supratoy Posted March 14, 2006 Share Posted March 14, 2006 Hi, My car is at a garage getting set-up at the moment after getting some hybirds, 650cc inj, power fc(yeah if I had the chance to do it again I would go single:blink: anyways) I have been told that the cars map sensor is only good for 1bar of boost, however it ran 1.2 bar before so whats the deal here? please help o might supraowners Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_have Posted March 14, 2006 Share Posted March 14, 2006 If it sees more than 1 bar it will max out the injectors (wether it is 1bar 1.5 bar and so on) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supratoy Posted March 14, 2006 Author Share Posted March 14, 2006 But how come I see people running 1.3bar with smaller injectors or am I heading the wrong direction? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonB Posted March 14, 2006 Share Posted March 14, 2006 Because the standard fuelling at 1 BAR is rich enough (just about) to support 1.2BAR. Any more and you need something like an Emanage which has its own pressure sensor to augment the stock one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supratoy Posted March 14, 2006 Author Share Posted March 14, 2006 I'am getting a bit confused If I want to run more boost I need a new map sensor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonB Posted March 14, 2006 Share Posted March 14, 2006 The stock MAP sensor is good up to about 1.2BAR, can't remember exactly. After that you will need a different MAP sensor yes. Don't know anything about the Power FC, so I don't know which ones are suitable for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyefi Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 if you want to accurately fuel over 1.2 bar you need another MAP sensor. you can fudge it to run rich at 1.2 which would still give enough fuel for 1.3. i do not recommend this. apexi do a drop in replacement that is already setup in the powerfc if you have the commander. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 Ahhh so this thread goes with Getrag's one... Right so do they think it's MAF or Map?? I thought the PFC had a built in map sensor? If not you you need an aftermarket 3/5bar map sensor that's compatible with the PFC. It should say in the instructions... From the other thread I thought you couldn't boost over 1 bar...but now I realise you can't map the PFC cause you're using the stock sensor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 I have no idea on the PFC, some ecu's have built in sensors, others external, but either way they should be able to add an suitable sensor. Eyefi is best person to ask on this. OT, Eyefi, still looking for the MF2, two last boxes to look in this weekend mate otherwise its been thrown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyefi Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 OT, Eyefi, still looking for the MF2, two last boxes to look in this weekend mate otherwise its been thrown cheers fella. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supratoy Posted March 15, 2006 Author Share Posted March 15, 2006 Hi, yeah this is the one that links to getrags( thanks getrag for helping me out ) They said its a map sensor and I might need a new one to run more boost. I thought I would ask you guys to see if they where telling the truth. So they are thank god So where can I buy this replacement item? I have the commander. thanks for the info peeps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 http://www.apexi-usa.com/product_electronics_detail.asp?id=197&pageNum=1 send them a mail mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bijal Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 the stock map sensor on the j spec mkiv supras can handle up to 1.6bar of boost on the stock ecu. we have tested this on our car last year. we had single turbo, large injectors, safc 2 setup etc. the car ran fine up to 1.6 bar of boost on the stock (standard) ECU and stock map sensor. then we replaced the stock ecu with an aftermarket ecu (Toms Racing of Japan) and we were able to boost above 1.6 bar and the highest we went to and recorded was 1.85bar of boost with no issues. in the end we just bunged the aem ems with 5bar. i hope that helps towards your research... bijal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supratoy Posted March 15, 2006 Author Share Posted March 15, 2006 thanks alot mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 the stock map sensor on the j spec mkiv supras can handle up to 1.6bar of boost on the stock ecu. we have tested this on our car last year. we had single turbo, large injectors, safc 2 setup etc. the car ran fine up to 1.6 bar of boost on the stock (standard) ECU and stock map sensor. then we replaced the stock ecu with an aftermarket ecu (Toms Racing of Japan) and we were able to boost above 1.6 bar and the highest we recorded was 1.85bar of boost with no issues. in the end we just bunged the aem ems with 5bar. i hope that helps towards your research... bijal Hmmm I've not seen resolution above 1.25 bar....what voltage did you get at 1.6bar? It wasn't cause it was clamped by an FCD was it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bijal Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 Hmmm I've not seen resolution above 1.25 bar....what voltage did you get at 1.6bar? It wasn't cause it was clamped by an FCD was it? honestly, we never checked the voltage. bijal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 honestly, we never checked the voltage. bijal As Alex said, always thought the stock MAP sensor was maxed out at 1.3 bar. There is a denso one that is a direct replacement for the stock which reads upto 3 bar AFAIK, but you would need to alter the perameters in the ECU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bijal Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 As Alex said, always thought the stock MAP sensor was maxed out at 1.3 bar. thats right, most people assume that. we did the same, assume. i ran 1.4 bar on the stock turbos for a long time (with safc 2). when it was mapped properly the fueling was always spot on. hope that helps. bijal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 thats right, most people assume that. we did the same, assume. i ran 1.4 bar on the stock turbos for a long time (with safc 2). when it was mapped properly the fueling was always spot on. hope that helps. bijal It was Pete at Thor who told me that after much testing, so he must have been wrong? We need the voltages really to confirm though. We ran 2 bar on Dudes car with the stock MAP sensor, doesnt mean it wasnt maxed out though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyefi Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 the stock MAP sensor is a 2bar sensor, the voltage is maxxed at around 1.2 after that any extra fueling comes from the increased rail pressure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 The stock map sensor runs out of range at 1.2bar. It can read up to 1.25 but it's erratic and nonlinear at that point so I wouldn't rely on it. If you think it reads up to 1.6bar then you are mistaken. With an AFC, your car may fuel OK if mapped for 1.6bar but it'll run progressively richer as boost drops off because the signal from the MAP sensor is still flat out at 4.9v so the load site remains the same. Apart from the fuel pressure dropping which will alleviate the overfuelling somewhat. This happens until you get lower 1.2bar, whereupon the MAP sensor starts kicking out a lower voltage signal as it's back in range. -Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supratoy Posted March 15, 2006 Author Share Posted March 15, 2006 After going back to the garage today they have got it running at 1.3 bar, the 1 bar was a mistake by them But after reading the info you guys have put up, just wondering if it's 1.2, 1.25 or 1.3 bar that the MAP sensor is max out at? Also is the 1st turbo ok to run 1 bar of boost? thanks for the info so far peeps, keep them coming Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 When both turbo's are online they push the same pressure...so yes it's ok for the first turbo to run over 1bar (post transition...pre transition and running on the first only I'd run a max of 0.8bar). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supratoy Posted March 16, 2006 Author Share Posted March 16, 2006 Cool, thanks alex Thank for the help everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 Ummmm I'm actually gonna have to disagree with Alex there - it's not OK for the first turbo to run over 1bar of boost, in fact 1 bar is too much for it's little legs... I ran 1bar on mine many moons ago and felt a noticeable power falloff. 0.8bar is the most you want to run I'd say, unless you've got dyno runs to show it actually makes more power at 1+bar -Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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