best wet weather tyres

[Scoboblio]

coincidently increasing your chances of a crash(not because you are using the more expensive tyres) but due to your personally believing that if I have spent an extra hundred per corner, I must be able to take this baby further....am I correct?

 

In a word.....no. So if I go over my limit of grip on cheap tyres, I'm more likely to think "wow, that was scary. I'll drive like an OAP from now on", than if I'd done exactly the same thing with decent ones?

[bolarbag]

Cheap tyres are not the best in the wet fact.

 

However the guy asked what type of tyres would be suitable to use in the wet....as were now almost in autumn, I assume for the winter.

 

 

I assume he asks, because he does not know or has experienced the supra in the winter.

 

Therefore instead of saying the obvious, oh goodyears are good, toyo's here e.t.c I aimed to inform his that there are no good tyre setups in the wet/snow for the supra, because it is a front heavy, rear wheel drive car, and therefore save your money on the most expensive tyres for when spring arrives, as he will have to be very careful driving in the wet, hopefully saving yet another supra from destruction this year!

[Ian C]

How do you find the P0's wear Ian?

 

Rears about twice as fast as the fronts especially with Mr T67 on board 10,000 miles for the rears, between 15 and 20k for the fronts. At 28psi on the rear the centre band still wears out about 2mm before the inner and outer edges. At 34psi at the front the wear is even across the tyre.

 

Wet weather grip is excellent, although I run RLTC to make the car fun to drive, I can hear it cutting in the wet and always back off the throttle to a point where it isn't, and the acceleration rate is, while of course much lower than in the dry, still surprisingly rapid.

 

-Ian

[Guest Chumpalot]

Toyos or Eagles are going to be better than Nankangs, Avons and other cheaper brands in both dry and wet conditions.

 

FACT.

[Ian C]

 

Therefore instead of saying the obvious, oh goodyears are good, toyo's here e.t.c I aimed to inform his that there are no good tyre setups in the wet/snow for the supra, because it is a front heavy, rear wheel drive car, and therefore save your money on the most expensive tyres for when spring arrives, as he will have to be very careful driving in the wet, hopefully saving yet another supra from destruction this year!

 

Well that's more understandable but I'd still rather have good tyres than crap ones, I mean what if a kid walked out in front of you or something.

 

-Ian

[Scoboblio]

I can (if I squint my eyes really hard and turn all known logic onto it's head) see what you mean.... but sorry that's just ridiculous. Encouraging someone to fit ditch finder tyres onto their supra to "save them" is laughable.

[Guest Chumpalot]

As Ian said, what happens when the unexpected comes along. Will those cheaper tyres do as good a job of saving you?

 

Probably not.

[bolarbag]

I wasn't comparing F1's to F1 tyres, just explaining that the quality of tyre makes a difference, especially in the wet.

 

As for that argument, how does it bare any relevance to real driving conditions?

 

imho, unless there is a real need to have better quality wet weather tyres...i.e. you have booked a trip to the nurburg ring and it is ineveitable that it is going to rain, then its not worth the cash.

 

I mean what if a kid walked out in front of you or something.

 

I'm sorry mate, thats another cheap sales tactic. That argument applies to almost every modification made...why buy ap racing when you can buy project mu brakes, that stop you that little bit faster, they only cost an extra two months pay packet:innocent:

[Gaz6002]

As for that argument, how does it bare any relevance to real driving conditions?

 

imho, unless there is a real need to have better quality wet weather tyres...i.e. you have booked a trip to the nurburg ring and it is ineveitable that it is going to rain, then its not worth the cash.

 

 

WHAT?! That is completely irrational mate. Have you ever driven a trackday in the wet? On good tyres or otherwise?

 

I didn't make the comparisson between F1 tyres and Goodyears, just made the point that they use special wet weather tyres rather than slicks in the wet for a REASON. They are better.

[Ian C]

I'm sorry mate, thats another cheap sales tactic. That argument applies to almost every modification made...why buy ap racing when you can buy project mu brakes, that stop you that little bit faster, they only cost an extra two months pay packet:innocent:

 

Aha, Do they? Do those bigger brakes stop you faster? Have you thought this line of argument through, Mr Lawyer? Please enlighten me how, when even J-spec brakes can lock up the wheels of a Supra when emergency stopping from 40mph, a bigger brake caliper can physically generate more grip from the tyres?

 

Nope, at those speeds under emergency stop conditions, there is one and only one thing that can significantly affect the stopping distance. Can you guess what it is?

 

-Ian

[Guest Chumpalot]

 

Nope, at those speeds under emergency stop conditions, there is one and only one thing that can significantly affect the stopping distance. Can you guess what it is?

 

-Ian

 

Front bumper? Ya know, airflow and all that...?

 

[kieren1234]

Aha, Do they? Do those bigger brakes stop you faster? Have you thought this line of argument through, Mr Lawyer? Please enlighten me how, when even J-spec brakes can lock up the wheels of a Supra when emergency stopping from 40mph, a bigger brake caliper can physically generate more grip from the tyres?

 

Nope, at those speeds under emergency stop conditions, there is one and only one thing that can significantly affect the stopping distance. Can you guess what it is?

 

-Ian

 

TYRES

[kieren1234]

Front bumper? Ya know, airflow and all that...?

 

 

LOL, imagine if THAT kid ran out in front of you

[bolarbag]

Oh you got me partner...

 

I was stating that all arguments for 'performance' products can be justified with the 'what if quote'.

 

If you are driving at 30mph (which I assume you would be for any sort of kid to be near the given road) then the differences would be very minimal.

 

My reasoning...?

 

These tyres would not be allowed on the market...you guys just dont want to admit, that you are paying the big bucks for the brand name, and the piece of mind that these tyres will help you in the wet.

 

I'm all for edging out that little bit of performance from tyres in the dry, but with the supra in the wet, its not worth the risk.

 

Agreed!? Or court adjourned;)

[Guest Chumpalot]

I say we have a recess. I'm not convinced at all.

[Scoboblio]

Agreed!?

 

Nope. When I first took delivery of my car, it had stupidly cheap tyres. The car was rubbish in the wet - not just bad, but awful, twitchy, slippery, and the slightest amount of right foot (say, the amount you'd use everyday) when coming off a roundabout could cause problems. I was outrun by family hatchbacks when setting off from traffic lights because my tyres couldn't handle even what turbo no1 was offering. BTW these were brand new - not part worns or remoulds. I changed to F1's and the difference was amazing - confident, stable handling in almost all conditions, and I could drive briskly and normally (as I would in any other car).

[bolarbag]

Right to settle an argument, does no one have a test of two tyres, one cheapo, the other a performance tyre, in a supra, with emergency braking at 30mph?

 

Or any rear wheel drive car? I'd be surprised if the differences where over 10 or so feet

[Hermit]

The only logic I can see behind buying a cheaper tyre is that it might lose traction more gradually than a softer, grippier tyre, which would make it safer to test the limits of traction, although the limit would obviously be lower. (Note that I said cheaper rather than cheapest!!!) But I'm not at all sure that applies in the wet - you'd be far better off with a good tyre on a narrower wheel.

[Guest Chumpalot]

Was trying to think of an example, and the closest I could think of was computer parts. Bear with me here....

 

You can purchase normal memory, there's all sorts available, but most consumers and businesses will go with the generic stuff. It does what it says on the tin, performs as it should and works fine. However, try and squeeze some more out of it (whether it's through overclocking or whatever, and it'll fall over).

 

Or buy performance memory. OCZ stuff for example, or maybe memory with heatsinks on them to keep them cooler. Yeah it costs more but the markup reflects the extra development that has gone into making the stuff. It performs better than the generic crap too, just as you'd expect it to for the extra cost.

 

Lame example perhaps, but as with most things, you tend to get what you pay for. I for one believe this is indeed the case with tyres. I had Nankangs on my old corsa (not the fastest of machines I know) and they were absolute tripe. Front stepped out all the time, pretty poor performance. I got some Toyos on there and had no more issues, I was driving it the same I always did, hell in a 1.2 SXI your life is never really in danger is it?

 

I can see where you're trying to come from, but only just. What if we were arguing about something we had no care for maybe? TVs for example, or mobile phones perhaps? If they make and receive calls and texts then that's good enough for me right?

[Ian C]

 

These tyres would not be allowed on the market...

 

 

That argument makes no sense, it's a statement unsupported by anything else you posted up, can you clarify?!

 

you guys just dont want to admit, that you are paying the big bucks for the brand name, and the piece of mind that these tyres will help you in the wet.

 

 

You are saying I've just been suckered in simply by a big brand name?! I actually take that quite personally as an insult!

[Guest Chumpalot]

The only logic I can see behind buying a cheaper tyre is that it might lose traction more gradually than a softer, grippier tyre, which would make it safer to test the limits of traction, although the limit would obviously be lower. (Note that I said cheaper rather than cheapest!!!) But I'm not at all sure that applies in the wet - you'd be far better off with a good tyre on a narrower wheel.

 

I would rather not lose traction at all in the first place. As I'm sure most others would also.

[Gaz6002]

Right to settle an argument, does no one have a test of two tyres, one cheapo, the other a performance tyre, in a supra, with emergency braking at 30mph?

 

Or any rear wheel drive car? I'd be surprised if the differences where over 10 or so feet

 

If someone wants to buy me some crap tyres i'll happily do this test and document the results on video.

 

Then proceed to ruin the crap ones and put my F1's back on again

[Ian C]

Look I'll tell you what, you buy cheap tyres for wet weather and go on thinking, for some reason, I really can't imagine why, that Supras are poor handling in the wet, and we'll stick with our flashy brand name tyres that somehow make us at risk of crashing unexpectedly by virtue of gripping more How's that sound.

 

Next up, using red diesel so that you aren't tempted to go past 4000rpm and wear your engine out. Discuss.

 

-Ian

[Guest Chumpalot]

I say BMW, Toyota and the like just stop making RWD cars....

[Scoboblio]

Next up, using red diesel so that you aren't tempted to go past 4000rpm and wear your engine out. Discuss.

 

Perfectly summed up there.