CJ Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Either you reply back to the point and engage into a discussion or keep quite. Is that an order then? And by the way, it's quiet, not quite. I would appreciate it if you could stop mis-quoting me Much appreciated. Show me where I misquoted you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mawby Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 What if we get rid of iTrader and then implement the suggestion of having a forum dedicated to trader issues where only the plaintiff and trader in question can reply the thread but everyone can see it. Anyone wanting to see if a trader is any good or not can simply search the forum for threads about that trader to see a) how many problems they have caused, and b) how well they have rectified those problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mk47 Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 What if we get rid of iTrader and then implement the suggestion of having a forum dedicated to trader issues where only the plaintiff and trader in question can reply the thread but everyone can see it. Anyone wanting to see if a trader is any good or not can simply search the forum for threads about that trader to see a) how many problems they have caused, and b) how well they have rectified those problems. but you have to remember itrader feedback is not left only for traders right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CJ Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 What if we get rid of iTrader and then implement the suggestion of having a forum dedicated to trader issues where only the plaintiff and trader in question can reply the thread but everyone can see it. Anyone wanting to see if a trader is any good or not can simply search the forum for threads about that trader to see a) how many problems they have caused, and b) how well they have rectified those problems. I think that is better. Would this also cover disputes between members too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael Posted January 5, 2007 Author Share Posted January 5, 2007 Tbh - Michael, if people bleat and moan about the iTrader system ... then you (not you personally ... I mean generally) .. you either do something about it ... or you quit bitching. Quit bitching? Are you insane! My life would be empty Personally speaking I'd like to see iTrader locked down so it only works for a specific for sale thread on the forum, it's a forum tool for forum users at the end of the day. If traders are doing deals outside of the forum then they don't get the feedback on here or they put up a thread for each transaction. They can setup iTrader on their own websites if it matters to them The additional threads may allow outsiders to the deal to see products and prices they were unaware of which will then generate more trade or if they wish to keep some privacy there could be a basic template that simply indicates a deal has been made over "something" - not ideal though. It's never going to be a perfect system and there will always be scope for abuse, at the end of the day we have a good mod team on hand to remove nonsense like the feedback I got today, it can work fairly well if more people use it, honest facts are stated and people grow some balls Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Show me where I misquoted you. OK, you are being pedantic now, you used my words completely out of context - you very well knew exactly what I meant Being a MD of a company in the past you know exactly what I am talking about when I refer to measuring Pre-sales service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 To come straight to the point that's a bollocks statement. MKIVSupra.net is the strongest it's ever been, the level of tech info floating around is better than ever (despite the loss of a few older members), the discussion is varied and detailed on the whole and with more and more members signing up each week the community continues to grow. Yes there are pockets of bad feeling, the odd thread with some rants and so on but this hardly makes up the majority of content, don't blame "this place", it's only the means for the minority to rant in a minority of threads. you can call it bollox - everyone has an asshole... the community is growing, but all some of the regulars do these days is bitch and moan about things that quite frankly - they don't really have an involvement in - eg, lucifers thread, the paul-e witch hunt to name a few.... and the few weeks before that it was racism/veils/islam etc etc etc.... this place use to be fun - but people are pushing it towards being more of a "policed community". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael Posted January 5, 2007 Author Share Posted January 5, 2007 What if we get rid of iTrader and then implement the suggestion of having a forum dedicated to trader issues where only the plaintiff and trader in question can reply the thread but everyone can see it. Anyone wanting to see if a trader is any good or not can simply search the forum for threads about that trader to see a) how many problems they have caused, and b) how well they have rectified those problems. I'm an iTrader fan, ideally I'd like to see the system remain *and* the mediation area to be introduced to work in parallel to it. Oh and the moon on a stick please Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 you can call it bollox - everyone has an asshole... the community is growing, but all some of the regulars do these days is bitch and moan about things that quite frankly - they don't really have an involvement in - eg, lucifers thread, the paul-e witch hunt to name a few.... and the few weeks before that it was racism/veils/islam etc etc etc.... this place use to be fun - but people are pushing it towards being more of a "policed community". So what is the protocol then? If a fellow member(s) is getting screwed then as an unaffected member I should stay out? Regarding the racism/veils/Islam - what exactly is your point? what did you find unacceptable? Were they posted in the wrong section - or would you rather that they were not posted at all? If the latter, then why not simply have a rule on the forum as to what subjects are NOT allowed. What exactly are you afraid of? Voicing your opinion or having one at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 So what is the protocol then? If a fellow member(s) is getting screwed then as an unaffected member I should stay out? Regarding the racism/veils/Islam - what exactly is your point? what did you find unacceptable? Were the posted in the wrong section - or would you rather that they were not posted at all? If the latter, then why not simply have a rule on the forum as to what subjects are NOT allowed. What exactly are you afraid of? Voicing your opinion or having one at all? if a fellow member is getting screwed - the mods are here to help them... as its been said many times - "pm a mod of your choice"... yes, if witchunters (you can put yourself in that catagory if you wish) stayed out - and watched from the sidelines - the affected members issue could be rectified a lot quicker - rather then that particular trader trying to answer everyone elses query/comments/cheap shots in the same thread. as for the other threads - they were created for a reason - i'll go out of a limb here and say they've not gone down too well in the past - so why should they be any diffrent when someone else decided to stand on their soapbox and have a go? i'm not afraid of much - if you knew me personally you'd know that ... i speak my mind when i feel i've looked at a situation from both sides - not just jump in with the mob and try to create something out of nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 if a fellow member is getting screwed - the mods are here to help them... as its been said many times - "pm a mod of your choice"... yes, if witchunters (you can put yourself in that catagory if you wish) stayed out - and watched from the sidelines - the affected members issue could be rectified a lot quicker - rather then that particular trader trying to answer everyone elses query/comments/cheap shots in the same thread. That trader chose not to do the right thing and respond back to the affected members. But I see where you are coming from......Perhaps in the future I will notify the mods of my concern 1st. I repeatedly suggested to the trader (public & via PM) + mods & effected members in public that separate threads be started to discuss each case individually (its there for all to see). So not sure what I did wrong. Perhaps the word "member" is just a number in the club. In which case, I am at fault cause as I misunderstood. If I came across some stranger in the street that needed my help, I would certainly help. I wouldn't just walk past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 I see where you are coming from......Perhaps in the future I will notify the mods of my concern 1st. That trader chose not to do the right thing and respond back to the affected members. I repeatedly suggested to the trader (public & via PM) + mods & effected members in public that separate threads be started to discuss each case individually (its there for all to see). So not sure what I did wrong. Perhaps the word "member" is just a number in the club. In which case, I am at fault cause as I misunderstood. If I came across some stranger in the street that needed my help, I would certainly help. I wouldn't just walk past. "That trader chose not to do the right thing and respond back to the affected members." hence the reason why the trader was made accountable for his/her actions/or lack of by the mods.... that's all i'm saying on THAT subject. "I repeatedly suggested to the trader (public & via PM) + mods & effected members in public that separate threads be started to discuss each case individually (its there for all to see). " yes- granted i read the post's you're referring to... but at the time ... all that would of happened is multiple threads would of been created - the witchunters would of jumped in and still had a go - again causing more work for mods... "So not sure what I did wrong. Perhaps the word "member" is just a number in the club. In which case, I am at fault cause as I misunderstood." a member can be anything you precieve it to be - the fact of the matter is all this talk of "doing whats best for the community" is just that - all talk... whilst in the process - if anything members who don't post often or just lurk etc etc are feeling more and more isolated ... look at the skyline/evo/scooby forums... we're not any better then them these days...- wheres the community spirit in that? "If I came across some stranger in the street that needed my help, I would certainly help. I wouldn't just walk past." not sure what thats supposed to mean - as common sense would kick in and force you to do the right thing .... however - i can't see any members on here lying on the floor screaming for help - on here its a story with TWO parts..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 Ok....some fair points there......feedback taken aboard. Tried to do the right thing but agree, I failed in that case. Next time will notify the mods. So whats the view on rating PRE-SALES in the iTrader ratings? Good idea or like Joe and CJ said, its not to be entertained. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 Ok....some fair points there......feedback taken aboard. Tried to do the right thing but agree, I failed in that case. Next time will notify the mods. So whats the view on rating PRE-SALES in the iTrader ratings? Good idea or like Joe and CJ said, its not to be entertained. it'll be too hard to control from abuse... most likely we'll just end up seeing more "so and so gave me bad feedback" threads... if anything - why not have a "survey" type thing which people complete after every itrader initiated transaction (for sale threads etc)... that way you can gauge on response times, delivery, quality of good etc etc - giving you a total score for each type of criteria .... so users know they can get shit products pretty quick from one dude and quality stuff but damn slow from another? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 What if we get rid of iTrader... Because a couple of folks don't like it? Nah. It's a good tool. A couple of changes or rules would improve it but over all I think it's a great feature. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 Because a couple of folks don't like it? Nah. It's a good tool. A couple of changes or rules would improve it but over all I think it's a great feature. congrats on 18,000 posts jake - i think we should have a ceremony and give you a prize or something Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamer Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 It's a good tool. A couple of changes or rules would improve it but over all I think it's a great feature. Ditto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 congrats on 18,000 posts jake - i think we should have a ceremony and give you a prize or something Get him this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiefgroover Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 What about agreeing to sell a part to someone then selling that part to someone else because they offer more? No deal was completed, but negative feedback would be justified I reckon. IMO, a "deal" is when a a deposit is paid or money changes hands. IMO a gentlemans agreement is when you talk a deal, but nothing has changed hands. I have been let down 5 times by members who were buying for sure but then backed out. Maybe the guys had cash flow probs, or some other event changed the ability to buy. I didnt feedback them as i dont think in 95% of cases people who pull out are doing it because they want to, more that they have to. Anyway one of them then bought an expensive item a year later when things were going better for him. Most people deserve a second chance, unless it's blatant bad character. If i trader focuses on deals done, and those who failed to complete use the forum to bitch it out, i think i trader ratings will hold more weight when viewers are deciding whether to buy from that person or not. I am OK with other peoples views on i trader, everyone must have their say! Will be interesting to see how it goes over the next 12 months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPRASUZUKI Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 IMO, a "deal" is when a a deposit is paid or money changes hands. IMO a gentlemans agreement is when you talk a deal, but nothing has changed hands. I guess we can agree to disagree on this. A deal to me is struck on the basis of an agreement to purchase and sell like with ebay). Face to face this would be agreed with a handshake (like when you buy a car). The deal is concluded when money and parts actually change hands. Also, breaking a 'gentlemans agreement' shows a very poor business ethic and downright bad manners. I personally would not deal with someone who displays this trait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Class One Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 I'm an iTrader fan, ideally I'd like to see the system remain *and* the mediation area to be introduced to work in parallel to it. Oh and the moon on a stick please Can't do the moon on a stick, but certainly a mediation area is something under consideration. But as you know, changes do take a bit of time, but they will happen. I like i-trader, I think it's a good system, if used properly. Any member or indeed a trader can appeal against any i trader feedback. Michael, did report his i-trader feedback left for him, but he chose to highlight an important issue using the forum, which he is perfectly entitled to do. It's not a witch hunt or indeed amied at a particular trader, but more of a discussion about the system itself. IIRC, i-trader was actually introduced to the forum to highlight deals between MEMBERS , not between members and traders. But as we've seen recently, the system can be open to abuse, but unless the matter is reported, the I'm afraid to say, it's not policed, as there just isn't enough time to do that. Perhaps it can be jigged to only allow feedback to be left linked to a thread deal, but I for one would like to see the system remain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 Perhaps it can be jigged to only allow feedback to be left linked to a thread deal, but I for one would like to see the system remain. makes sense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 the system can be open to abuse, but unless the matter is reported, the I'm afraid to say, it's not policed, as there just isn't enough time to do that. Maybe you could appoint an iTrader moderator? (Not Imi or Michael though ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 Maybe you could appoint an iTrader moderator? (Not Imi or Michael though ) - what about the both of us Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mawby Posted January 6, 2007 Share Posted January 6, 2007 So if I forced iTrader to require a link back to a thread in the for sale forums we could affectively block traders from using the iTrader system. This would mean the iTrader system is purely for private sales. Then introduce a forum for trader complaints as described above and members can use that to see if a traders has a good reputation or not. This should stop traders trying to keep a 100% iTrader rating (as they wont have one) and should mean members are more happy to post complaints as the trader cannot leave a negative iTrader rating for them and the masses cannot join in the thread to stir up trouble. But this will still only work if people are willing to post up when they have a problem and then keep the thread up-to-date with how the trader has attempted to or failed to resolve that problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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