TLicense Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 OK guys I've had enough. Time and time again I read "oh you're going single. You're going to need a FMIC" I'm not so sure. The whole point of getting a larger turbo, is that for a given pressure the turbo is working more efficiently. This directly relates to the air coming out of the turbo, being cooler. So why oh why is the general consensus "You NEED a FMIC?" when the fact of the matter IMHO is you need a FMIC less than what you would need to get the same pressure out of a stock turbo. I've just bought a reasonably large turbo kit. Will I be fitting a FMIC? Will I hell. My SMIC has worked fine with the "off the efficiency island" stock turbo's running at 18 - 20 psi, so I'm pretty sure it will work just as fine with air that is cooler to start with. OK the SMIC on my car has seen better days, and will in fact be getting upgraded to a new one, and yes a FMIC will reduce the inlet temps further and give more power, but in my opinion it's not neccessary Thought's guys? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Flat4_ire Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 OK guys I've had enough. Time and time again I read "oh you're going single. You're going to need a FMIC" I'm not so sure. The whole point of getting a larger turbo, is that for a given pressure the turbo is working more efficiently. This directly relates to the air coming out of the turbo, being cooler. So why oh why is the general consensus "You NEED a FMIC?" when the fact of the matter IMHO is you need a FMIC less than what you would need to get the same pressure out of a stock turbo. I've just bought a reasonably large turbo kit. Will I be fitting a FMIC? Will I hell. My SMIC has worked fine with the "off the efficiency island" stock turbo's running at 18 - 20 psi, so I'm pretty sure it will work just as fine with air that is cooler to start with. OK the SMIC on my car has seen better days, and will in fact be getting upgraded to a new one, and yes a FMIC will reduce the inlet temps further and give more power, but in my opinion it's not neccessary Thought's guys?ok no its not completely neccessary but if u want the most and safely power from your upgraded turbo kit a nice siz fmic is the way to go, allows u to run higher boost safely and keep charge temps down, all preference at the end of the day, but why cut corners for the sake of a few quid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLicense Posted May 21, 2006 Author Share Posted May 21, 2006 Why's it cutting corners? If I can run 1.2 bar on my stock turbo's with no det, how would running a cooler 1.2 bar on a aftermarket turbo/s be more dangerous? By that rational, we should all have WI as well and NOS. Safety first and all that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamer Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 I do not think the SMIC will be efficient enough to cool the amount of air that you will be putting into it with a reasonably large turbo. If it was that easy to skip the FMIC install with a larger turbo wouldn't more people be doing it ? There must be a reason for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 It's not any more air though Joe, is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miguel Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 Would size of turbo at said Pressure V volume of air it moves not be something to think about? What is the tested efficiency of the volume of air an SMIC can take without getting overworked? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamer Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 Why's it cutting corners? If I can run 1.2 bar on my stock turbo's with no det, how would running a cooler 1.2 bar on a aftermarket turbo/s be more dangerous? By that rational, we should all have WI as well and NOS. Safety first and all that! I do not think you can just say 1.2 bar on one turbo should be the same on all turbos. Case in point. I ran my old HKS GT3040 at 1.5 bar many times without any issues. That turbo was rated for up to 500hp. I upgraded to a GT40-67 turbo that was rated for 700hp and the one time I upped the boost to 1.5bar I blew a piston and had a major engine fire that wrote off the car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 How is 20psi of boost from a single more air than 20psi of boost from the stock peashooters? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamer Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 It's not any more air though Joe, is it? I think Mig answered that one for you Jake... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 Did he? Still If it was more air wouldn't it be at a higher pressure? (Physics is not my strong point) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miguel Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 How is 20psi of boost from a single more air than 20psi of boost from the stock peashooters? Seach button As I swear I went through this with you ages ago in detail on another thread:) Simply put bigger fans move more air at the same pressures. Thats why as Gamer has mentioned a 61 , 71, 76, 88 will all put out more power respectively at the same boost. An engine simply is an air pump, the more air you feed it the more fuel you can add to it and the more power you release. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamer Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 Did you? I still don't get how more air, going through the same pipework, going into the same sized cylinders could be at the same pressure if there's more of it. Nevermind, I'll go search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 I think it might be coming back to me slowly. Is it to do with the air density? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamer Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 I think it might be coming back to me slowly. Is it to do with the air density? Now your cooking with gas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_have Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 Does that little red button by the shift effect charge temps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carl0s Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 How is 20psi of boost from a single more air than 20psi of boost from the stock peashooters? I'm sure we had this one a good few months ago.. you, me, and migster explaining it all. Volume is different to pressure, or something It's like how it's easy to create 20psi of pressure when you're trying to force it through a mac donalds straw, but blowing that same air into a drainpipe you have no pressure at all. Or something Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miguel Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 I'm sure we had this one a good few months ago.. you, me, and migster explaining it all. Volume is different to pressure, or something It's like how it's easy to create 20psi of pressure when you're trying to force it through a mac donalds straw, but blowing that same air into a drainpipe you have no pressure at all. Or something Good memory that man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamer Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 Good memory that man Must be something to do with the blood rushing to his brain due to his extremely tight pants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucifer Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 As a rule-thumb, every 5oc drop in charge temperature results in an air density increase that allows for a 1% increase in gross power output. Likewise, an 5oc increase in charge temperature can reduce power output by about one percent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miguel Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 Must be something to do with the blood rushing to his brain due to his extremely tight pants. LOL What's with the red button Bhave? Lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamer Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 LOL What's with the red button Bhave? Lol He's either taking the piss or on the piss. Most likely both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carl0s Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 Must be something to do with the blood rushing to his brain due to his extremely tight pants. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gzaerojon Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 am i right in thinking the colder the air the more volume you can pump into the engine in the same area of pipe? for example if you put an inflated baloon in liquid nitrogen it will shrink, but then when it warms up it inflates again, the volume of air doesn't change, it just becomes more compact and need less area to exist. so in theory you could get more air into the engine if its colder? feel free to shoot me down Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamer Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 am i right in thinking the colder the air the more volume you can pump into the engine in the same area of pipe? for example if you put an inflated baloon in liquid nitrogen it will shrink, but then when it warms up it inflates again, the volume of air doesn't change, it just becomes more compact and need less area to exist. so in theory you could get more air into the engine if its colder? feel free to shoot me down No need to shoot you down. You are flying high at the moment, live it up mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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