Andy Ven Posted June 2, 2019 Share Posted June 2, 2019 Bleeding the dampers will not affect the issue he is having. They will still extend the same amount and compress the same. It will only effect the dampening performance withib the first 30 miles or so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 Bleeding the dampers will not affect the issue he is having. They will still extend the same amount and compress the same. It will only effect the dampening performance withib the first 30 miles or so /QUOTE] Thanks for clearing that up. Im beginning to think that the Bilsteins have been manufactured incorrectly and the piston rod is too long (bad batch). Its the only plausible explanation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Ven Posted June 2, 2019 Share Posted June 2, 2019 I wouldn’t have thought it would be a bad batch. Tolerance checking wouldnt let a rod go to assembly stages if the rod is over 1mm too long. Either its the wrong damper set or the springs are old and tired or wrong springs altogether Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dash Posted June 2, 2019 Share Posted June 2, 2019 That is the correct part number, really should be a straightforward swa, very strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 I wouldn’t have thought it would be a bad batch. Tolerance checking wouldnt let a rod go to assembly stages if the rod is over 1mm too long. Either its the wrong damper set or the springs are old and tired or wrong springs altogether /QUOTE] But the rod on the Bilsteins is visibly longer that the rod on the stock KYB Toyota shock when fully extended. Its about half an inch longer which is about the amount of play in the spring when fully assembled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Ven Posted June 2, 2019 Share Posted June 2, 2019 Where did you buy the dampers from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 Where did you buy the dampers from? /QUOTE] I bought them from Larkspeed but they came direct from Bilstein it seems looking at the packaging and the paperwork. I was going to buy them from Whifbitz but the price difference was over 50 quid per shock, part numbers are the same though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Ven Posted June 2, 2019 Share Posted June 2, 2019 Do the shocks have the part number either stamped or on a label on them? Possibly shocks could have been packaged in the wrong box. If not then you may have to contact bilstein or where you bought them from and explain you need to know the size they are supposed to be to check if they are correct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 Do the shocks have the part number either stamped or on a label on them? Possibly shocks could have been packaged in the wrong box. If not then you may have to contact bilstein or where you bought them from and explain you need to know the size they are supposed to be to check if they are correct /QUOTE] Yes correct part number is on a sticker on the shock body. Could be the wrong sticker applied to the wrong shock i suppose but the bottom bolt eye to the lower mounting plate is the perfect length when next to the old shocks and its only the piston rod on the Bilsteins thats longer. Ive emailed Bilstein and explained the problem so hopefully will get a reply in the morning, if not ill phone them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Ven Posted June 2, 2019 Share Posted June 2, 2019 Ok, let us know the outcome. will be handy for people who could possibly have the same issue in future Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rider Posted June 2, 2019 Share Posted June 2, 2019 The spring doesn't move when its seated in the lower support and decompressed so surely this can only happen if you actually have shortened/lowered spring and not the OEM spring. There are no specs I could find on the OEM spring other than ship weight of 3.08kg so if you take your spring off you can at least check its weight against the OE one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 Right I took some pics to show what I'm up against not sure if this will work but here goes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 As you can see, not only is the rod longer, the bottom seat is also slightly lower. I'll put a spring on and take a pic of the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 The spring doesn't move when its seated in the lower support and decompressed so surely this can only happen if you actually have shortened/lowered spring and not the OEM spring. There are no specs I could find on the OEM spring other than ship weight of 3.08kg so if you take your spring off you can at least check its weight against the OE one. The springs are deffo original Toyota springs. I even have a spare spring not off this car and they are all the same size Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 Heres with the spring on. I can remove the top mount with no spring compressors and with everything bolted together the spring can be turned on the shock easily and rattles around Turned the base by hand You can see that the spring is exerting no pressure on the mounts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 If anybody can measure the length of one if their j speec springs id appreciate it. Mine is about 11 and 1/4 inches uncompressed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted June 2, 2019 Share Posted June 2, 2019 The lower Spring seat being lower than the standard shock seems odd, I'm away from the spare shocks right now but will measure asap for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 (edited) The lower Spring seat being lower than the standard shock seems odd, I'm away from the spare shocks right now but will measure asap for you. Thanks Scooter. The whole thing is so strange but you can clearly see how the difference between the length of piston rod and the slightly lower spring seat is causing the problem. This has got to now be a manufacturing defect at Bilsteins end. I highly doubt all 3 of my springs are oddball especially since one came from another car. Edited June 2, 2019 by Johnm400 (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 And now another problem. I just tried to put the car in the garage and it scraped like hell. The front end is a good fingers width lower each side than standard. I could get 3 fingers between the top of the wheel and arch with standard shocks and have a bit of movement. Now I can only just manage to get 2 fingers in! Obviously the lower spring seat has lowered the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samdale Posted June 2, 2019 Share Posted June 2, 2019 (edited) Just a thought, are all OEM springs the same? A quick look on toyodiy and I've found at least 3 "EDIT:4" different part numbers between models. Maybe springs for kyb shocks are different to those for OEM bilsteins? Toyota part numbers: 48131-1D561 48131-1D582 48131-1D601 48131-1D602 Edited June 2, 2019 by samdale (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rider Posted June 2, 2019 Share Posted June 2, 2019 If it helps at all I have a spare set off the car and can measure the distance from the spring support to the top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 Just a thought, are all OEM springs the same? A quick look on toyodiy and I've found at least 3 "EDIT:4" different part numbers between models. Maybe springs for kyb shocks are different to those for OEM bilsteins? Toyota part numbers: 48131-1D561 48131-1D582 48131-1D601 48131-1D602 Could be slight differences but other people have used J spec springs off the KYB shocks with no issues Mine are J spec and other people have used them with the Bilsteins with no trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 If it helps at all I have a spare set off the car and can measure the distance from the spring support to the top. [ATTACH=CONFIG]232272[/ATTACH] That would help please if you could measure from the lowest point of the spring support to the lower edge of the top mount and also from the centre line of the bolt eye to the lowest point of the spring support Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rider Posted June 2, 2019 Share Posted June 2, 2019 lowest point of the spring support to the lower edge of the top mount = 275mm centre line (top of thread) of the bolt eye to the lowest point of the spring support = 310mm Measurements from the base of the spring support, not the base of the spring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnm400 Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share Posted June 2, 2019 lowest point of the spring support to the lower edge of the top mount = 275mm centre line (top of thread) of the bolt eye to the lowest point of the spring support = 310mm Measurements from the base of the spring support, not the base of the spring. Thanks for doing that. Ill check with mine tomorrow. Can you confirm that your springs are under tension on the shock and you cant move them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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