RaceLogic Traction Control

[Doughie]

It's your loss Ash.   you could have won a fiver !

when are you going to make your expert services & knowledge of mkiv's available to the cash-rich group on this list ?   i.e. work on members cars ?  Leon is up to his eyeballs as usual.

 

now J's car is more or less sorted i would have thought you'd have some cash-earning time on your hands.

[Phil Wall]

Anal retentive? Perfectionist? Or just plain nuts?

 

Who cares I fond the illusive figure 48 pulses per revolution. This is the number of pulses produce by the MKIV sensors.

 

By putting this figure along with the actual diameter of your tires, RLTC will perform better than when running on the settings provided by RL. Even cars with TC fitted by RL do not have these  figures, IMO they have made alterations to other setting to compensate for this error.

 

The car feels more alive, more grunt, more aggression, more power out of corners.  

 

My old RL settings, settings in most other units owned by members on this BBS, were strangling my car. I thought RLTC was good before, but with the correct settings for the wheels it is even better.

 

To enable you to share this experience I have introduced this  free limited period offer.

 

If you have RLTC send me your tire makes and sizes front and rear  before the end of the week,  I will send you a dat file suited to your car. If you have RLTC on order you will not have this data provide by RL so get this file in advance.

 

Obviously you use the file at your own risk etc blah blah blah.

 

E-mail or message with your e-mail address and  details.

 

 

 

 

(Edited by Phil Wall at 10:29 pm on Nov. 13, 2001)

[Doughie]

Phil's right - I called Racelogic's technical dept. myself yesterday and they did not know the Pulses per revolution from the ABS system which is the only data source that RL uses to determine the differing wheel speeds !

 

So this is key info.     nice one Phil for counting teeth in the cold and dark for the benefit of everyone with RL TC !!

[Guest Ash]

Quote: from Doughie on 9:56 pm on Nov. 13, 2001[br]It's your loss Ash.   you could have won a fiver !

when are you going to make your expert services & knowledge of mkiv's available to the cash-rich group on this list ?   i.e. work on members cars ?  Leon is up to his eyeballs as usual.

 

now J's car is more or less sorted i would have thought you'd have some cash-earning time on your hands.

 

 

Sorry, Doughie, but I really cannot afford to work on cars full time. Plus, I need to get back to working on my own car.

 

There is also the situation where I'm being asked to fit components that I don't really believe in. Like HKS filters under the bonnet, and so forth. If I were to continue, some bright spark would come out with, "If you don't agree to fitting the filter in the engine-bay then how come you did this with so and so, and so and so's car."

 

Then there is the situation where a bolt-on component is ill thought out and/or contains flaws. I will spend hours and hours on some "thing" making it fit and look great. Then someone comes along, takes one look and thinks, "Hey that looks good, I'll definitely buy one of those." In the event, all I have ended up doing, is spend my valuable time enhancing what was some piece of bolt-on rubbish only to make it look more appealing and more saleable... not for me, but for the company who originally sold the product.

 

I have been down the bolt-on route with my own car. Spent a *lot* of time and money only to rip the whole lot out and start again. Now, my ultimate goal is a 750HP supercharged monster... fitted with not one bolt-on performance part from the likes of HKS.

 

Yours,

J

[Branners]

okay, finally got my laptop plugged in to my RLTC and downloaded the settings and sent the file across to Phil for analysis. I also uploaded Phils file from last week and the TC behaves much better now. The cut is nowhere near as severe, I just need to work out which setting I am comfortable with now as I used to use 10% slip almost all the time, with DRY being used when it was very wet.

 

Im sure Phil can update everybody on the settings that were in my file..

 

JB

[Phil Wall]

 

Im sure Phil can update everybody on the settings that were in my file..

 

 

 

CRAP

 

Full cut all the time,  min rpm 1500 rather low!

 

I don't know how you managed to go a. anywhere  John.

 

 

(Edited by Phil Wall at 8:28 pm on Nov. 15, 2001)

[Phil Wall]

Anyone wanting a copy of the settings should send a copy of their interal dat file so I can add the settings to that.  

 

All other files sent  will contain my wheel configuration figures. You will have to do the 180 degree corner configuration run to set the sytem to your car.

[Doughie]

OK had my Racelogic Traction Control system fitted yesterday and it seems to work perfectly !   :)

 

It was damp/wet roads on the drive back home so i could test it out a bit.    The soft-cut level is really quite unobtrusive and doesn't distract from the driving.

 

For the settings, I used essentially a version of Martin Fahie's DAT file.  The items that will vary from car to car is the "reference / driven" wheels check-boxes, and also the "Side Assignment" section.  

 

Calibration Procedure notes for others :

1) After installing RLTC, Calibrate as per the RL TC manual.   Once this is done, then connect a laptop to the RL TC system and load into Graham Rudd's nice applet (thanks Graham !) the settings from the RL TC system that has just finished being calibrated.

 

2) From this file, *note the settings in the lower half of the "Wheel Speed Sensor" tab*   (in Graham Rudd's RLTC Settings.exe applet).

 

3) Then insert a floppy disk with a *known decent DAT file*, and edit the "Wheel Speed Sensor" settings on this "decent" file as per what you've just noted above in step 2.

 

4) Then save this file as a new DAT name, and Transmit it to the RL TC system so that's it's the 'live' file on the RLTC system.

 

In this way, you will have the correct settings all saved, and transmitted to the RL TC system.

 

One key note here is that we did think that the settings already pre-loaded onto the "Supra group-buy" RL TC system, were there or thereabouts.

Well, THEY ARE NOT !!    The RL TC system came set up for a 4-cylinder came, NO cut-tables etc.etc.

Bottom line is after installation and calibration then you MUST load onto it a decent DAT file (Phil Wall or myself can supply decent DAT file).    The system just will not work properly at all unless you use the right settings.   you can't just "Calibrate and Go" - gotta load on a suitable DAT file for the Supra.

 

Phil and I between us worked out the settings for the following items and these *do seem to work fine* so i would recommend them :

Wheel Diameter driven : 636  (for 255/40/17's)

Wheel Diameter Reference : 643   (for 235/45/17's)

Pulses / Rev Driven : 48

Pulses / Rev Reference : 48

 

It's easy to work out your own correct wheel diameters using schoolboy maths, Pi=3.14, etc.   remember that the "wheel diameter" is actually "wheel PLUS tyre" diameter.    i.e. the "rolling diameter".

 

 

Finally a very big thanks to Martin Fahie for his expert RL installation yesterday.    He is very thorough and careful and did a quality job for a very reasonable fee.    I can recommend him highly to anyone for this job (though not sure if he wants to do any more !!).   Thanks also to Emma for a fab full English Breakfast, multiple coffees, and lunch too.

 

 

 

(Edited by Doughie at 4:53 pm on Nov. 18, 2001)

 

 

(Edited by Doughie at 10:32 am on Nov. 19, 2001)

[Gareth Davies]

Thanks for all the info people, it'll be nice to have a decent setup to load on when I get round to fitting mine (after i've checked the ECU wiring with mines).

 

I think it would be a good idea to host some of this information in the faq, or at least have the file somewhere on mkivsupra.net so people can download it when they need it.

 

Wonder how many people are trundling around on the wrong setup?

[GavinL]

Quote: from Doughie on 11:25 am on Nov. 18, 2001[br Thanks also to Emma for a fab full English Breakfast, multiple coffees, and lunch too.

 

(Edited by Doughie at 4:53 pm on Nov. 18, 2001)

 

You lucky Ba$tard, certainly beats the boring, tedious 6 hours install I had too endure at Racelogic .  

 

 

 

BTW Phil...have you advised Julian at Racelogic of your discoveries.

 

 

[Phil Wall]

 

BTW Phil...have you advised Julian at Racelogic of your discoveries.

 

 

 

Not yet, I want  to hear from a few people who use the new settings before, I contact RL.  The file they Gave me for the  "Supra" worked, even with the wrong settings.  I a pretty certain we have a superior set up but would like my on opinion backed up by a few members.

 

When others confirm we have a better set-up I will offer the information.

 

 

[Guest Ash]

 

No way should you offer the info, Phil.

 

I called Racelogic about the settings before I fitted Justin's RLTC. They told me categorically that the stock settings were ideal for the MKIV Supra.

 

Now I know they were talking complete claptrap.

 

Shortly after fitting, I got Justin on my case saying the car is sliding around in WET mode and next he spins it on a roundabout.

 

Those bast*rds should be sued.

 

Yours,

J

[Doughie]

after my RL TC was installed yesterday we *immediately* saved the pre-loaded settings to a new DAT file.    When we looked at the DAT file, it showed it was set-up for 4-cylinder engine, with no soft-cut, mo medium-cut, and no hard-cut.  (in the sense that these were ALL set to "complete cut".)

 

so i don't know if RL forget to pre-load the supra group-buy with their interpretation of the Supra settings, but it certainly seems that way as clearly using a system set-up for a 4-cylinder car on a Supra won't work very well..........

 

[Phil Wall]

Quote: from Doughie on 8:15 pm on Nov. 18, 2001[br]after my RL TC was installed yesterday we *immediately* saved the pre-loaded settings to a new DAT file.    When we looked at the DAT file, it showed it was set-up for 4-cylinder engine, with no soft-cut, mo medium-cut, and no hard-cut.  (in the sense that these were ALL set to "complete cut".)

 

so i don't know if RL forget to pre-load the supra group-buy with their interpretation of the Supra settings, but it certainly seems that way as clearly using a system set-up for a 4-cylinder car on a Supra won't work very well..........

 

 

My RLTC was  one of the first  Shop! group buy's.  I don’t know how many cylinders was in my installed set-up. Due to laptop problems, I corrupted the file and got one e-mailed from RL. It is that  file I had  been running  until I found out about  the  tire/pulse error, last week.  The  file worked  OK.

 

 

 

 

(Edited by Phil Wall at 10:14 pm on Nov. 18, 2001)

[Graham Rudd]

Mine was also set up as 4 cylinders, as were the 300zx group's by the looks of it.

 

 

Graham

[Doughie]

Well it's clear to me that Racelogic SHOULD have done one of these two things :

 

1) Make it explicitly clear in the RL TC manual (as part of the calibration / setup section) that the system is set up for a 4-cylinder car with no injector-cut tables etc. and that you MUST load in a more appropriate file for your car before use, or edit the settings prior to use.

 

2) Pre-loaded the RL TC unit with the correct Supra file as they knew it was a Supra group-buy.

 

Neither of the above was done in my case, and it was just down to my interest in the system that we found that the settings pre-loaded were unusable, and took action to get the right settings in the unit.

 

I believe that Racelogic should either :

i) pre-load the system with the appropriate settings for the car that it's being bought for

 

OR

 

ii) change the manual to make it much clearer that it's set-up for a 4-cylinder car with no cut settings etc

 

OR (maybe the best option i think)

 

iii) On the supplied floppy, supply 20 or 30 different DAT files specific for 20 or 30 different cars.    The files are very small (

Then the user simply loads the DAT file that matches his car.

 

 

[Doughie]

By the way, I assume now that someone has supplied to Ash / Justin a decent DAT file for loading into his RL TC unit ??

 

If not, let me know and i can email one over.

We don't want Justin ending up in a hedge somewhere in the rain.

[GavinL]

 

In view of all the comments concerning the DAT file supplied for the group buy I think that Racelogic should be informed so they have the opportunity to comment, clarify....whatever.

 

 

 

 

 

 

(Edited by GavinL at 11:43 am on Nov. 19, 2001)

[Doughie]

I agree.

 

we shouldn't make a mountain out of a mole-hill here (or even "accuse" RL of anything), but simply ask RL why their system came pre-loaded with no cut tables, 4-cylinder car etc.   If a buyer wasn't into the technical side of it, they'd just give it to their local trusted car electrician/mechanic and he'd just fit it and nobody would be any the wiser that the settings were wholly wrong .... except that the system wouldn't work properly at all.

[Branners]

hmm, you might also want to check with J as to which package you were sent. I know J ordered some extra RLTC units which were not specifically for the Supras, and I bought one of those spares which could explain why I didnt have the right settings. If you also bought one of the last sets from J then it could be thats why you got the same settings as me.

 

JB

[Guest Ash]

 

 

Well, it still does not explain how Racelogic can categorically say to me, on the telephone, that the stock settings are perfect for the MKIV. Now it turns out that statement is total boll*cks.  

 

I have yet to read the settings in JF's RLTC. But the fact that when another member called them, and they didn't even know the pulses-per-rev of the wheel sensors, tells me everything about what program settings I am going to find.

 

Yours,

J