Suprash Posted June 7, 2007 Share Posted June 7, 2007 Im getting smoke on lift off, very blue, so I know its oil, thing is this smoke is getting worse. Its bad enough now that when on over run I can actually see the smoke trailing up in the air to around the height of my spoiler in the rear view mirror..... On full boost she is fine, no smoke, nothing, still pulls nice and hard, but then as soon as I stop with WOT, and let her slow down on over run, not so much at the top of the rev range but more when the revs start running down at the bottom, then comes the smoke... I have been told this is my oil scrapper rings, due to borewash... Is this definitely correct, if so what options do I have to srt this issue........? As far as I know I have two options: 1) Get engine striped down, new oil scrapper rings, cyclinders re-bored to get correct fitmant of new rings. 2) Get bottom end re-built with new rings, using short block from the US, plus other bits..... Now option 2 works out very expensive, option 1 hasnt actually been giving to me but Im guessing it would work as long as you got everything bored correctly after fitting the new rings.... But anyway, as I said, I need confirmation on what optopns I have available to me and costs ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheefa Posted June 7, 2007 Share Posted June 7, 2007 Hmmm, very similar if not the SAME as my recent situation Ash. I took was experiencing blue smoke, quite significant puffs, on the overrun and very rarely if at all IIRC on boost. This led me to believe that it 'could' be the Valve Stem Seals. Then it also started doing it under boost but was a combination of white and blue smoke as the turbo housing had cracked and was leaking in coolant. Got the Turbos swapped over and the VSOS replaced and now there's not a hint of smoke and I'm full BPU. At least it's not the piston rings as it'd do it all the time right? Oil scrapper rings - are they the same as the Oil Control rings as yes, that's probably a likely cause, especially if it does do it all the time on overrun. If it doesn't, it could be just one of the rings is leaky. Good luck mate. I'd suggest going for option 1 tbh, but would recommend you check out the VSOS first. This crap talk about the only indication about the sign of their wear being on startup from cold releasing a puff of blue is rubbish - it doesn't work like that all the time! Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suprash Posted June 7, 2007 Author Share Posted June 7, 2007 I have been told stem seals as well, but due to the fact I know she was heavily over fueled at one point, Im being told borewash, and the oil rings, whetjer their the same as oil control rings, I dunno, probably are I would have thought........ And I have brand new Hybrids from Envy, so Im counting them out....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheefa Posted June 7, 2007 Share Posted June 7, 2007 I don't know then Ash. I really don't think there's a definite test for the VSOS to check they're faulty or not. However, replacing them is easy enough if you're good with a spanner I'm told by using T-Licenses guide and only costs circa £250 for parts. May be a good starting point as at least it'd rule them out, and replacing them now would save doing so in the future! Of course, you could go with Option 1 and have the head and stem seals done too to hopefully save a bit on labour. Tough call mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted June 7, 2007 Share Posted June 7, 2007 It's stem seals, it smoked when it was here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
letmeshowyou Posted June 7, 2007 Share Posted June 7, 2007 get a leak down test done, that should give you a good pointer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheefa Posted June 7, 2007 Share Posted June 7, 2007 get a leak down test done, that should give you a good pointer Wrong Adi. I had a leakdown and compression test done and it doesn't pick up VSOS IIRC OR faulty Oil Control Rings. My tests came back as perfect but of course the problem was still there. I'm going with Chris on this Ash as previously suggested. I'd replace those first mate and take it from there. I just got mine done at Turbofit, head off job though including new head gasket etc, as well as many other bits and bobs for a shade over £1100. Not a bad price, but of course a LOT cheaper if you can do it yourself using the rope trick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suprash Posted June 7, 2007 Author Share Posted June 7, 2007 Sod doing it myself mate £1100 I can live with, better then the 2-4k for oil rings...... Chris, if your stem seals are gone, would she smoke heavily on over run ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted June 7, 2007 Share Posted June 7, 2007 Quite probably, yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suprash Posted June 7, 2007 Author Share Posted June 7, 2007 Its just that in all the years I have been on here and read about symptons of stem seals, no one has ever mentioned about gettting smoke on over run.............. What about the fact that I know she has been heavily over-fueled and that Thor turned it down........ How can you tell if you have borewash....? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted June 7, 2007 Share Posted June 7, 2007 Are you sure you don't have the boot open slightly?? Could be from having a cig in the back *grin* *cough* hotbox *cough* You will have to get a boroscope to examine the bores to be sure. Certainly would save you taking the head off initially. Valve stem seals would be a good place to start though, what sort of mileage you done? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheefa Posted June 7, 2007 Share Posted June 7, 2007 Its just that in all the years I have been on here and read about symptons of stem seals, no one has ever mentioned about gettting smoke on over run.............. What about the fact that I know she has been heavily over-fueled and that Thor turned it down........ How can you tell if you have borewash....? Ash, CLEARLY you haven't read my many posts over the last 3 months mate! Put SMOKE in the search and threads started by SHEEFA!! http://www.mkivsupra.net/vbb/showthread.php?t=109004 That's the trouble. There is no definite wa to determine VSOS are the cause of smoke other tha replacing them it seems. I DID have smoke on overrun and qitea lot of Blue to be honest. Sometimes though it would go away. On renewing the VSOS Greg @ Turbofit found that is was only 1 of the 12/16 (can't remember that had completely disintegrated and was letting oil past - how annoying! Replaced them all and all is cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Need4Speed Posted June 7, 2007 Share Posted June 7, 2007 Sounds like valve stem oil seals to me - always encouraging to find I diagnosed the same as Chris Wilson! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suprash Posted June 7, 2007 Author Share Posted June 7, 2007 Ash, CLEARLY you haven't read my many posts over the last 3 months mate! Put SMOKE in the search and threads started by SHEEFA!! http://www.mkivsupra.net/vbb/showthread.php?t=109004 That's the trouble. There is no definite wa to determine VSOS are the cause of smoke other tha replacing them it seems. I DID have smoke on overrun and qitea lot of Blue to be honest. Sometimes though it would go away. On renewing the VSOS Greg @ Turbofit found that is was only 1 of the 12/16 (can't remember that had completely disintegrated and was letting oil past - how annoying! Replaced them all and all is cool. Dude, havent been on much recently until now......so not really seen any of your threads. Interesting read though, I always thought stem seals would smoke on start up, but it seems different seals can cause different symptons..... Lucky my car is off to TF in a weeks time..... Is yours all done now ? No issues, how is she ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
letmeshowyou Posted June 7, 2007 Share Posted June 7, 2007 Wrong Adi. I had a leakdown and compression test done and it doesn't pick up VSOS IIRC OR faulty Oil Control Rings. My tests came back as perfect but of course the problem was still there. so you had worn oil control rings and this wasn't picked up by a leakdown test? I'm confused now, I thought you had stem seals done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheefa Posted June 7, 2007 Share Posted June 7, 2007 so you had worn oil control rings and this wasn't picked up by a leakdown test? I'm confused now, I thought you had stem seals done! Yes mate had the VSOS done, and thought it could also be the Oil Control Rings causing smoke but it wasn't. I'm just saying the test won't pick this up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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