suprafan72 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 OK sitting at idle I think its fouled the damn plugs again. I found my way into one of the graphical display pages. I clicked on setup and some parameters and break point tables came up. I clicked on home and a rev counter and other stuff came up. Apologies for the crap explanation but for some reason this laptop won't do a prtsc which I usually use for screen capture. An interesting note though is that the readout of afr on the home page was 14.7 ish when the afr gauge in the car is saying 11 surely thats not right? I'm gonna have to pull the plugs and clean them again now I think. Or how do you pull the fuse on the fuel pump to turn the car over without fuel? Think we need to have a look at your map to see what's going on here... .I can have a quick look if you like... i know what to look out for on here.. Im sure others with more detailed knowledge would be able to help better... The main thing to look for is as Ryan has posted aboved is the O2 Corrective values and the margin's of correctivness figures for lean and rich... Did you have the car started when you saw 11:5:1 on your afr gauge.. I know when keys are sometimes in ignition your wideband will read... I guess has ryan as posted it will be somewhat more than 5 per cent margin... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Good luck with that DB on our aristo's you have to remove the rear seats to get to the fuel pump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suprafan72 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 You can just turn it off in the aem software but the easiest thing for you to do is in the boot on the left hand side, under the spare wheel there is a connector which goes to the fuel pump. Just disconnect it You could allways just disconnect the battery??:d Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 You could allways just disconnect the battery??:d Hows he going to turn the car over then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suprafan72 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 On the subject of Dan Turner i have spoken to an AEM Representative on the matter of his antics.. there are interested in evidence to pursuee the matter... So the more names the better.. I am more than happy to co-ordinate any activities to get this Cowboy of the streets... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suprafan72 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Hows he going to turn the car over then LOL Smarty Pants... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous brain Posted November 7, 2007 Author Share Posted November 7, 2007 Hmm so how do I post this here map thing then? Its an aristo so I am not getting to the fuel pump plug today would be quicker to whip out the sparks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Might have to zip it then attach it mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous brain Posted November 7, 2007 Author Share Posted November 7, 2007 Attach it to this thread?WORKMAP.V1.19.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 There you go, im burning a DVD right now so can't switch to windows, but Im sure its a messed up as mine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous brain Posted November 7, 2007 Author Share Posted November 7, 2007 dunno if thats it or not but thats what i saved from my aem. Its looking like its time to cycle to work again so I will hit this again tomorrow. Cheers for the help fellas very much appreciated. I'll check in on this thread from work later on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 The loads break points in the map are some what corrupted can be easily fixed but is your car running 2000bhp or something as why is the whole map scaled to 51psi. Anyway the break points problem will be why its rich it thinks your running 51psi at idle. Just upload Roberts map and should be fine then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suprafan72 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 The loads break points in the map are some what corrupted can be easily fixed but is your car running 2000bhp or something as why is the whole map scaled to 51psi. Anyway the break points problem will be why its rich it thinks your running 51psi at idle. Just upload Roberts map and should be fine then And suprise suprise the 02 Corrective feedback is on with similiar lean and rich correctiveness percentage values as your screenshots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLicense Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Blimey, I go out change my rear discs to ones that haven't got mahoosive cracks in them and about 50 posts go by! There's a much, much easier way to disable the fuel pump. Load up the AEM software and connect to the ECU. Then click on Options at the top, and then click on Configure Outputs. The fuel pump runs off Coil 4. So click on the drop down menu next to where it says Output and click on coil 4. You'll see when you click on it that there are certain conditions that need to be achieved for the output to be enabled. For the fuel pump, these are usually set to something like:- Coolant at least -100 deg C Load at least -14.69 psig rpm at least 0 rpm TPS at least 0% Road speed at least 0mph. So you can very quickly turn the pump off by setting something like the road speed to at least say 200mph. You're not going to achieve that so it will never activate the pump. Click OK and your done. Obviously you'll need to change it back when you actually want to drive your car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLicense Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 The wideband you've got, is it an AEM gauge one? If so I can walk you through how to set that up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous brain Posted November 7, 2007 Author Share Posted November 7, 2007 Yeah its the aem wideband. Cheers for the info on how to stop the fuel pump. I can crank it over a bit to clean up the plugs I hope. I'd been told to gap BCPR7ES spark plugs to 0.6 mm or thats what I think I remember the gap was told to me as. Is this right? Also the new ones I put in are 6's not 7's just for the diagnosis. No I am not running 2000 hp in fact I am barely cracking 450. Looking around at some of the selections in there it says my injectors are 1000 cc HKS ones which they aren't. Roberts map is going to be for a T61 tubby running a 0.58 exhaust housing. Mine is a 0.96 housing with a T67 will this make a difference? Also I have a 5 bar map sensor will this make problems. Thing is the car was running OK, rich but OK. Its slowly developed this problem. I am not sure why though. Could I have a secondary problem like duff, exhaust gas recirc valve, idle control valve, throttle butterfly valve? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLicense Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 The best way to clean the plugs up is to whip them out and give the tips 20 or 30 seconds under a blow torch. You can also use break cleaner to help clean them up. 1000cc injectors... hmmmm if that's the case it should be running leaner. But with Mr T at the helm who know's what's been set-up or not. It needs mapping properly. But running Robert's map should get you so that it's up and running. Just don't go making boost or revving too high as that's where it'll give you problems. To set the Wideband, load the software and connect to the ECU. Don't start the car, just have the ignition turned on. Click on the Setup menu. Then click on Sensors|O2 Sensor #1|O2 Sensor #1 Wizard. A window should appear. Select AEM (Gauge) then click OK. Now the AEM can read AFR values for a number of different fuels. Petrol, diesel, Methanol..... so it's worth making sure that the AFR's are set for reading petrol. To do this click on Configure|Units then on the drop down menu for User Selectable Units, pick AFR units. There's a little bug with the AEM software here, so what you need to do is select a different AFR unit first, and then select the one you want. So pick AFR Ethanol and click Apply. Then Select AFR Gasoline and select Apply then OK. This will set it up to read AFR's for petrol. This will set all the settings for the AEM gauge wideband. However a lot of people have noticed a small offset between what the gauge reads and the ECU. This is apparently down to the resistance in the wire from the gauge to the ECU. To correct this, you need to start the engine and then open up a window that lets you see what the O2 value that the ECU is reading is. To see what the O2 value is, if you click the fuel injector icon at the top of the screen. This should bring up your base fuel table and a table called parameters. One of the parameters will be O2#1. Now click on Setup|Sensors|O2 Sensor #1|Options. A window should appear with a number in. You can adjust this until the ECU O2#1 value reads the same as the gauge. You'll also need to change the MAP sensor on Roberts calibration from the 3.5 bar one to the 5 bar one. To do this click Setup|sensors|Manifold Pressure Sensor|MAP Sensor Wizard. On the window that opens up select AEM 5 bar and click OK. If it's still running mega rich (sub 10's) then don't run it for long otherwise you could end up suffering with borewash. If it still just runs real rich, there's a couple of ways of leaning it out to get it so that it'll run. But see how you get on first. Good luck mate! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous brain Posted November 8, 2007 Author Share Posted November 8, 2007 Right so I am better with roberts map than someone tweaking my map and taking out the bad bits? I want to bring the car back to the UK this weekend to leave it there for the winter. I know the car needs looking at on a professional level I just need it home. Problem is home is at least 6 hours on the road. Staying off boost is almost impossible as it goes 0 bar before 3000 rpm. Car seems to run OK everywhere other than idle. Just when I get back I don't just switch the engine straight off I let it cool down at idle. This I think is what is fouling the plugs. By fouling I mean soaking them in fuel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous brain Posted November 8, 2007 Author Share Posted November 8, 2007 Blimey, I go out change my rear discs to ones that haven't got mahoosive cracks in them and about 50 posts go by! There's a much, much easier way to disable the fuel pump. Load up the AEM software and connect to the ECU. Then click on Options at the top, and then click on Configure Outputs. The fuel pump runs off Coil 4. So click on the drop down menu next to where it says Output and click on coil 4. You'll see when you click on it that there are certain conditions that need to be achieved for the output to be enabled. For the fuel pump, these are usually set to something like:- Coolant at least -100 deg C Load at least -14.69 psig rpm at least 0 rpm TPS at least 0% Road speed at least 0mph. So you can very quickly turn the pump off by setting something like the road speed to at least say 200mph. You're not going to achieve that so it will never activate the pump. Click OK and your done. Obviously you'll need to change it back when you actually want to drive your car. the pump is not switching off and the injector pulses are all at 3850 permanently is this right? Right i am seeing an afr of 4 and 8 on my factory 1 and 2 o2 readings with just the key in the ignition. this thing is pumping fuel in all injectors without even the car started. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous brain Posted November 8, 2007 Author Share Posted November 8, 2007 Oh dear I think this ecu is screwed. It won't switch off the fuel pump and when I load Roberts map it won't load right. I can't keep going with this all its doing is constantly pumping more fuel into the cylinders and i have no way of stopping it short of pulling the plug on the fuel pump which is inaccessible. OK maybe roberts map hasn't come over to me properly. The ecu doesn't like roberts map at all. I have now managed to disconnect the fuel pump. I've disabled the injectors for now whilst I poke around in the aem software. It can't be right that the injectors are getting 3850 permanently can it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLicense Posted November 8, 2007 Share Posted November 8, 2007 The injectors will be receiving the pulses all the time, even when the engine isn't turning. But because the timings are pulsed at the right times during the cycle, and the engine isn't turning, they'll never actually open, so don't worry about it. Fuel pump running all the time? Hmmm I'm thinking dodgy 12 volt mod. If you've disabled the injectors then that's good. You're seeing AFR's of 4???? Something's not right there. The wideband won't read that low if the Gasoline AFR units have been selected. When you say that Roberts map won't load right, what problem are you seeing? We'll soon get to the bottom of this mate.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous brain Posted November 8, 2007 Author Share Posted November 8, 2007 The afr reading is in the parameters of the aem software. I am now waiting for a recharge on my battery and perusing supraforums for a base map. When I say roberts map isn't working I mean this... The stuff you told me to do to get the fuel pump to stop isn't there on roberts map. The coil 4 has no information at all entered and won't let me do anything to change it. Neither do any of the other coils etc. I am beginning to think I may jst have blown something a sensor or something like that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez Posted November 8, 2007 Share Posted November 8, 2007 Where are you based? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous brain Posted November 8, 2007 Author Share Posted November 8, 2007 Holland dude Thats the problem I need this car in the UK tomorrow night if at all possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez Posted November 8, 2007 Share Posted November 8, 2007 I have a map on 650cc PE injectors setup to run on stock cams or 264/264 which could get you here if you didnt drive on boost. It has no O2 feedback and is setup with AEM 3.5bar map sensor. When you load any map provided into the ECU you will also need to calibrate the throttle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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