaller than the fronts (not just the disks) as it would upset the brake bias? If the rears have more or almost equal to the front it can spin the car?? Dunno how true it is but heard it from more than one source.

I was always under the impression that rears must be smaller than the fronts (not just the disks) as it would upset the brake bias? If the rears have more or almost equal to the front it can spin the car?? Dunno how true it is but heard it from more than one source.

I run 6 pot front and rear, but the rears are smaller pots to balance the braking. All depends on the pot sizes.

so you could run UK 4 POT fronts, and 4 pots rear like say Brembo for instance???

The UK four pots actually have more piston area than most of the aftermarket 6 piston calipers....not just the cheap ones.

The Alcon calipers definitelyhave less piston area....I'm trying to hunt down the Brembo piston diameters but nobody wants to give them to me

Interestingly a lot of the aftermarket big brake kits market the fronts as "suitable for use with OEM rear brake setup"....read into that what you will

so you could run UK 4 POT fronts, and 4 pots rear like say Brembo for instance???

You can run whatever you want, but in most cases unless your in need of some serious sustained braking power then I'd stick with a full oem uk spec and decent pads.

If your after the serious stuff then you need to buy a matched setup where the manufacturer has at least done some development into what is needed.

I would never consider running a setup that is just cobbled together (for want of a better description!) as you have no idea what braking forces are available and what balance you have.

Just consider the situation where every time you brake in the wet the rear end swaps with the front.... not clever or funny.

As already mentioned there are some tin-pot 'shiney' systems out there that are crap.... Toyota did a very good job with the car design.

im glad this has been brought up my j spec is having the gt4088 single conversion with a expected power of 600 bhp. obviosly the j spec brakes are not suitable for the job so i want use which to go for

uk

high spec 6 or 8 pots

k - sport 6 or 8 pots

http://www.mkivsupra.net/vbb/showthread.php?t=168382&page=3

just found this and it looks like most have the 6 or 8 front with a 4 rear, and a fair few using the uk for the rear but then big at the front

i really dont know what to do?!

will be spending 2k max to do the whole lot, so thats 1k front and rear or cheaper rear expensinve front?

im glad this has been brought up my j spec is having the gt4088 single conversion with a expected power of 600 bhp. obviosly the j spec brakes are not suitable for the job so i want use which to go for

 

uk

high spec 6 or 8 pots

k - sport 6 or 8 pots

If it will see little track work I'd go with a UK based setup with some decent pads. Spend some money on good fluid and time on some ducting if you see heat issues on track days.

If your doing extended high speed braking track work then an alloy caliper and larger discs will help with heat - again, you'll need good pads and ducting would be advisable.

You'll need to significantly increase the disc size to get more outright stopping power than the UK spec with Alcon/High Spec/KSport and probably Brembo and Rotora as well.

What do you use the car for?

umm fun? not going to track it, possibly a bit of drag, just had it built because i can kinda thing not because i needed it? so if i found a "private runway" and was racing and a cat ran out, like to know i can stop

k sport ones look good

kit consists of -

The Ksport big brake kit includes:

* 8/6-Piston Aluminum calipers

* High quality brake pads

* D.O.T. Compliant Stainless steel brake lines

* Machined aluminum hats

* Carbon steel brackets

* large ventilated discs (17" wheels required)

* Ksport or Ferodo Brake Pads

8 pot -

286mm Kit with Ksport Street pads £781.74 Add to Cart

304mm Kit with Ksport Street pads £825.22 Add to Cart

330mm Kit with Ksport Street pads £868.70 Add to Cart

356mm kit with Ksport Street pads £1,086.09 Add to Cart

380mm kit with Ksport Street pads £1,738.26 Add to Cart

400mm kit with Ksport Street pads £2,282.61

6 pot -

330mm Kit with Ksport Street pads £868.70

330mm Kit with Ksport Sport pads £756.60

330mm Kit with Ksport Race pads £787.24

330mm Kit with Ferodo DS2500 pads £787.24

330mm Kit with Ferodo DS3000 pads £812.77

356mm kit with Ksport Street pads £1,086.09

356mm kit with Ksport Sport pads £879.16

356mm kit with Ksport Race pads £909.79

356mm kit with Ferodo DS2500 pads £909.79

356mm kit with Ferodo DS3000 pads £935.33

how on earth are you ment to know which ones to go for?

bigger calipers or bigger disks?

like i said, say for example i had 2k to spend on set up, which would people choose? same all round or a combo of above?

cheers

dont go for any, get some ap ones

not much help. or fit the budget

Why do people insist that j-specs aren't good enough when you have xxx bhp? I've never understood what difference the power makes to the braking of the car. Surely regardless of what power you have if you are in a 180mph car your going to need good brakes?

It annoys me that people only seem to go for what, in my opinion, should be the first modification to any car this powerful after they have modified it to be a 600hp+ machine.

I understand the need for 6pots etc etc when it comes to racing and tracking as you want the brakes to stay as cool as possible but seriously, what is the need after a single tubby conversion?

If you are happy with the stopping power of J-Specs pre-single then you should be happy with it after, your not REALLY going to be going that much faster.

I'm genuinely curious about peoples opinions on this so sorry if it sounds like a bit of a rant i just hate that the stopping power of the car always comes last on these forums.

Possibly the greater forces the cars comes under when you increase to single power, i.e. braking round corners whilst still applying the power.

Plus the chances of people going the same speed once single is slim.

carrying on from dandan's advice....

I'd stick with the uk spec setup all round, decent pads and fluids.

The K-sport have been used in Time Attack by a number of teams but I never heard any reports on effectiveness.

Also, bare in mind how lardy a Supra really is because some of the kits out there fit but won't necessarily stop it well.

I run :

Front - AP 356mm discs + 6 pot KAD

Rear - stock discs + KAD 6 pot

Motul RBF600 fluid

ducting to the front discs

competition pads

bias valve

- and have never had braking issues in competition or track days.... so based on that anything more will be overkill.

Remember wheel sizes as well - some of the kits won't fit!

HTH

i see what you mean scott. Why does stopping from 70-80-90 mph with you have an NA or TT become suddenly different when you have a single with a billion horespower? you still stopping the same ammount of weight at the same ammount of speed. You only need anything other than jspecs if your doing trackdays or stopping from high speeds frequently.

There is a difference between jspec and uk spec stopping power and i wasnt very confident on my old jspecs from high speed. they seemed to take forever! the uk's are very very good though. Anything more without doing trackdays regular is pointless. L33 - save your money. Put some UK's on.

Possibly the greater forces the cars comes under when you increase to single power, i.e. braking round corners whilst still applying the power.

I dont' really get what you mean there.

Plus the chances of people going the same speed once single is slim.

 

See this is what i think is in most peoples head when it comes to brakes. Why once you are single do you determin that your car doesn't have good enough brakes to stop, in a decent fashion, from 150mph? If you are the type of person to do 150-180 on public roads then you are the type of person that will push the car up to those speeds regardless of power. You can do those speeds in a TT so why not get decent brakes regardless of power?

In my opinion when it comes to brakes it should be determined by driving style and not power. If you are the type of person that knocks lumps out of your car at every opportunity then you definitely need good brakes, if your not then you don't. I just don't see where going single suddely drops the penny for most.

 

I'm genuinely curious about peoples opinions on this so sorry if it sounds like a bit of a rant i just hate that the stopping power of the car always comes last on these forums.

... very good point that man...

One of the first things I did before going single was brakes!

Suspension's another thing... but lets not go there;)

i see what you mean scott. Why does stopping from 70-80-90 mph with you have an NA or TT become suddenly different when you have a single with a billion horespower? you still stopping the same ammount of weight at the same ammount of speed. You only need anything other than jspecs if your doing trackdays or stopping from high speeds frequently.

There is a difference between jspec and uk spec stopping power and i wasnt very confident on my old jspecs from high speed. they seemed to take forever! the uk's are very very good though. Anything more without doing trackdays regular is pointless. L33 - save your money. Put some UK's on.

Exactly.

funny thing is, when you've gone single you actually loose weight, so you'd really need less braking!

(...grabs a beer and waits for comments )

I dont' really get what you mean there.

When cornering do you brake all the way through and only accelerate when you come out of the corner?

I was reffering to the greater speeds in corners, so you would need better brakes to handle the extra strain.

I will freely admit that I am one of those that has the 'must have large brakes' mindset. But have never thought about it until your post.

As for K-Sport they have a massive following in the 200SX world, but they are not as heavy as Supra's. Apex Performance say they get no fade on heavy track days in their V8 Skyline (8pots iirc).

When cornering do you brake all the way through and only accelerate when you come out of the corner?

I only brake before corners, braking during is dangerous. However, in day to day driving or even spirited driving i don't see how a single would make much difference to the braking requirements. Obviously on a track its a different kettle of fish.

I was reffering to the greater speeds in corners, so you would need better brakes to handle the extra strain.

The speed in corner should be the same regardless of power. The corner speed is down to traction, not braking/power etc.

I will freely admit that I am one of those that has the 'must have large brakes' mindset. But have never thought about it until your post.

Totally agree with you, i am exactly the same. It makes no difference whether i have an N/A, a TT or a single though. I want the most suitable stopping power i can get. For most of us on here that is UK specs with good pads and good fluid.