Syed Shah Posted December 15, 2001 Share Posted December 15, 2001 Was the car alright then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flipfinger Posted December 15, 2001 Author Share Posted December 15, 2001 A bit frosty, and had a minor scare when the air-con wouldn't start (twas because the car by default starts with the blowers on rather than the air-con) but otherwise fine! Those Clifford alarms are good - battery had very little juice left in it, but it still gave my ears a bashing when we disconnected it without engaging Valet Mode Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syed Shah Posted December 15, 2001 Share Posted December 15, 2001 Glad to hear its OK Since your going to be leaving it for months at a time, you should consider an uprated battery, i know i am now its winter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flipfinger Posted December 15, 2001 Author Share Posted December 15, 2001 No problems on that score - got about 5 people begging me to leave it with them so they can take care of it and give it a run now and then! Does everyone else garage theirs? My garage is too narrow...and full of crap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted December 15, 2001 Share Posted December 15, 2001 Glad to hear your car was ok. Steve, in answer to you questions; I have not physically "seen" any damage caused by jumping or bumbing a car although I do get so many cars in that have been started that way and when they come in, they need resetting. I have had a few, (3 maybe 4 in 8 years), that never go again or need to be sent away for repair. Upon repair they have either had diodes replaced or processors. (At least, that's what the repair reports state.) I have seen a melted microchip, (processor), on a Clifford immobiliser board after a garage boost started a car. Yes, a car battery does act as a dampener. The problem when jumping is a the massive, or potentially massive upsurge of voltage. If a battery is so flat the interior light is dim and almost goes out when you switch on the ignition, your battery is probably resting on around 7 volts. If you were to connect this battery to an already running car you would be more than doubling the voltage in a split second. This is when processors can lock up. Yes, most micro circuits run on 5v and yes they generally are controlled/fed through regulators. These regulators are designed to operate at tolerences around 10.5-16volts - Not 7ish or so... All ECU's will generally do a quick self test when they are first energised, so going from 0v to 12v is not a problem. In fact this a good thing. it can reset the processor to it's intended state and it can begin to learn/operate again. The problems arise when the operating voltage goes outside the normal operating/designed voltage. Something I don't know and would love somebody to explain to me is; what makes normal standard fit ecu's more resilient to these voltage changes. It is usually the aftermarket products that suffer the problems ie. Audio head units, navigation systems, alarms, immobilisers... All the bloody things I fit!!! :o Most of the info I have described above I have learned from the likes of Clifford, Toad, Alpine and a few others... I don't claim to be an expert and certainly don't know the in's and out's of microprocessors, but what I've described hopefully makes sense and answers your questions... Matt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syed Shah Posted December 15, 2001 Share Posted December 15, 2001 Flip.... Yep i keep both my MKIVs garaged, you should clear your garage up and put it in, especially as not leave it there for long periods. And if you want, i can look after your car :biggrin: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Martin F Posted December 15, 2001 Share Posted December 15, 2001 Also to add to the damaged equipment list are car kits for mobiles and those in-car charger leads. I have had to repair quite a few of these in my time which seem to show the signs of having a voltage spike entering them. Sometimes they are easy to repair by replacing a zener diode or similar, sometimes the excess current fries tracks. In answer to your question Matt, i think the manufacturers of aftermarket equipment design in protection within the circuit which is non-resettable i.e. a zener diode, and find this adequate for the amount of time the protection is required. Whereas the ECU manufactuers seem to feel otherwise. I guess it comes down to that old devil cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted December 15, 2001 Share Posted December 15, 2001 Yes Martin, I've come across the phone problems as well. You've probably hit the nail on the head with the cost thing. I'd put money on almost any ECU in the Supra costing more than an alarm ECU, no matter how simple. My car isn't garaged either... Same problem as you. By the way, Mr Flipfinger... How'd your evening go? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon F Posted December 15, 2001 Share Posted December 15, 2001 I have a 'standard' size garage and that is big enough for a Supra provided there is nothing else in it. Get rid of all the crap, and paint the garage walls and floors......doesn't take long and looks the dogs. I only use my Supra occasionally but leave an 'optimate' battery charger permantly connected when it is in the garage. The battery is then always fully charged when I want to use the car.:smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flipfinger Posted December 16, 2001 Author Share Posted December 16, 2001 Quote: from Matt Harwood on 10:36 pm on Dec. 15, 2001[br] By the way, Mr Flipfinger... How'd your evening go? That is all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Cargill Posted December 16, 2001 Share Posted December 16, 2001 Thanks for the comprehensive reply Matt. I'm still not sure I understand why raising a DC volatge up to the normal working voltage would cause something to blow, but I'll take it as read that it causes things to sometimes blow. I'd gp along with the theory about the quality of electronics in manufactures electronics against third party add-ons that will undoubtably have a much lower buget and smaller consequences in terms of replacment after a problem. The ones that you mentioned that needed resetting after a jump start, could that have been purely caused by it effectively being disconnected? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted December 16, 2001 Share Posted December 16, 2001 I thinks, and this is pure speculation, that perhaps some processors/regulators may be able to adjust themselves to cater for the variable voltages in a cars electrical enviroment. I think its that "jolt" that knocks them out. - (Not very technical is it!) In answer to your question about being disconnected... Very possibly. Occasionally, when installing something, the first time it is powered up it may not operated correctly. The usual disconnect/reconnect usually cures it. To keep things in perspective, bear in mind that I would guess you could jump start 100 cars and only have problems with 5 of them. In winter, when this problem is more common, we get at least 1 call a week relating to this. But, we must get about 50 or more calls and probably a similar number of customers walking into our shop every day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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