power

[pdg26]

Hi guys,

 

Just a quick one here...it sounds from all you lot like TT is now the 'only' way to go, LOL Just wanted to talk about handling and power - can someone please quote me bhp output for stock TT and NA? I'm guessing 280 and 225 respectively, but the 320 figure is also in my mind for some reason for the TT....also there's this business of power being measured at the flywheel and at the rear wheels - which is the most commonly quoted (for cars in general?), not sure what it all means? re: handling - what are the levels of grip of a Supra like; does it handle as well as evos and imprezas (not that i've been in any of these but heard they handle like they're on rails)? i recall reading somewhere on here that the TT can be a little dodgy in the wet? also 0-60 aside, is the difference quite striking in the mid-range, i.e. what are the 1/4 mile times for stock NA and TTs? cheers guys!

 

p.s. can someone explain the 'hovis' thing on here - ?

[chilli]

TT is approx 320 - 326bhp IIRC for uk models and is often quoted at 280bhp for stock j-spec cars although in reality they always make more, over 300bhp but possibly just less than uk spec because they have different cams and stuff, they are more torque/responsive though...

 

N/A is 220bhp IIRC

 

BHP is normally quoted (measured) at the flywheel and that is how all manufacturers quote it (they can actually measure it). For modded cars it has to go on some sort of rolling road that gives the power at the wheels, from that you can guess the flywheel bhp but it is not very accurate. There is no easy way to measure a modded cars flywheel bhp obviously.

 

TTs are powerful RWD cars, you need to treat them with a lot of respect in the wet. It doesn't help that the standard Traction control is rubbish and best uprated, that can make a big difference especially in the wet.

 

Handling is different but the supra does handle very well with the right set up, it is more of a GT car than a rally car though.

 

I've not directly seen the difference between an N/A and a TT but I suspect it is quite significant, in stock trim there is another 100bhp (or nearly as much power again) over the N/A in a TT...

[pdg26]

thanks Chilli,

 

you've cleared up my queries very well, much appreciated. regarding traction control - does this only come as standard with the TT? are there any particular advantages handling-wise of a RWD car over a FWD? with my FWD 1.3 corolla which admittedly gets the crap thrashed out of it, I can sometimes get the back wheels to break out under hard driving (though some care required in the wet obviously), causing a power slide / drift in the very minor sense of the word. How does RWD compare?

 

thanks again.

[DaveK]

RWD will step out very easily - even in NA on a dry road - and it's not something I'd recommend practicing on a public road.

[pdg26]

RWD will step out very easily - even in NA on a dry road - and it's not something I'd recommend practicing on a public road.

 

how come? i don't know much about it - other than FWD is i guess 'pulling' the car, RWD 'pushing' it - can someone explain the basic differences?

[pdg26]

what's the basic handling of a supra like - i know it's got a long wheelbase, does this impact on the handling? have heard they handle pretty well? (though perhaps not as well as a rally car?)

[Oly]

No need for the handbrake to spin round

got an accelerator for that if you want

[ChrisSZ]

FWD tend to understeer, RWD tend to oversteer. Oversteer is (for me anyway) easier to control Also, it's more fun

[pdg26]

FWD tend to understeer, RWD tend to oversteer. Oversteer is (for me anyway) easier to control Also, it's more fun

 

ok, think i'm with you now...how does one initiate a 'drift'? have a feeling that all i was doing in my fwd is power sliding, where the back wheels break away ? how does the oversteer occur in the supra?

[pdg26]

i know what you mean about undesteering also - it's a very fine line being in control and not in control (esp. in the wet)

[ChrisSZ]

I always find that with understeer the car just ploughs on - with proper oversteer you can get the back out and 'balance' it on the throttle.

 

With a powerful car you can initiate oversteer with a heavy throttle and a bend, in less powerful cars you need to get the back end out first - a tug on the handbrake mid turn suffices usually. Once it's out you can control the rear wheels with the throttle - keep it applied and the slide will continue, lift off and the back end will come back into line.

 

If you lift off too sharply, you end up with a snap oversteer - the back end acts like a pendulum and swings the other way - somewhat uncontrolled and unwanted:)

 

Best to practice on a skid-pan or an empty, wet or icy, carpark (or grass) :)

[pdg26]

I always find that with understeer the car just ploughs on - with proper oversteer you can get the back out and 'balance' it on the throttle.

 

With a powerful car you can initiate oversteer with a heavy throttle and a bend, in less powerful cars you need to get the back end out first - a tug on the handbrake mid turn suffices usually. Once it's out you can control the rear wheels with the throttle - keep it applied and the slide will continue, lift off and the back end will come back into line.

 

If you lift off too sharply, you end up with a snap oversteer - the back end acts like a pendulum and swings the other way - somewhat uncontrolled and unwanted:)

 

Best to practice on a skid-pan or an empty, wet or icy, carpark (or grass) :)

 

interesting reading! i've seen a clip of a JUN supra drifting that look quite impressive - i take it that's oversteer? i guess i won't know the real difference until i get the supra

[ChrisSZ]

Yeah - drifting is prolonged, controlled oversteer