Jake Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Don't need an essay on it, common sense it is. This country is heading toward the nanny state. Drive slow where accident likely to occur Perhaps everyone doesn't drive as carefully as you. We had this new member once that that lost control of his Supra on a 40mph limit road, went across a pavement and into a wall - writing off his car. Hmmmm, what was that guy's name? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Man Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 crash and learn, I do now drive very carefully, most of the time It is a 30mph road and no one was hurt. Should goverment ban supra because it can lose the back end from stationary to 30mph? No car around and a straight road after the bend. Only had the car for a few week and testing went not so well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLicense Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 OK so no ban for bull bars, but lessons on safe driving and how to look both ways before crossing the road. Fair enough. But ban on guns? Why not any education on how to use them safely and at an appropriate time and place (ie on a shooting range) I know extremes, but I'm interested to see where your particular line is drawn. Would your ban on guns be more to do with the likelyhood of intentional misuse, than the risk of an accident? I know this is going off topic, but like I said, I'm just interested to see your viewpoint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tannhauser Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Don't need an essay on it, common sense it is. Is that something Yoda said? Anyway.... I know what you mean about 'ban this and ban that' and I agree that there is a tendency to try to ban everything remotely dangerous. But in this instance, I think it is common sense. Bull bars are a fashion accessory. There's no other good reason for sticking them on in the UK. They will cause greater injury compared to a standard bumper. I agree that it's restricting individual freedom but it seems such a petty one to get the hump about compared to the benefits. It's ridiculous to imply that if we 'taught common sense' that this would eliminate accidents. You could teach whatever you like instead of GCSE and A-Levels, but over-excited kids, dumb dogs and confused elderly people will still appear from nowhere in the road in front of you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Should goverment ban supra because it can lose the back end from stationary to 30mph? No car around and a straight road after the bend. Only had the car for a few week and testing went not so well.Ban the car because the driver is incapable of keeping it off the pavement at 30mph? No, it's not the car they should ban. I remember you telling us that you're in the top ten percent of the population (whatever that means) but in my opinion you're wrong on this one. It's not OK to bolt pointless shiny crap on the front of your car if it significantly increases its danger to the general public. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Man Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Why not any education on how to use them safely and at an appropriate time and place (ie on a shooting range) wtf? It just doesn't sound right. Bull bars are a fashion accessory. There's no other good reason for sticking them on in the UK. They will cause greater injury compared to a standard bumper. spear in the front ban agree, bullbars I know it is bad but ban? nah I don't mean class teaching common sense, it doesn't work that way. More a culture thing like kitten learn to clean themself from mother....jeez its getting deep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doughie Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 OK my 2 cents. i'm far less diplomatic than others on this board....i'm afraid China-Man that you have an exceptionally selfish attitiude on this. Bull-bars are, in this country, a pure cosmetic add-on. They need them in Australia where they get kangaroos, wild horses and buffalo on the road in the Outback (i was in Australia last year and ALL of the above ran across the road in front of me). There are no buffalo in the UK and so these add-ons are just to make your vehicle look cool. Nothing wrong with you or your vehicle looking cool, but NOT at the expense of killing or seriously injuring a pedestrian that has, for whatever reason, doesn't matter whose fault, impacted the front of your vehicle. Thes things massively increase chance of death. I myself hit the front of a car in an accident a couple of years ago, and it snapped my left leg in half. Completely in half. I had bolts in my leg for 1.5years. All because the guy hadn't been paying attention to what was in front of him. Now, fortunately the chap didn't have bull-bars on his car cos if he had i'd have smashed my pelvis for sure, probably had to have leg amputated and may well have died or had other massive internal haemorrhaging. Before they lifted me off the road (& i was screaming) the cops said before i was carted off "there's a LOT of damage to the car." They didn't know at the time that the only thing that hit the front of that car was me. I'm glad there was a lot of damage to the car, cos it saved my body from even MORE damage. As it is, my left leg is now permanently shorter than my right, i have to wear a built-up shoe for rest of my life (i'm in my 30's) and i have a massively increased risk of having to have total hip replacement in the next few years. Getting hit by a car isn't fun at all, and if your mindset China Man is to bolt on some shiny solid steel object to the front of your car just cos it looks cool and fukc the pedestians you kill then, i politely suggest to you sir, to go on ebay and try to buy yourself a new brain. regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Man Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 top ten percent of the population yeah, that was long time ago I think. About having a degree. I was just saying what my Professor told the class on that day. I was doing my Master at Uni and this professor was saying that you are the 10% top in the education system and it is your job to be at the front line of research and not studying what there is in the text book anymore....... doesn't mean top 10% in the human race , just mean in the research front I guess Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Nevermind that now mate, read Dougie's post! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Man Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Sorry doughie for your personal experience. Like the other member said earlier if it was my kid who was involved I would be pissed off as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLicense Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 wtf? It just doesn't sound right. I guess the point I think you're trying to make is it's up to any individual to look after themselves? Yeah? My personal opinion is that there are very few "shades of grey". Once you've subscribed to that kind of mentality, I think it then becomes massively hypocritical to complain about anything that happens due to someone elses shade of grey being "slightly darker". But hey that's what we have laws for eh? I guess it's just down to the governments perception that determines what the acceptable shade is for the public. The view from the moral high-ground is fantastic! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Man Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 I just wish people would use common sense more on stuff like this. I am not pro bullbars activist and it is not my aim to bolt things infront of my car and fcuk all pedestians. Ban bullbars will reduce kill rate but it will not stop anymore accident that happened to Doughie. We now have more TV ads showing shocking videos of kids paying attention to mobile phone and not on the road, drink driving, drive when tried etc. Thats the way forward because that will reduce accident happening in the first place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLicense Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Ban bullbars will reduce kill rate but it will not stop anymore accident Very true. But banning them does have very little downsides, but the potential upsides do seem quite large. I agree we need to promote common sense. With that common sense, I personally would not fit bullbars to my car. However as you quite rightly pointed out, the level of common sense is low. So isn't that the time to enforce it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Man Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 I am afraid you can't enforce common sense. Banning bullbars have immediate benefit like more people with broken leg instead of death. If we can enforce common sense then there will be no broken leg or death all together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLicense Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 I personally disagree. Whilst you can't instill common sense into people, you can force it upon them with laws etc. The law says you have to fit brakes to a road car. Common sense idea, and it's enforced. Some would say that all the law ever does is lay down what the governments perception of common sense is. What you can't enforce is prevention of accidents. Accidents will always happen, so we should use common sense to reduce the impact that they have on peoples lives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Man Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Death rate increase with the the speed of car impact on pedestians. I have been told I was selfish and get a new brain because I said I would get a bullbars because it looks cool. yet all of us choose to drive super car which in this country serve no perpose other than your joy since all the roads are limited to 30mph and max 75mph. Sorry for those who only drive supra on Tracks and strips and don't drive there but tow there. Should not the goverment limit all cars to 75mph max physically or even better less than 100hp? We add stuff to our cars that will let us achieve 60mph in less than 5-4s and are we not as guity as people put bullsbar on their 4x4? Supra doing 60mph in 4 second kill a kid and the police tell the parent that if it is a ford which can't go that quick it may spare his life? Reduce speed can reduce death rate and accident rate where bullbars only reduce death rate. Common sense to ban that car from doing high accceration and speed surely? You can force it upon them with law, no. people still decat and delimit their car yet it is common sense that pollution kills the enviroment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLicense Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Of course you can force it by law. If a law comes out that says bull bars are illegal, then that's going to be forced onto people. Speed kills, you're right. That's why we have enforced speed limits. The fact that people refuse to ignore that law at their own will is a completely different matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raymanuk Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Bull bars are an accessory in this country full stop. In an accident the person without the bull bars will come off worse. Banning them in this country I would have to agree since there is no real need to have them. I would like to know where people would draw the line with what else should you ban on cars, modifying wise? Should we all start driving slow cars that are more pedestrian and accident friendly? Should motorbikes be banned? 20% of accidents involve motorbikes even though motorbikes only take up 1% of the total number of vehicles on the roads? (figures from the UK department of transport) Should alcohol be banned? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ark Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Alcohol is already (as good as) banned when you are driving... And new cars are subject to increasing legal safety standards, including pedestrian crash tests, as well as emissions. People will always drive like idiots - making it more difficult to get tools that magnify the effects of that idiocy can only be a good thing. Oh, and I'm not surprised that bikers are involved in a higher proportion of accidents, because they seem to have a higher than average "drive like a twat" rating - I had two of them overtake me togethher this morning, round a bend, on the crest of a hill, with on-coming traffic - I mean, if that isn't the _worst_ time to pass someone, then when is??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Peace Posted February 2, 2006 Author Share Posted February 2, 2006 . Bull-bars are, in this country, a pure cosmetic add-on. They need them in Australia where they get kangaroos, wild horses and buffalo on the road in the Outback (i was in Australia last year and ALL of the above ran across the road in front of me). There are no buffalo in the UK and so these add-ons are just to make your vehicle look cool. Nothing wrong with you or your vehicle looking cool, but NOT at the expense of killing or seriously injuring a pedestrian that has, for whatever reason, doesn't matter whose fault, impacted the front of your vehicle. Thes things massively increase chance of death. I myself hit the front of a car in an accident a couple of years ago, and it snapped my left leg in half. Completely in half. I had bolts in my leg for 1.5years. All because the guy hadn't been paying attention to what was in front of him. Now, fortunately the chap didn't have bull-bars on his car cos if he had i'd have smashed my pelvis for sure, probably had to have leg amputated and may well have died or had other massive internal haemorrhaging. Before they lifted me off the road (& i was screaming) the cops said before i was carted off "there's a LOT of damage to the car." They didn't know at the time that the only thing that hit the front of that car was me. I'm glad there was a lot of damage to the car, cos it saved my body from even MORE damage. As it is, my left leg is now permanently shorter than my right, i have to wear a built-up shoe for rest of my life (i'm in my 30's) and i have a massively increased risk of having to have total hip replacement in the next few years. Getting hit by a car isn't fun at all, and if your mindset China Man is to bolt on some shiny solid steel object to the front of your car just cos it looks cool and fukc the pedestians you kill then, i politely suggest to you sir, to go on ebay and try to buy yourself a new brain. regards Im really sorry to hear of your accident and yes had you hit bullbars things would most certainly of been worse I guess! I do a lot of driving to places in Europe where there are wild animals, there are aspects of driving that are more dangerous than owning a set of bullbars for cosmetic reasons or otherwise, I was going to use them as a mount also for a camera on the French gumball that im filming, but there are other ways round this... Listening to all your points I have deceided not to get them now..but i can see Chinas point..we cant ban everything, if you get hit by a bus or a truck ya going to be a gonna..but cant ban them...although some local councils ban Trucks through some villages. I am planning to use my vehicle off road and to carry camera sound and lighting gear in, i wanted the versatility of a vehicle that had little or no bounderies as to where it will go..its not going to be a fashon assesory..it will get used for what it is designed for..unlike most on our roads. I have seen plastic bull bars on some and they can look pretty good, half the reason was so i could mount some spot lights on them..i will look into plastic ones..cant find any at the mo...! Si Keep it Green:rlol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terribleturner Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Get some made of polystyrene Simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Peace Posted February 2, 2006 Author Share Posted February 2, 2006 Get some made of polystyrene Simon ahhh hate that squeeking noise that polystyrene makes Naaa James, how bout the chrome ones with a couple of bulls horns sticking out to impale any small children that get in my way:boxing: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Need4Speed Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Like wings on Corsas, they serve no purpose other than as a styling item of dubious value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Man Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 lol, I would keep Dougie experience in mind if I do get a 4x4. I will think twice before adding a bullbars for sure and as I grow older I become more considerate anyway. Still, I think some 4x4 looks good with it some don't. If I get a x5 or Lexus then I won't bother because I see them more of a city car than off road. Green peace, I happened to be thinking of adding a camcorder and do a mock top gear for the supra. I found a site which sell camera mount with strong suckers that you can mount it inside or outside of the car body or glass. I can dig out the link if you want. Fifth gear and top gear used the same company mount as the one I found. I am not a activist that oppose any goverment ban or policy. I am just a person that not worry to speak out on issues. I thank everyones constructive comments and I will ignore anything else Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Peace Posted February 2, 2006 Author Share Posted February 2, 2006 lol, I would keep Dougie experience in mind if I do get a 4x4. I will think twice before adding a bullbars for sure and as I grow older I become more considerate anyway. Still, I think some 4x4 looks good with it some don't. If I get a x5 or Lexus then I won't bother because I see them more of a city car than off road. Green peace, I happened to be thinking of adding a camcorder and do a mock top gear for the supra. I found a site which sell camera mount with strong suckers that you can mount it inside or outside of the car body or glass. I can dig out the link if you want. Fifth gear and top gear used the same company mount as the one I found. I am not a activist that oppose any goverment ban or policy. I am just a person that not worry to speak out on issues. I thank everyones constructive comments and I will ignore anything else Na you are cool China I met you..you are a good bloke..bullbars are well cool they are to 4x4 what a veilside kit is to Supras..unfortunetley...they are not socially acceptable..the whole 4x4 issue too these days is a controversial one...with 4x4 owners having to justify why they feel they need a huge gas guzzling engine and something that can plough through unspoilt countryside...! only be used to cope with the difficult terrain between suburban sprawl and their local Tescos Mind you...you only have to look at the state of the roads in this country and all the speed humps everywhere and that alone justifys it for me lol. Yeah the suction cups are great..userally about £70 to buy, I hired one once for a drift meet a few years ago...have you got a link? Its never been a worse time to buy a 4x4...i can just see it being vandalised if i take it to the West End..I have read some 4x4 forums where people have had their vehicles attacked..the Supras will have their turn im sure...with decating issues and all that..its only time before any kind of petrol driven vehicle above 2litres will be socially unacceptable! I know the French really hate Range Rovers or Land Rovers and I was told of someone who had theirs vandalised in France..Im not sure it was just the fact that it was a 4x4 or also the fact that it was a British manufactured 4x4...so Im hoping i'll survive with one that dosn't present itself as a class statement! Even people i know who were envioronmentalist types liked my Supra..I think i will lose some friends over my new purchase:sos: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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