colsoop Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 I have read all the threads and i see opinions from customers (who i believe have a right to aire their opinions good or bad) There have been a few allegations at Dan Turners door, but i haven't seen any direct bad mouthing of AEM or any of their products. I can't see them standing a chance if it went to court, it is a blatant attempt to intimidate and bully the club. I can't for the life of me understand why they think this is a good way to go. All it has done is closed ranks and actually made AEM look bad and lose a large potentioal customer base. When an allegation is made against you, step up to the plate and defend yourself, explain why you did what you did. Don't hide away behind a lawyer or a threat of legal action because in my view it marks you down as guilty (even if you aren't). Perhaps saving all the threads in question would be good just in case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branners Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 Are we not to discuss the reliability of ANY AEM products or could we still potentially discuss the reliability of something like their CDI ignition systems? Their ECU and their CDI system are two things I was considering purchasing but I may just stick with the DLI and EMU if I can't bug people here for reliability info on AEM products.. I wouldnt want people to stop discussing AEM products for fear of comeback. I think if there are problems with the AEM and those making the posts have direct evidence of those problems then it needs ot be discussed. It does need that level of proof though as AEM (through their European distributor) are obviously concerned about some discussions that have been had. JB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarkey Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 can't for the life of me understand why they think this is a good way to go. Simple. Paul Evans & Miami-GT (BEFORE ANDY HANNAH OWNED IT) used to threaten the club with legal action all the time - when things weren't going his way. He got away with that kind of bullying then - Dan thinks he can do the same now. But this time, I think the mods are getting wise and are sick & tired of the "Ye Olde" Legal action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branners Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 it is worth saying that if AEM themselves wish to discuss any of the statements made about their hardware then they are free to do so. They must be reading the forum as they asked Dan to sort it out.... JB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 it is worth saying that if AEM themselves wish to discuss any of the statements made about their hardware then they are free to do so. They must be reading the forum as they asked Dan to sort it out.... JB You appear to be assuming than Dan is telling the truth and is indeed acting on behalf of AEM. I doubt that, unless the mods know something we don't? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mawby Posted July 11, 2007 Author Share Posted July 11, 2007 We know that Dan Tuner has contacted us both via telephone and email to complain about certain posts on this forum. (If you're reading this Dan, I am still waiting for you to reply to my email asking for details of which posts you object to. Without that list I cannot take any steps to rectify the problem) I would paste the email here but I'd hate for anyone to start complaining about copyright issues, so here is my version of it. Dan claims to represent AEM, and that AEM originally contacted him to notify him of comments made on our site. He claims some of the comments made are intentionally trying to steer people away from AEM products. He claims that AEM have reported cancelled orders as a result of our site, and he claims that AEM consider this a Loss of Business and could seek legal action against us as a result. He blames the moderators for not acting on these comments. He requests we that we remove any such posts and post up warning our members not to make accusations. (Hence this thread) Finally he claims there is no need for him to defend himself on our site. So there you have it. Given the legal implications of somone claiming to represent a major company like AEM when they don't - we have to assume that Dans claims to represent AEM regarding this matter are accurate. We have not made any attempts yet to verify this though. We will be interested to here what response Phoenix-One gets from AEM, and if there are doubts over the validity of Dans claims then we shall consider what options to take next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 I think it's just empty threats in an attempt by him to get the threads bashing him to be removed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muffleman Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 He claims that AEM have reported cancelled orders as a result of our site, Don't think that any cancelled orders will be as a result of threads discussing the AEM hardware, from discussions had I believe that the AEM is still viewed highly and will still be purchased - albeit I suspect not from Dan Turner, Jikan, Dan Turner Engineering, Jakan, Merlin Motorsport, Advanced Motorsport Engineering or any other business entity related to Dan Turner. Simply down to the way he has handled himself on this forum. Case in point, I bought an AEM ems from Miami-GT recently, including AEM IAT and AEM MAP sensor. Therefore, AEM business is NOT at risk. I suspect Dan's might be though. I will continue to use AEM equipment as I believe it to be excellent in terms of performance, features, value and function. If AEM are concerned then I feel they should make a post here on the forum to dispel any myths and allay our fears, and maybe they need to look for an alternative European Representative ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 AEM must be really struggling if they are complaining about 1 or 2 people changing their minds based on the information available on here. All advice on the forum (even about tyre choice) is given by members with the best of intentions to other members. If AEM really do care about their perceived lake of quality control that's blighted particularly the CDI system then I'd welcome their input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guigsy Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 fu*k me. If customer opinion isnt allowed anywhere any more watchdog must be fu*ked! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shadowake Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 fu*k me. If customer opinion isnt allowed anywhere any more watchdog must be fu*ked! Here, here. Customers are more than welcome to their opinions, and all a forum ever is at the end of the day is opinions. A legal case based on opinions has about as much strength as a nat with an extreemly bad cold. Although im sure a note at the bottom of the forum stating something like the below might help in future: "All individual posts on this forum are the opinions of their respective owners and are in no way the opinions of the site owners or moderators" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 I've just spoken to AEM, and waiting to hear back from them... will post updates as they come in... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 I've just spoken to AEM, and waiting to hear back from them... will post updates as they come in... Are they mutes or do they need to consult their legal team before they say anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil tt Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 Are they mutes or do they need to consult their legal team before they say anything? Not sure, from what the woman said when I spoke to her on the phone, she said she would be speaking to the Sales Manager. She also requested an email. I've requested information with regards to who is an authorised DISTRIBUTOR and who is authorised to speak on behalf of AEM. I do have a name, number and email address, which I've made available to the mods, but I'd rather not put it up publically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 I represent AEM in Europe through APP and Ji-kan. Anyone who wishes to contact me can call 01327 340123 or 01908 648955 regards Dan Turner How about just being public and answering the questions that have already been posed?, provided of course the questions are reasonable. which majority of them are. . Still no answer... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARTIN R Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 customer feedback good or bad is part and parcel of running a business,maybe packing up is advisable. I am sure the company I work for would get far suing our customers if they bound about allegations of poor service / products I think more time and energy should go into resolving and commuincating rather than suing. As Ian said P S;) This is my opinion and is not in anyway endorsed by our great club Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vvteye Posted July 11, 2007 Share Posted July 11, 2007 No but I could get one if you you say any naughty things about me How much is this including shipping please Nic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted July 12, 2007 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Okay, I now have an OFFICIAL comment from AEM. My original assumption was indeed correct in that it was Dan Turner making the legal threat and NOT AEM. Please don't confuse this with the 'Is he a good mapper / bad mapper thread. It is purely based on the information provide regarding the threat of legal action. Their view is that Dan Turner is an authorised tuner and has had good feedback (This is not open to debate on this thread I feel, save it for the other threads). I have been in contact with AEM, who were NOT aware of the legal action threatened by Dan Turner. They infact welcome comments regarding the AEM unit, and have said they will post up a comment. Here is the AEM email and comments in a completely uneditted form. Gavan, My name is Jeremy Barras from AEM (really!). I have reviewed the forum thread you have included. I presume that you are the "JustGav" on the thread. Dan Turner is an approved AEM Tuner in the UK, who is a part owner in Jikan, who is also a customer of ours. He is not an employee of AEM. Your email is the first information we have received concerning this issue. There have been no discussions previously concerning the forum comments, which we were actually not aware of. There has also obviously been no threat of legal actions or the like therefore. If I understand this all correctly, this is a mapping issue, not an equipment issue, so I am not really qualified to comment from a distance on what happened with the vehicles in question. In none of the threads did I find a reference to a faulty ECU contributing to this issue. What sort of pistons did the car in question have? Stock? As you are I am sure well aware, we do sell a large number of EMSs' for the Supra applications, and this for a number of years very successfully. Generally the market response has been very good and feedback very positive. Certainly if any users are having issues with the EMS, we do expect them to bring this to our attention and to discuss it with us in forums. That is why, if you go to the AEM website, you have the opportunity to join in any number of different electronics forums which we post and moderate to exchange views and experiences, and to share solutions. We even have a specific Supra forum. Worth a visit perhaps and an ideal place for you to discuss any issues with the EMS you feel might be warranted! Dan Turner, is in our opinion, a talented and knowledgeable tuner of our EMS. He has been working with it for some years now, and we have generally always heard positive feedback from satisfied customers. We do have other qualified tuners we can recommend, and if you can let me know where you are located, we can recommend the one closest to you. If you want us to contribute to your forum thread on this subject, we are of course happy to do this, provided of course it does not turn into a full time job! Hope this clarifies everything, and no, we did not consult our attorney before writing this! best regards Jeremy I especially like the last comment, shows they do have a sense of humour *grin* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted July 12, 2007 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Good work Gav. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Posted July 12, 2007 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Makes Dan Turner look a bit of a bullshiting knob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted July 12, 2007 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Yep, well done Gav. So somebody was talking a load of b******s then! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted July 12, 2007 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Good work Gav. Cheers dude.. I will state clearly here, that my motive for doing all this work was not one against Dan's tuning ability, but simply that he threatened the club. I didn't believe for one minute an american company such as AEM would simply pull this kind of stunt. I've worked with plenty american companies, and smaller ones such as AEM would regard the UK as an emerging market, while I realize some people might not use the AEM products due to technical preferences, it would have been a shame for one person to muddy the waters with regards a unit which would be suitable or preferrential for some people. I have also made the email addresses and the contact details for the people at AEM available to the mods for them to carry on this possible new relationship with AEM. PS : Sorry about the big words, having to use them a lot at work now *grin* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted July 12, 2007 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Are they mutes or do they need to consult their legal team before they say anything? I believe they put a special line for you in the email *grin* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mawby Posted July 12, 2007 Author Share Posted July 12, 2007 Well done Gav. Your support regarding this matter is greatly appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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