To people using Manley 14027-6 rods

[SmuleH]

Anyone here using Manley 14027-6 rods (std, non H-tuff)? If so, what power are you running? 

I had my VVTi GTE built not long ago with Manley 14027-6 rods as at the time everything was on backorder. My goal is around 850whp on E85 (stock comp build, most likely going for an s369). Saw some websites rate them for 800whp, but talked to Manley now and they told me it’s 800 CRANK hp.

Couldn’t really find any dyno sheets using these as understandibly, when the availability is like it should, people go for the H-tuffs. Find it hard to believe they would be just that weak tho? I’ve seen people with Eagles run 1100+whp no problem (tho the beam seems just a tiny bit wider on them, but was told the «finish» om them isn’t as good as the Manleys?

 

Anyone that can shed some light on this? Starting to worry I’ll just end up with some expensive bananas in my engine. 

[Chris Wilson]

It's RPM that kills rods assuming they are of decent design and material for the job at hand. The major strain on a rod and rod bolts  is at the top of its travel as the piston tries to exit the bore.

[Noz]

2 hours ago, Chris Wilson said:

It's RPM that kills rods assuming they are of decent design and material for the job at hand. The major strain on a rod and rod bolts  is at the top of its travel as the piston tries to exit the bore.

This is massively interesting. So you're saying from a stress viewpoint the torque of the combustion provides a lower force than the inertia from the rotation.

Is there a certain rpm you think is usually the triggering point that pushes it beyond ultimate tensile limits.

[Chris Wilson]

Loads (pardon the pun) of stuff on conrod failure modes available on line, from simple to highly technical 3D stress analysis:

 

https://www.enginebuildermag.com/2017/03/preventing-connecting-rod-failures/

[Swampy442]

Please please get rid of this wheel horsepower figure, its pointless because the the ACUTAL hp your engine produces scales up relative the the wheel hp. Your 850 wheel hp might be 1100 actual hp, a completely different build

 

 

 

[Noz]

14 hours ago, Swampy442 said:

Please please get rid of this wheel horsepower figure, its pointless because the the ACUTAL hp your engine produces scales up relative the the wheel hp. Your 850 wheel hp might be 1100 actual hp, a completely different build

 

 

 

This is a culture thing. Sadly don't think you'll ever change it.

I also think a whp is a constant thats used to achieve a hp figure anyway.

I think if you talk about power or torque delivery, but without considering the additional setup variables whp is better than bhp I'd say.

[Burna]

15 hours ago, Swampy442 said:

Please please get rid of this wheel horsepower figure, its pointless because the the ACUTAL hp your engine produces scales up relative the the wheel hp. Your 850 wheel hp might be 1100 actual hp, a completely different build

 

 

 

Wheel horse power is the only figure that matters. 

[Chris Wilson]

Will prices go any higher or should I get rid of it now are the figures that REALLY matter

[Burna]

29 minutes ago, Chris Wilson said:

Will prices go any higher or should I get rid of it now are the figures that REALLY matter

I'm a lifer, so it could be 250,000 and it wouldn't bother me lol

[Style]

On 9/21/2022 at 6:57 PM, Noz said:

This is massively interesting. So you're saying from a stress viewpoint the torque of the combustion provides a lower force than the inertia from the rotation.

Is there a certain rpm you think is usually the triggering point that pushes it beyond ultimate tensile limits.

Depends on the rod and rod bolt choice I believe. You can go for a higher tensile strength on the bolt and a lighter rod to lower the roatating mass.

For a basic build on the relatively heavy Eagle rod with ARP 2000's you'd be wise to stick to around stock rpm imo (which is what I've gone with). Maybe push it to 7k if you're feeling brave. The 625+ ARP bolts allow for a higher ceiling and then a lighter rod allows you to go further again.

Then you have the added dilemma of extended throw if you go for a stroker kit. You need to spend rockstar money if you want to rev a 3.4. 

[Noz]

2 hours ago, Style said:

Depends on the rod and rod bolt choice I believe. You can go for a higher tensile strength on the bolt and a lighter rod to lower the roatating mass.

For a basic build on the relatively heavy Eagle rod with ARP 2000's you'd be wise to stick to around stock rpm imo (which is what I've gone with). Maybe push it to 7k if you're feeling brave. The 625+ ARP bolts allow for a higher ceiling and then a lighter rod allows you to go further again.

Then you have the added dilemma of extended throw if you go for a stroker kit. You need to spend rockstar money if you want to rev a 3.4. 

Revving a stroker is kinda pointless. It's like building 1000hp and wanting 10k rpm on a 76mm turbo. Its just, weird. 

Checklist goals rather than an actual performance objective. Or driveable vehicle.

 

[Style]

24 minutes ago, Noz said:

Revving a stroker is kinda pointless. It's like building 1000hp and wanting 10k rpm on a 76mm turbo. Its just, weird. 

Checklist goals rather than an actual performance objective. Or driveable vehicle.

 

If it's built to suit and keeps making power then why not? Some of the big boi drag racers with billet blocks have them up to 3.2 and revving to what sounds like near 10k

[Noz]

5 minutes ago, Style said:

If it's built to suit and keeps making power then why not? Some of the big boi drag racers with billet blocks have them up to 3.2 and revving to what sounds like near 10k

I'm sure you can go bigger but it's not been properly worked out just tested which is kinda cool.

I know which route I'm going. Everyone has their dream build I suppose