Wez Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 If I had a NA i think I would go with an exhaust and manifold, be carefull here though as an NA will need some back pressure for best results, some fast road cams if available, light weight flywheel and clutch and maybe adjust the fueling and fit NOS or methonal, if you wanted to go further you could get the head gas flowed, ported and cleaned then lighten and strengthen the bottom end. Induction kits are ok for big HP but when fitted to smaller HP cars can actually reduce power and torque due to the hot engine bay air they are pulling in. As for the fans, the electric doesn`t produce more power its the fact that fitting electric fans enables you to remove the viscous fan which is being driven by the engine and stealing HP to spin it so would also be another option on my list. I think a 300hp NA would be a monster and would kill most turbo cars on the road, would also make a great track car as you wouldn`t have all the heat issues you have with a turbo setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Ashley Willis Someone mentioned that elctric fans produce more power than vicous, are you refering to the standard engine fan ??? And why does electric produce more power ??? Ash the way i understand it the viscous setup sapps some of the engines power in the way it works, whereas the electric one is powered solely by electrics so 'frees up' this lost power if that makes sense............ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syed Shah Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 They also overheat and cause no end of problems. Also, they don't really 'free up' HP, just means it is run by the alt rather than directly. Less efficient! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digsy Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Wez ...lighten and strengthen the bottom end. Piece of cake. That's £3K for a billet crank alone (and you want it lighter than stock, too?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syed Shah Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Darren Blake Piece of cake. That's £3K for a billet crank alone (and you want it lighter than stock, too?) LOL. Yep Wez, your post proves my point about the massive cost involved, Thanks BTW, nothing wrong with NA Supras, just not for the power hungry, thats all! Remember a Supra, NA or not will out-grip and out-handle nearly everything on the road if you can drive! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Laing Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Wez I think a 300hp NA would be a monster and would kill most turbo cars on the road, would also make a great track car as you wouldn`t have all the heat issues you have with a turbo setup. PMSL You'd never get a 300bhp N/A, unless you spent £5-10k I'd put mine against a N/A anyday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 OK Guys, My post was ment to show both ends of the scale for mod path, I know that its going to cost major money to rebuild the engine but it was only to show what could be done if you really wanted too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve W2 Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 As always threads like these will have certain levels of conflict associated with them and it all comes down to personal preference at the end of the day. You can get 500BHP Citroen Saxo if you throw enough money at it, the point is what you are happy with and what your budget will allow. If I had an NA I would consider tuning it, like others have said, its not always a case of jsut go and buy a TT as you may not have the cash at that point and would prefer a more progreesive route. I do think though that tuning costs and power potential of the NA are obviously less though. And whoever said the maintenence costs would be much cheaper I think would be gravely mistaken. A tuned up NA running cams, higher compression engine etc. (probably standard TT powerish) would require more maintenence that an standard TT. It would be nice to see some high power NA though as its something different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Can we please quit it with the get a TT posts please! It's not helping at all. As we know the NA engine is (in construction terms) 99% the same bar some oil squirters. So the strength is there. I would be all in favour of a progressive multiport nitrous install. This will set you back about £1k but is on the face of it cheaper than changing the car or engine. With 6x25bhp jets you're looking at a max of 150bhp (however the progressive controller will obviously bring this on in stages). If installed right there should be no real harm done...other than to your wallet as you find you have to re-fill the bottle all the time! (But then you don't have the fuel bills the TT's have). I know of a crappy mondeo which runs nitrous daily and hasn't suffered a mechanical failure due to it. Lightening masses and making the car more responsive maybe your best bet. Jun make a chromoly flywheel for the NA. This would be a good start (for the manual cars). The lightweight pulley sets could also be of benefit, but do not change the crank pulley/damper - unless you are putting on a new Toyota one! I don't know what cam sets are out there but if you want to trade a little torque at lower rpm for high rpm power then by all means get wilder cams. Other than that you would need to lighten the rest of the car and raise the bhp/ton ratio that way. As the car is lighter than the TT equivalent IMO you are better off sorting the car for the twisty's, better suspension, better tyres, light wheels (properly sized), big brakes and possibly that progressive nitrous! :flame Dev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syed Shah Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Steve W2 I do think though that tuning costs and power potential of the NA are obviously less though. Wrong, when you get to reaching an engines 'potential' the only bit left is the head and block. The blocks are the same, and the NA head supposedly flows better! Like I've said, if you plan on 700+BHP, NA or TT no longer matters! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve W2 Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 I was reffering more to the bottom end of the tuning scale that was the original point of the post. For 2K spent on both engines you would get a bigger power hike on the TT. Most people on here talking about tuning an NA aren't looking at 700BHP and 15K costs to get it. TT or NA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve W2 Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Alex Holdroyd (But then you don't have the fuel bills the TT's have). Where dd you get that from, my NA is only a couple of mpg better than my TT. Using nitroud would mean an NA using more petrol than a TT IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faye Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Steve W2 Where dd you get that from, my NA is only a couple of mpg better than my TT. I get about 18-20 out of mine, but thats weekend driving when I'm playing with the car , but as I only use it at the weekend....:flame Dev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve W2 Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Faye I get about 18-20 out of mine, but thats weekend driving when I'm playing with the car , but as I only use it at the weekend....:flame Dev Without turning this into a fuel economy post I get more than driving it to work daily and about 18 when palying around as well. On a good go i get around 23-24 in the NA and 20-22 in the TT a difference I'm not even worried about really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Steve W2 Where dd you get that from, my NA is only a couple of mpg better than my TT. Using nitroud would mean an NA using more petrol than a TT IMHO. EDITED Its a pretty minor point in this thread. But FWIW you don't need to run SUL in an NA so that can make it cheaper.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve W2 Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Alex Holdroyd What fuel do you put in it? Optimax! Does that make any difference if its the same in both cars? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Laing Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 What nobody’s mentioned is the engine bays, and what they look like. Lift both bonnets and pick the best looking engine, and it’s not the N/A with it’s ugly manifold half over the engine…..much prefer the TT design. And I know people with N/A’s feel the same because I once had a N/A and I did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faye Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Paul Laing What nobody’s mentioned is the engine bays, and what they look like. Lift both bonnets and pick the best looking engine, and it’s not the N/A with it’s ugly manifold half over the engine…..much prefer the TT design. And I know people with N/A’s feel the same because I once had a N/A and I did. Yet again another constructive post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve W2 Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Paul Laing What nobody’s mentioned is the engine bays, and what they look like. Lift both bonnets and pick the best looking engine, and it’s not the N/A with it’s ugly manifold half over the engine…..much prefer the TT design. And I know people with N/A’s feel the same because I once had a N/A and I did. I think my TT engine looks better, but I wouldnt change to a differnt car or model beacuase the engine looks better. Not unless I had a perspex bonnet and lots of bling:p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Paul - you don't even know where the turbo's are! Why bother lifting the bonnet??? And haven't you seen the work Nick (NWS25) has done to tart up a similar looking 7M engine bay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Faye Yet again another constructive post. Agreed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syed Shah Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Faye, turbo your car and kick Paul's arse please Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve W2 Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Alex Holdroyd EDITED Its a pretty minor point in this thread. But FWIW you don't need to run SUL in an NA so that can make it cheaper.... Yeah I know that but I'm rich and like burning money, literally:p I only do it to get the funky little cards that i am collecting:D So, after this post, which one of you NA guys (or Faye) is going to go for some extra ponies? Has anyone on here got any reasonable power increases from their NA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faye Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Originally posted by Steve W2 Yeah I know that but I'm rich and like burning money, literally:p I only do it to get the funky little cards that i am collecting:D So, after this post, which one of you NA guys (or Faye) is going to go for some extra ponies? Has anyone on here got any reasonable power increases from their NA? I'm a coward, I won't take the risk of being the experimental car and having all the aggro that may go with it, especially as my technical knowledge it just about zilch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syed Shah Posted April 16, 2004 Share Posted April 16, 2004 Maybe Supra Pilot (Dom) will chime in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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