Ian C Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by mcanny Why take it up with me? Easy tiger You said that individual posts should be removed rather than whole threads, but SoonHas said that he was worried about individual posts being removed, not whole threads. Just making a point, hence my "silver bullet" reference and cheesy grin smiley. I'm indicating with that succint example that people's requirements and expectations are going to differ. -Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by Keith C "Might" have. To "some". Not "would" to "most", but "might" to "some". That's the crux. The moderators are here to serve the majority that want an informative, useful BBS where they can find out what to do, where to do it and who else they can meet. They don't want a vitriolic flame-fest of insults and aggression. They want a peaceful life with a bit of fun. maybe, but if the majority didn't want this thread then it would follow that there must have been a larger number of members complaining about the thread than were actually posting in it for it to have been closed.....was that the case? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mawby Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by Scooter and ended up by posting the following "I'm going to use this one again. Click the "Register" button up top, then look for the paragraph that starts "We reserve the right to" Which says to me 'we can do as we please' It also says we wont enter into a discussion about it, yet we are, which shows we don't just do as we please but try to do what we believe is best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by Scooter maybe, but if the majority didn't want this thread then it would follow that there must have been a larger number of members complaining about the thread than were actually posting in it for it to have been closed.....was that the case? read my above post. I am sure Keith never intended to piss anyone off, more likely he was trying to look after the long term good of the Supra BBS. Falling out with the GTR boys isn't gonna help the BBS in anyway. Keith may have been wrong, and I am not saying he is, but it's his call as a Moderator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by Terry S Guys you really must understand that the moderators were selected and appointed to protect the well being of the BBS. You may not always agree with them but they are only doing what they believe is best for the BBS. It is a thankless task believe me. point taken, i'll shut up now:D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mawby Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by Scooter maybe, but if the majority didn't want this thread then it would follow that there must have been a larger number of members complaining about the thread than were actually posting in it for it to have been closed.....was that the case? Now lets not be silly. Most people don't like speed cameras, but how many people have actually lobbied their local councilors to get them removed? However, when you get caught by one you'll go to the ends of the earth to proclaim your innocense and stop the points going on your license. Same applies here, people speak the loudest when they take something personally, not when they dislike a thread but can't be bothered to do anything about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by Roy Ian, just my uneducated wild guess between 3-5 over vs every 1 (maybe!) that is under modded ? how's that for a ball-park figure ? BTW - what great socio/psychological experiment are you hoping to embark upon by keeping mum till people speculate ? just curious as to your view on effifacy (sp.) regarding this ? Oooh, I actually meant, "how many threads do you perceive we've removed in the last year", not the more nebulous "how many threads have we overmodded". Not sure what to make of your second paragraph. Here is me, trying to get all the facts and viewpoints together before spouting forth and now that's the wrong thing to do?! Play fair It's no great experiment, simply if people's perceptions are that we've murdered x threads and it's too much, and we have in fact murdered x threads or even more than that, then we have to consider we are sticking the knife in too much too early. If you think we've done y threads and that's more than we have done then the perception is we are overmoderating when in fact we aren't, so there is something up with the perception and that's what needs to be addressed. However, if I blart out our figures first, the whole thing is up the swannee as people's perceptions will immediatly be changed by knowing the actual amounts. So bear with me. You may be suprised one way or the other with the actual amounts compared to your perceptions. This isn't just you btw, I'm asking anyone - Scooter, Mcanny, Stealth, anyone else who isn't a moderator. I'm actually trying to move forward with this rather than have another 'nazi moderator' bitch thread... -Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by mawby Excuse me! I've been sat here for the last few hours trying to answer everyones questions as best I can. If that's your attitude then I wont bother anymore. It's not *attitude* it's an opinion based on this and previous threads, I appreciate the input from those upstairs at times and I'm all for a balanced chat about things which is what I'm having here. We obviously have a large group of people here and opinions vary, in the past I've requested moderator input and the removal / editing of threads I've started myself in order to remove unwanted content that doesn't add any real value to the thread or is posted to create conflict - I'm pleased to have mods there to do this *when requested*. Originally posted by Keith C "Might" have. To "some". Not "would" to "most", but "might" to "some". That's the crux. The moderators are here to serve the majority that want an informative, useful BBS where they can find out what to do, where to do it and who else they can meet. They don't want a vitriolic flame-fest of insults and aggression. They want a peaceful life with a bit of fun. So it was wrong of me to post a thread about a very interesting Skyline that is being imported and plans to be in TOTB4 in the Chit Chat section? Did I post "a vitriolic flame-fest of insults and aggression" or did I put up a post regarding a Skyline that I like? Should *my* post have been deleted or should the "a vitriolic flame-fest of insults and aggression" have been edited and the original post and 'acceptable' replies retained with a note to say what had been done? I wasn't aware that we could only post threads that appeal to the majority, apologies for missing this when I signed up, I thought I was posting in Chit Chat where "almost anything goes!" Anyway my thread is gone, it won't be coming back, nothing will change, you have your thoughts and you seem to stick to them regardless of the member input, I'll live with it, I have no choice in the matter do I Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkyJawa Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 http://instagiber.net/smiliesdotcom/cwm/3dlil/sleep.gifhttp://instagiber.net/smiliesdotcom/contrib/drowned/argue.gif http://instagiber.net/smiliesdotcom/contrib/edoom/sleeping.gif http://instagiber.net/smiliesdotcom/cwm/3dlil/lurk.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by SkyJawa http://instagiber.net/smiliesdotcom/cwm/3dlil/sleep.gifhttp://instagiber.net/smiliesdotcom/contrib/drowned/argue.gif http://instagiber.net/smiliesdotcom/contrib/edoom/sleeping.gif http://instagiber.net/smiliesdotcom/cwm/3dlil/lurk.gif If you don't like the content don't click the link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith C Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by mcanny So it was wrong of me to post a thread about a very interesting Skyline that is being imported and plans to be in TOTB4 in the Chit Chat section? Given that the first post in the thread was: Originally posted by mcanny (link to GTR BBS) Time to throw more money around chaps! With a thread subject of: TOTB4 - Skylines already on order then it's blatently obvious that you were stirring for a reaction. Which you got. It was then removed, and now you're complaining that your big spoon was taken away. Originally posted by mcanny should the "a vitriolic flame-fest of insults and aggression" have been edited and the original post and 'acceptable' replies retained with a note to say what had been done? You're assuming that your post is what's considered acceptable. Originally posted by mcanny Anyway my thread is gone, it won't be coming back, nothing will change, you have your thoughts and you seem to stick to them regardless of the member input, I'll live with it, I have no choice in the matter do I? Oh I listen to member input. Doesn't mean that it's right though, and that I have to follow what it says. I've been moderating this BBS a lot longer than you've been here, and it's not the only one I mod. I know through personal experience how things work on BBS's, and once you've been here a bit longer so will you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkyJawa Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by mcanny If you don't like the content don't click the link Watch it or I'll report you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by Keith C Given that the first post in the thread was: "Time to throw more money around chaps!" With a thread subject of: TOTB4 - Skylines already on order then it's blatently obvious that you were stirring for a reaction. Which you got. It was then removed, and now you're complaining that your big spoon was taken away. A member of the Skyline forum has ordered a Skyline from Japan - hence "Skylines already on order" (for TOTB). My comment re throwing money around was intended as a tongue in cheek prompt for the Supra chaps who were planning to be in TOTB4 to do more mods to compete with a proven big power Skyline. I fail to see how that would cause an issue and judging by the lack of nasty replies aimed at me by Skyline owners they don't seem to have got the wrong end of the stick. You're assuming that your post is what's considered acceptable. I'm asking what is considered acceptable and where the guidelines are for an "almost anything goes" section. Oh I listen to member input. Doesn't mean that it's right though, and that I have to follow what it says. I've been moderating this BBS a lot longer than you've been here, and it's not the only one I mod. I know through personal experience how things work on BBS's, and once you've been here a bit longer so will you. Don't patronise me Keith, I have been moderating and taking part in forums since the early to mid 90's, my arrival at mkivsupra.net doesn't signal my entry into the dazzling world of the internet. Other forums I'm involved with have a far more democratic approach to things, others set out guidelines and enforce them strongly, others are a free for all Ive experienced a lot more than you give me credit for. But I'll take your patronising comments and sit silent like a good little boy until I've been around long enough to be able to offer my input, afterall I'm just a newbie and know nothing about my own opinions and experience. Let me know when I'm allowed to speak again please teacher. Edited to add "Time to throw more money around chaps!" quote to your quote as it was missed off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewis Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 EDIT - forget it - not worth the ball-ache Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith C Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by mcanny Don't patronise me Keith, I have been moderating and taking part in forums since the early to mid 90's, my arrival at mkivsupra.net doesn't signal my entry into the dazzling world of the internet. Other forums I'm involved with have a far more democratic approach to things, others set out guidelines and enforce them strongly, others are a free for all Ive experienced a lot more than you give me credit for. In that case your attitude goes from odd to bewildering. I can only assume that you feel you have a right to not merely use the BBS, but decide how it's run to suit your own preferences. You must know how irritating it is to constantly have someone publicly questioning your every action when it comes to moderation, and yet it seems to be something you're dead set on doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Deleted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mawby Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 EDIT - Obviously people don't value their opinions that highly if they keep editing them to remove them, which does suggest this whole thread has been blown out of proportion just for the sake of it. That's a shame given it started off very civilised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by mawby EDIT - Obviously people don't value their opinions that highly if they keep editing them to remove them, which does suggest this whole thread has been blown out of proportion just for the sake of it. That's a shame given it started off very civilised. Or that people realise that their opinion simply falls on deaf ears and that adding input is merely a waste of time. Hometime. (Edited to correct poor spelling) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewis Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by mawby EDIT - Obviously people don't value their opinions that highly if they keep editing them to remove them, which does suggest this whole thread has been blown out of proportion just for the sake of it. That's a shame given it started off very civilised. It isn't that I don't value my opinion, I just think there is a time and a place and this isn't it, hence I removed my scathing assessment. I shall resubmit it, but to the proper people, instead of doing it in public where it is then percieved to be a public attack which then loses all validity. I don't think opinion can be blown out of proportion? 100% Agree, it was very civilised, perhaps someone should look at which point it all went pete tong. Therein lies the solution. Anyway, from my point of view this thread is now a dodo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith C Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 The point is that I will take criticism all day long - provided it's private, constructive criticism. It's the public aspect of threads like these that removes any value they might have. If you have a disagreement with a neighbour, do you invite them round for a drink and try to sort it out in private, or do you shout through the letterboxes of everyone elses houses about what an arsehole he is, or maybe put a giant sign in your front garden? Next time you (or anyone else) has a problem, PM me *first*. I don't hold grudges, and will listen objectively. Aside from anything, you can ask me for an explanation as to why I did something which I *will* give. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian R Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by Keith C In that case your attitude goes from odd to bewildering. I can only assume that you feel you have a right to not merely use the BBS, but decide how it's run to suit your own preferences. You must know how irritating it is to constantly have someone publicly questioning your every action when it comes to moderation, and yet it seems to be something you're dead set on doing. Surely comments like this shouldn't be made by a mod if you look at this Entry: moderate Function: adjective Definition: temperate Synonyms: abstinent, balanced, bearable, calm, careful, cautious, compromising, conservative, considerate, considered, controlled, cool, deliberate, disciplined, dispassionate, equable, even, gentle, impartial, inconsiderable, inexpensive, judicious, limited, low-key, measured, middle-of-the-road, midway, mild, modest, monotonous, neutral, nonpartisan, not excessive, pacific, peaceable, pleasant, reasonable, reserved, restrained, sober, soft, steady, straight, tame, tolerable, tolerant, tranquil, untroubled Source: Roget's New Millennium™ Thesaurus, First Edition (v 1.0.5) Copyright © 2004 by Lexico Publishing Group, LLC. All rights reserved. i'm not posting this to stir up trouble just simply feel some people may be able to take stock and realise what good looks like Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 6? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by Ian C Oooh, I actually meant, "how many threads do you perceive we've removed in the last year", not the more nebulous "how many threads have we overmodded". Not sure what to make of your second paragraph. Here is me, trying to get all the facts and viewpoints together before spouting forth and now that's the wrong thing to do?! Play fair It's no great experiment, simply if people's perceptions are that we've murdered x threads and it's too much, and we have in fact murdered x threads or even more than that, then we have to consider we are sticking the knife in too much too early. If you think we've done y threads and that's more than we have done then the perception is we are overmoderating when in fact we aren't, so there is something up with the perception and that's what needs to be addressed. However, if I blart out our figures first, the whole thing is up the swannee as people's perceptions will immediatly be changed by knowing the actual amounts. So bear with me. You may be suprised one way or the other with the actual amounts compared to your perceptions. This isn't just you btw, I'm asking anyone - Scooter, Mcanny, Stealth, anyone else who isn't a moderator. I'm actually trying to move forward with this rather than have another 'nazi moderator' bitch thread... -Ian Ian, i can't remember another whole thread that was actually deleted, but a few that were closed that were PL and trader related. i'm just trying to understand the need for the thread to be closed. For me i just don't see the need for everyone to necessarily get on, if there are issues then lets hear them and we can all make up our minds about people / circumstances. I appreciate that i'm only looking at this from a selfish liberal view and realise i have no responsibility of deciding whether this is good or bad for the BBS as a whole or other individuals etc. However i (and i may be wrong here) don't see that such a thread could reflect badly on the supra community as a whole because i view all that sort of stuff as a few of the hardcore 'competitors' having a dig, slanging match, call it what you will and regardless of what the GTR boys responded with, it would make not a jot of difference to my view of GTR owners in general and i'd expect the majority of skyline owners to let it wash over them too.... We are all just car enthusiasts at the end of the day, individuals making statements about another marque are in my book just that, individuals, and do not, simply by posting from a certain forum, represent that forums view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOKYO Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Yeah I was pi55ed off the GTR thread was deleted as I had posted in that with no malice along with others. But all the same I think Dude has issues and felt the need to openly vent them. Such a shame that venting could/would cause bad feeling for the rest of you guys/gals. Who the hell cares where cars form and how much they are. I never heard anyone dissing the CRD 9 sec Pod Supra from the GTR side and a GTR has never ran a 9 at the Pod. Nah reality check yourselves before some of you's make total ar5es of yourselves and spoil what were great achievements at TOTB and no doubt will be in the future. And Branners, was you 5hit stirring by putting that up on GTR as I can't think of any other genuine reason? Glen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Originally posted by Keith C I did start by just closing it, but once the GTR thread was deleted I reciprocated by removing the one here. After spending ages reading this whole thread, this is the only relevent line that stuck in my mind. Personally I think Keith did the right thing, on a "fair's fair" basis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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