Info on Anti Lag

[DannoSupra]

How it's fitted? And Cost?

[veilsideTT]

Anti lag is done through an aftermarket ECU if i remember correctly!

 

Awaits correction:D

[TRD3000GT]

aftermarket ECU mate. or a two step rev limiter I beleive will do the trick as well

 

Its about learning when the turbo comes online and holding the engine on those revs possibly also venting via the wastegate as well which will close on takeoff

[DannoSupra]

Future project for me, i'm lucky in a way, a colleuge i work with does a lot of work for our local bodyshop's rally team. and he knows quite a bit

 

I just wanted to know if it could be fitted to a Standard ECU, Obviously not. so..... Cheers guys! Very Much Appreciated

[b_have]

Antilag is usually achieved by dialing in loads of ign retard (as much as -40deg) and lean fuel to create heat.

[TLicense]

I thought it was lots of extra fuel? I thought the reason why you got an increase in heat was because the combustion is now happening more in the exhaust runners rather than the cylinder?

[RobSheffield]

as B Have said, its dialling in retard on the map so that the exhaust port is open as the spark fires, this detonates in the turbo housing, and so spools the Turbo

 

will reduce turbo life,

 

not really needed on modern low lag turbos. it used to be used on the clonky big turbos that were common years ago.

[Homer]

will reduce turbo life

 

After talking with Demitri and Dude about this - you can say that again!

 

As far as I recall, to attempt this on anything but a proper single/twin turbo setup would result in almost instant turbo death. Even on a good new turbo it will seriously limit the lifespan. Its really only for hard core drag racers that wouldn't blink an eye at replacing the tubbies.

[dangerous brain]

Get a decent boost controller, aftermarket BOV, make sure you have no boost leaks on older cars a new intercooler may be required, a good sized free flowing decat pipe setup and your turbo's will spool a helluva lot quicker.

[fastisnice]

antilag will slowly kill a turbo, specially if its not ball bearing..ball bearing will take a lot more abuse..

Nos is the solution:D

[dangerous brain]

antilag will slowly kill a turbo, specially if its not ball bearing..ball bearing will take a lot more abuse..

Nos is the solution:D

 

 

How is Nos the solution???

 

In my experience Nos does cock squat all until the car gets into its own power band, now in my book thats not the 3k rpm and below that the supe wallows around trying to find boost.

[fastisnice]

Thats why they make progressive NOS controllers, a maximiser(top of the range) can set the NOS to come on from very low revs (2K) all the way to redline or to whatever revs you set it to, but the beauty of it is that you can set the power band shot you want progressively, so you dont get instantly 100bhp at certain revs. NOS also speeds up the boost, so 100 shot will spool up the turbo 0.2-0.3 bar faster, so having a big single will start spooling decent power at 4K onwards can benefit, specially when you are on going and you want instant power(US style race). Antilag is useless specially on a high RWD high power car. Very hard to launch it with a bar+ of boost! on first gear! . Whats the point?

[Lucifer]

How is Nos the solution???

 

In my experience Nos does cock squat all until the car gets into its own power band, now in my book thats not the 3k rpm and below that the supe wallows around trying to find boost.

 

 

As a previous Dealer adn fitter for many years I can confidently say you must never have been in a proper NOS'ed up car. With a progressive controller, NOS OWNES turbos! Just EXTREMLEY expensive to run.

[Lucifer]

AEM ECU has the WBP option of course

[fastisnice]

In 2 weeks i should have my car all done using the progressive controller and ill take a video [COOL][/COOL]

[Lucifer]

In 2 weeks i should have my car all done using the progressive controller and ill take a video

 

Can I ask who is mapping it?

[dangerous brain]

As a previous Dealer adn fitter for many years I can confidently say you must never have been in a proper NOS'ed up car. With a progressive controller, NOS OWNES turbos! Just EXTREMLEY expensive to run.

 

Dude all a progressive NOS install does is prevent the system chucking expensive gas down a system that can't do anything with it. It limits the "shot" of NOS gas until the car gets into its power band. Now in my book that means until at least 3k rpm on most turbo cars the exact same band of power that cars are wallowing around in lag regions. Don't get me wrong on turbo cars the power increase is exponential over normaly aspirated using nos but that power is only available at higher boost revs. Not exactly a cure for lag. A better cure for lag is reducing the spool time and that is easily achieved on J-spec easy spooling turbo's by freeing up their airflow

[Lucifer]

Ahhh you see I agree to a point, but what you are forgetting is you CAN add around 50hp at 2200rpm on a 6 banger. You just have to be careful that it doesn't well up in the intake and BOOM!

 

Look at most peoples power graphs at 2500 RPM, you telling me another 50hp isnt going to makee the differnece, actually forget HP its 50LBft!

[dangerous brain]

How is it adding 50 brake at 2500 rpm?? All its doing is bunging extra fuel into a situation thats allready overfuelled as the fuel thats in there is not being correctly burned yet as the compression ratio is too low as guess what the turbo isn't bunging the extra pressure the system needs to get it to ideal comp ratio? Its also wanging in some extra oxygen molecules which are just whopping around and more than likely burning in the exhaust, Great for flaming not so great for actual combustion within the chamber. If anything the only thing it can be doing is the exact do not do as it reduces turbo life anti-lag fuel retardation albeit by another method

[Lucifer]

How is it adding 50 brake at 2500 rpm?? All its doing is bunging extra fuel into a situation thats allready overfuelled as the fuel thats in there is not being correctly burned yet as the compression ratio is too low as guess what the turbo isn't bunging the extra pressure the system needs to get it to ideal comp ratio? Its also wanging in some extra oxygen molecules which are just whopping around and more than likely burning in the exhaust, Great for flaming not so great for actual combustion within the chamber. If anything the only thing it can be doing is the exact do not do as it reduces turbo life anti-lag fuel retardation albeit by another method

 

Are you talking about antilag and Im talking about NOS?

[dangerous brain]

No I'm talking about nos mate. You can't physically burn the extra stuff in the combustion chamber if the AFR is already rich as feck can ya? And in turbo cars the AFR at low low revs is just that is it not? Theres more fuel in the system than the burning process can cope with at 3k rpm so it chucks all your extra fuel (that NOS'd up cars need to survive) and the majority of the extra oxygen (that the nos itself actually is) back out the exhaust valves into the exhaust system. First thing it hits is the damned hot turbos, woof and off goes the remnant of unburnt stuff. Now for me thats the same shit as anti-lag retardation but just a different way of putting the fuel into the exhaust manifold.

[Lucifer]

No I'm talking about nos mate. You can't physically burn the extra stuff in the combustion chamber if the AFR is already rich as feck can ya? And in turbo cars the AFR at low low revs is just that is it not? Theres more fuel in the system than the burning process can cope with at 3k rpm so it chucks all your extra fuel (that NOS'd up cars need to survive) and the majority of the extra oxygen (that the nos itself actually is) back out the exhaust valves into the exhaust system. First thing it hits is the damned hot turbos, woof and off goes the remnant of unburnt stuff. Now for me thats the same shit as anti-lag retardation but just a different way of putting the fuel into the exhaust manifold.

 

No you are right on the money, which is why it has to be mapped to use it no?

[dangerous brain]

No I understand the point of mapping it to use it. What I don't understand is how its any better than anti-lag retardation? Its gonna feck your turbo's just the same if you use it to spool your turbos early is it not? Maybe your EGT's will be a bit lower with the cooling power of the Nos and the extra fuel but still a close run thing. Surely a more sensible method is to get your turbo singing quicker by allowing it sing up quicker rather than forcing it to?

 

You could always prespool it with a supercharger

[Lucifer]

NOS wont keep things any cooler, infact just the opposite, teh EGTS are very high with a rich oxygene burn.

 

Now supercharger, thats the way to go! Has Jagman finished his yet?

[dangerous brain]

Nope. He's trying to bung his pressure down the intake though which involves valves and shit. Me I'd sling it into the turbo itself, after all the turbo does a damn good job of powering the car up just need to blow it to go faster. A supercharger that blows max air at 3k rpm into the turbo and BOV's from there should be sufficient. Not sure how current turbo's would handle the hot/cold air mix though. Maybe some aviation engine turbine blade material technology is required. And another thing, I'm highly suprised that the japs haven't started cooling the turbines on turbos same as gas turbine engines do.