Supra, EBC directional Vanes question

[Supra.SZ-R]

Hey guys, this is a copy of my post on the Supra page on Facebook,

 

I have a problem, EBC related haha

 

I bought discs for my supra, and set them up they way EBC had them marked in the box. It has the slots in the backwards position, I know slots do not matter so I would prefer to have them facing forward. And to my knowledge of the vanes they should also face they way Toyota want them if I have the slots facing the way I want, not the way EBC have them marked in the box.

Pic of the Supra is the way EBC want them istalled. So is the second pic

Pic of the vanes is my old left hand front and the disc they want to be my front left. They are turned back to back so the vanes are in the same direction, the vanes are almost the same (vanes on the EBC curve further forward from the outside diameter to the inside). So from the two discs which should be two left hand discs, the vanes tell me the the new left hand disc is actually a right hand disc, which would leave me having to swap the discs again, but atleast the slots would be facing my preferred direction, And the vanes would be facing the same as the stock setup of the Supra too.

So did EBC get it wrong or what? All logic tells me EBC is wrong here.

The vanes do not have the exact same curve though, is this where the difference is. Other vane designs are not like these Toyota setup.

The last pic is a diagram of the original supra setup and rotation.

 

[evinX]

Companys like mtec and ebc buy cheaper quality blanks discs and do their grooving to them etc. The front discs are sided but the companys seem to use two rights or two lefts for the fronts.

[Supra.SZ-R]

Well considering the vanes are directional and both would face opposite directions if they where on the opposite side, these are definitely right and left.

It's just which way the vane faces that I want to know.

 

These vanes are almost exactly the same as the stock setup. It's just that if I listened to EBC they will be facing the opposite direction to the OEM supra rotors vanes.

You know??

[evinX]

Yep im with you. Sounds like they grooved the discs in the wrong direction from what your saying. The curves are supposed to face fowards like picture 1.

[Supra.SZ-R]

Yeah that's what you would expect, especially since that's the way it is on the stock discs. The only thing that stops me putting them the way I want is that the grooves are a shade more aggressive on the EBC versions.

See the shadows in the pics of the grooves?? I have em perfectly lined up so you can see

[Supra.SZ-R]

In actual fact on closer inspection. I have two right hand discs that EBC sloted left and right. It's in correct and stupid. Check this video of the vanes.

 

[Supra.SZ-R]

For anyone wondering. This was the response from EBC

 

 

This really doesn’t matter

 

Lots of cars have curved vanes but only use one casting Mercedes and Maserati among them

 

The curve is primarily for extra strength as you get a longer vane if its curved

 

There maybe some extra cooling effect but its minimal

 

If you are not happy we will have them back

[Dnk]

Why would Toyota hand them if the vanes were the same left and right.

 

From what i read a few manufacturer's are using one disc to do do both sides

 

Personally i stuck with OE discs and pads and never felt the need to use

anything else especially if its purely road use

 

Edited May 20, 2018 by Dnk (see edit history)

[Supra.SZ-R]

I told them the same thing, they struggled to grasp the concept.

But like you say in normal use I will never notice a difference.

It was mostly for the look of the thing. I know it's abit daft. But it's nice for shows and such to have things like this. They look well on the car like

[Dnk]

I'd buy OE discs pop them on a CNC machine and add my own grooves

 

I'd have thought as long as the grooves were machined no deeper than

the minimum thickness and offset on each face they would be fine

 

UK spec OE disc 30 mm new, minimum thickness 28 mm so you could cut 1 mm

deep grooves in either side, i'd use a bull nose cutter so you just cut a constant

radius into the face, approx 3 mm diameter

 

I best add a disclaimer here in case some one does this and it goes horribly

wrong so don't whatever you do, do this

Edited May 21, 2018 by Dnk (see edit history)

[Dnk]

I had a search and found this article which is well worth reading

 

https://blog.racetechnologies.com/2015/04/09/the-advantages-of-cross-drilled-and-slotted-discs/

 

I've copied out this piece which perhaps you should send to EBC

 

As for the internal vane structure of a ventilated disc, Mark adds: “There are limitless internal vane structures that are possible. Design of the vane structure has a dramatic effect on the performance of the brake disc. Some designs, such as directional curved-vane discs actually improve the airflow through the disc by turning the disc into a centrifugal pump. However, the cost of implementing this is increased due to the need for unique left- and right-hand discs. Brembo has patented a ‘pillar vane’ internal geometry that provides nearly all the airflow advantages of the curved vane discs while being able to use the same disc on both the left and right sides of the vehicle.”

[evinX]

i havnt had an issue with my metc discs. Dont buy of ebay. Cheaper on their site and the mintex pads are cheaper elsewhere.

[Bladerider]

Well,

 

My understanding was always that the vanes spiralled outwards with the direction of rotation so hotter gases were "flung" out the disc, hence why brake air guides usually direct cooler flow towards the centre of the disc to get "sucked" through the vanes.

 

Grooves are academic and are only there to deglaze and break gas build up.

[Supra.SZ-R]

There is a term for all the different types of vanes that can be had. Can't remember all the different names though

But key here that ebc seem to forget is that all good brakes go in the same direction.

If mercedes do, do this I'm sure it's on lesser models that they don't care as much for.

A sports car should never have opposite facing vanes its stupid.

And if you only want one set of discs they should be straight vanes and that's the end of it.

[Chris Wilson]

Such nice wheels, but such junk discs Keep the wheels and do the old flotation test on the discs.

[Supra.SZ-R]

Ah Chris Wilson. You are the owner of one of those aftermarket shops.

What would you recommend for discs?

These are being sent back as I simply can't deal with the incorrect vane thing

I only went for sloted as it's just a nice we thing for the look of her.

Pity a big company like EBC would accept this stupid vane setup, especially on a sports car :/

If they where gonna pull that move they should have just went with straight vanes :/

[Chris Wilson]

A plain disc is fine with modern pad compounds, a slotted disc used to help de-gas older compounds, and clean pad friction bonding compounds from the face of the pads, now they are more for style than substance on road cars. Internal vanes have a well established direction for hot air evacuation. I recommend stock or OEM style discs for 90% of applications

[Wez]

What CW said

 

I wouldnt put EBC stuff on a Micra let alone a MKIV

[Supra.SZ-R]

I learned that the hardest Wez.

Do you sell stock discs or know of a good set of slotted discs Chris??

Thanks for the comments guys.

[Chris Wilson]

I can't beat Toyota dealers offering trade price to forum members on OE UK discs but I do offer OE spec Jap ones.

[Supra.SZ-R]

Ah that's ok then. I have the big brakes you see. Thanks for the info