Charlotte Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 Yes you do it so well Charlotte, all those great posts in this thread, I cant wait for the next go back to the hair and nails section. I'm sorry, religion doesn't really push my buttons. Generally I find some deeply religious people to be forceful bigoted fools. Oh.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snooze Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 ...and btw, I'm not saying your "God" doesn't exist. I don't think I'm so self-important that such an omnipotent being would make themself known to me. But conversely, as there ISN'T ANY PROOF EITHER WAY, I prefer to remain open-minded about it, which is where you seem to falter, Chief: If you want to think you've disproved evolution, go ahead and delude yourself that infinite equals seven point five. That doesn't mean you've proved the existence of God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 Why's that then? So 'man with a white beard making the world' is easier to believe than 'some fish managed to leave the water and breath and move around'...? Actually you're right, perhaps it was the guy with the beard? I cured! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 How is the existence of god, jesus or any of the 'religious folk' factual? I'm not saying mine is fact and the god stuff isn't, but evolution takes a fairly small jump in the belief stakes against this creation stuff...? way i see it - there is a much bigger balance between everything we know and try to comprehend... so much so it does not make it look feasable (in my mind) of anything like it happening by chance... its all intelligent design Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 So 'man with a white beard making the world' is easier to believe than 'some fish managed to leave the water and breath and move around'...? Actually you're right, perhaps it was the guy with the beard? I cured! have you ever tried to take a fish out of water and waited to see how long it take for it to turn into a monkey? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bobbling Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 So 'man with a white beard making the world' is easier to believe than 'some fish managed to leave the water and breath and move around'...? Actually you're right, perhaps it was the guy with the beard? I cured! And i suppose the world and all else was suddenly formed by a big bang? seems a little harder to believe..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewie Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 Wow this is one helluvva mass debate! [GRIN][/GRIN] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian W Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 And i suppose the world and all else was suddenly formed by a big bang? seems a little harder to believe..... harder to believe than someone or something actually making it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 And i suppose the world and all else was suddenly formed by a big bang? seems a little harder to believe..... lets go with the big bang theory.... in my mind - when something goes "BANG" not much is left.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiefgroover Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 I'm not saying mine is fact and the god stuff isn't, but evolution takes a fairly small jump in the belief stakes against this creation stuff...? Now thats a good point your trying to make there. Which one needs the most faith?, neither can be proven, as we were not there to witness it. You think creation needs more faith than evolution? You get more evolution in school, so we are PUSHED in that direction from the start (well in my school anyway). hhmmm....cant see why, after all the evolution is theory, branded as fact, just like religion. Religion however has a few special circumstances, one of which is that, according to our archaeologists every society around the world has its own ancient history which mentions a creation and flood at around the same time. You may wish to dismiss this, but when the world is so big and cultures very disconnected in those days, one would have to wonder? Another strange fact, substantiated by many historians worldwide is the deaths of the apostles (and also other converts) . Now this did make me think. 8 out of 11 were martyred brutally. Sometimes as cruel as having the skin ripped from the body, while still alive and crucified upside down and left to die, etc. Now, reasonable thinking and human nature to me would suggest that if Christ didnt rise from the dead, these guys would have scattered and lay low. However they all did there bit as instructed apparently. Now if you knew your teacher had died, and NOT resurrected, would you go telling the world and when faced with such a death not take your chance to recant what you had said? I think I would have!!. However they didnt, does make you think? Some of these man were great writers, Matthew, John, didnt write like uneducated men, obviously not fools etc. A movie on their lives is in the making, will be interesting watching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snooze Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 lets go with the big bang theory.... in my mind - when something goes "BANG" not much is left.... Well that's that disproved then! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 harder to believe than someone or something actually making it? think of it like this... when you're dreaming... and you want to say ... go to florida with a dead relative... BANG - instantly your there with that relative... in that world the constraints and laws of this "universe" are not applicable... i.e. your not limited by time and space... so.. god/the creator has to be outside of time/space for this univese to exist... else we come to the age old question - who created the creator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bobbling Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 harder to believe than someone or something actually making it? yep, harder to believe than as you said, a fish making its way to land and somehow living long enough to adapt to the living conditions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 Well that's that disproved then! glad i've made you see sense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian W Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 when you're dreaming... and you want to say ... go to florida with a dead relative... BANG - instantly your there with that relative... in that world the constraints and laws of this "universe" are not applicable... i.e. your not limited by time and space... so.. god/the creator has to be outside of time/space for this univese to exist... else we come to the age old question - who created the creator the reason the laws of this universe are not applicable is because it's NOT REAL! i don't get the link you're trying to make between me doing what i want in my mind/dreams and god creating the universe/world? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiefgroover Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 And i suppose the world and all else was suddenly formed by a big bang? seems a little harder to believe..... Apparantly, this is how it happened and everything we see just happened by random chance which is 1 in 12,680,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000. I can just see that fish changing into a bird lol.........where are the fossils!!??? I cant see them. Actually a fish that was thought extinct 64 million years ago, recently turned up looking exactly as it did back then lol, what sort of moisturiser did it use lmao, not one bit more evolved lmao..... what was it going having an evolutionary break? or a kit kat? Its hillarious to think that a woodpecker could evolve a shock absorber cartridge in its head to stop knocking itself out. Must have spent an awfully long time on its back on the ground thinking "man that tree is some tough shit " lmao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 the reason the laws of this universe are not applicable is because it's NOT REAL! i don't get the link you're trying to make between me doing what i want in my mind/dreams and god creating the universe/world? i meant it in the spiritual sense but then you have to ask yourself what is real? something you can touch? smell? see? feel? taste? if i punch you in the face and you felt the pain and told someone else - would they belive you? i.e. they cant see, feel,smell,taste or touch your "pain" but its is THERE! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian W Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 yep, harder to believe than as you said, a fish making its way to land and somehow living long enough to adapt to the living conditions no one is saying that one particular fish happened to survive long enough to adapt, however at the same time if one particular fish did adapt there would still be others that did not. it could have taken millions, if not billions or even more fish to die before they eventually adapted to the living conditions out of water. you think it's a coincidence that birds have a similar make-up to dinosaurs? or did dinosaurs die and then god was bored and decided to create new animals? perhaps dinosaurs never actually existed and we just made them up for the sake of our own entertainment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 no one is saying that one particular fish happened to survive long enough to adapt. it could have taken millions, if not billions or even more fish to die before they eventually adapted to the living conditions out of water. you think it's a coincidence that birds have a similar make-up to dinosaurs? or did dinosaurs die and then god was bored and decided to create new animals? perhaps dinosaurs never actually existed and we just made them up for the sake of our own entertainment? or... why not try to understand that this whole "evolutionary" process could of been kicked off by the creator and left to "evolve" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiefgroover Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 it could have taken millions, if not billions or even more fish to die before they eventually adapted to the living conditions out of water. QUOTE] Something suggest the fish stock would have ran out before they ever got this far, and why the heck would it want to leave the water anyway?, mind you we still dont know why the chicken crossed the road.? I could give loads of examples of animals that couldnt evolve, the would have all died out in one generation trying! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian W Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 i meant it in the spiritual sense but then you have to ask yourself what is real? something you can touch? smell? see? feel? taste? if i punch you in the face and you felt the pain and told someone else - would they belive you? i.e. they cant see, feel,smell,taste or touch your "pain" but its is THERE! precisely. if i punch you, you'll tell me it's real. if i punch you in your dream then you wake up in the morning and nothing. if you punched me and i told someone else (as you said), then it would be up to them whether they believe it or not but having probably seen someone being punched before it makes it easier for them to believe. if it came to it i could even demonstrate it to them. can you create a world for me so that i can believe it? or perhaps even point to someone else that can? no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian W Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 Something suggest the fish stock would have ran out before they ever got this far, and why the heck would it want to leave the water anyway?, mind you we still dont know why the chicken crossed the road.? I could give loads of examples of animals that couldnt evolve, the would have all died out in one generation trying! To be honest, i started off on the wrong foot with my arguement in the first place. I'm not actually a 100% believer in the evolution theory, don't get me wrong there are flaws. However to suggest that 'god' created the universe, the world and everyone/thing in it is even further fetched. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 Will everyone please stop denying my existence, it's giving me a headache. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlotte Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 I'm not actually a 100% believer in the evolution theory, don't get me wrong there are flaws. However to suggest that 'god' created the universe, the world and everyone/thing in it is even further fetched. I'd say that probably sums up my thinking aswell. Although I shouldn't really have an opinion on the whole thing as I don't have a pen*s. I wish sometimes I was taught to have a belief system, it would make things seems a lot nicer. Unfortunately I'm just a cynical person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiefgroover Posted April 10, 2007 Share Posted April 10, 2007 I hope there are a few laugh in this post for everyone. Animals that dont make the evolution profile, there are more than i could tell you. Here are a few The fish with legs - this fish like thing they say is a half evolved fish with legs, turned out to be an Axototl -a salmander arrested in its larval stage. Brings a new meaning to "fish off the menu" Bunyip - Abroriginal stories of this creature, that lives around ponds, a huge man eating thing, long neck head like a bird, and elongated body. 1800's settlers said they spotted it, and heard its blood chilling cry. as recent as the 1930's vagrants reported being threatened by one (wonder did it want £50 and a bottle of wine?) however sightings have declined probably due to human encroachment on its habitat. Now if the dinosaur species died out when claimed, how come a victorian newspaper in 1845 described it, and the first duck billed dinosaur fossil was found 13 years later!, let me guess? deja vu? It begs the question did dino's and men live at the same time? why dont we find their bones together? same reason we dont find Whales and Coelacanths together. Girraffe, now thats quite an animal, he needs to pump blood all the way up to his high held head. Thats all very well, until he goes to drink water from the river, sending masses of blood to his brain, which would burst in seconds if he didnt have a sponge like substance at the top of his neck to prevent this. So over millions of years, which it would take to evolve suck a valve/sponge type arrangement, how did the go for a drink at the river without becoming extinct? 20ft long straws ?? Coelacanth fish - This dissapointed evolutionists, when it turned up again, after a space of time by their estimates of 70 million years, looking just as it did, this was supposed to be a fish that was trying to adopt to land, obviously 70 millions years were not enough, dont rush it, give it a few billion and we can review its progress Spider silk? - the strongest fibre in the world, and hundred time stronger than steel, even stronger than kevlar!. It is also very stretchy. It is also heat resistant to a high temp, 150C, and can still stretch 20% at that heat. Whats the chances of this evolving? especially when its spec is way more than the spider will ever need? Was this the lost HKS DBB spider? Bombardier beetle, thats the one that blows smoke out its ass, lol actually it fire explosions out its ass, 500ish a second to be precise as possible. It fires from its combustion chamber, which of course is strong enough to withstand the force and fire a hydrogen/hydroquinone/water mix at 65 feet per second. I wonder how many beetles over how many million years blew the shit out themselves evolving this?, surely they would all be wiped out first time? I could go on and on but its a nice evening, and I aint sitting in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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