stevie_b Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 (edited) When I tried to remove the roadwheels from my Ford Cmax recently, they were stuck on. I had to drive around the block with the wheel nuts loose in order to free the wheels. That did the trick, but when I put the wheels back on, I used a bit of copper grease between the inboard alloy wheel surface and the hub surface to prevent it happening again. See post #5 in this thread: http://www.mkivsupra.net/vbb/showthread.php?332876-Wheel-spacers-how-safe&p=4136621&viewfull=1#post4136621 It makes me think the copper grease was a bad idea. What do you think? And if it's a bad idea, what's the best way of preventing the wheels from seizing onto the hubs in future? Some kind of non-metallic gasket might do it. Edited April 21, 2016 by stevie_b (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annabella Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Get the grease off and prob live with the situation, better they're 'stuck' on than not, the grease just puts stress on the bolts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2 MSW Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 (edited) Get the grease off and prob live with the situation, better they're 'stuck' on than not, the grease just puts stress on the bolts. What a complete load of rubbish. As long as they are stock wheels or have a correctly sized hub centric ring a small amount of copper grease on the hub surface to stop it rusting will make zero difference to the stress on a bolt. What does make a difference is copper grease on the lugs and bolts themselves. That can effect the torque but IMO is only required if using alloy nuts on a steal stud. Edited April 21, 2016 by T2 MSW (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annabella Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 What a complete load of rubbish. As long as they are stock wheels or have a correctly sized hub centric ring a small amount of copper grease on the hub surface to stop it rusting will make zero difference to the stress on a bolt. So you dont want maximum 'friction' between your wheels and hubs then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2 MSW Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 (edited) A small amount of copper grease on the face of the hub centric ring (not all over the face of the hub) will make very little difference to friction between the back of the wheel and the face of the hub. What will make a big difference is greasing the bolts as you will not get the same required level of torque and therefore force of the wheel against the hub. This is the reason the likes of porche and bentley quote dry and wet torque figures. Edited April 21, 2016 by T2 MSW (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annabella Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Well I wasn't talking greasing the bolts, the rubbish I was talking is inbetween the hub and wheel, so I guess what was being said on the other thread is also rubbish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2 MSW Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 not interested in arguing with you! To the OP a small amount on the face of the hub centric ring to help release next time will be fine. Don't cover the whole hub in it though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annabella Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 I wasn't arguing, it's the rubbishing of another persons opinion on a forum that's the issue. I took the time to answer the OP's question, with what I thought, and others think. A forum is for all to speak, derived from latin, not to be shot down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kendo11 Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Personally I usually put a little dab on. I think the usual causes of issues with copper grease is when it's used on rubber, but should be ok in this case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie_b Posted April 21, 2016 Author Share Posted April 21, 2016 Thanks for your input guys, I appreciate it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
absz Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 •Lightly coat mating surfaces between wheel centre hole and hub (use grease). This is common with most manufactures Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bignum Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 Ive always put copper grease on my hubs and never had a problem with wheels coming off, torquing them up properly/evenly is the key. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skippyboyo1 Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 will cause zero issues, id go as far to say even if you put a whole tub of copper grease on one wheel it would make zero difference Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bignum Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 will cause zero issues, id go as far to say even if you put a whole tub of copper grease on one wheel it would make zero difference Might affect the brakes if it flicks out onto the pads lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_jza80 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 I'm fairly certain that, somewhere, CW has just seen this thread and had a heart attack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mk4Gaz Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Ive always put copper grease on my hubs and never had a problem with wheels coming off, torquing them up properly/evenly is the key. Me too. Done it for nearly 20 years, and haven't had a problem yet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie_b Posted April 24, 2016 Author Share Posted April 24, 2016 Based on the thread that I linked to in the 1st post, I can see Annabella's point. But it seems many people have been using it without issues, so I won't sweat it. I didn't trowel it on, just a thin smear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bignum Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Based on the thread that I linked to in the 1st post, I can see Annabella's point. But it seems many people have been using it without issues, so I won't sweat it. I didn't trowel it on, just a thin smear. Thats all you need bud, just to help stop corrosion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havard Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 I had to look at the date to check that this wasn't April 1st again. The use of copper grease will have zero issues on the hub or the bolts for that matter. It is used as an anti rust only and is heat resistant. I used to use it on industrial valves years ago so when they were refurbed we could actually open the buggers up in 10 years time. CW's post in the other thread is referring to wheels that are not supported by the hub to centralise the wheels and therefore the use if any substance that is "slippy", will not help matters. In that scenario, the bolts are taking the load of the wheel and that is dangerous. If the wheel is correctly located on the central hub ring and the bolts are torqued to the correct setting, there is nothing that is going to loosen them other than a wheel brace. I hope this clarifies the issue. Good reading though. H. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havard Posted April 25, 2016 Share Posted April 25, 2016 Looks like I killed a thread again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kendo11 Posted April 25, 2016 Share Posted April 25, 2016 Spoilsport. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2 MSW Posted April 25, 2016 Share Posted April 25, 2016 Looks like I killed a thread again. Ill pick on you now Your statement about nothing undoing a wheel nut except a wheel brace is incorrect. Its one of the key things to check at intervals through the day when doing track days as the stresses and heat cycles does loosen the nuts. Ive seen it happen at track days and whilst I've never had it personally on my car, Phils is a bugger for it. Religiously check nuts are in excess of 90ft/lbs at least 3 times on a track day Bignum will back me up on that one too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havard Posted April 25, 2016 Share Posted April 25, 2016 Ok, I will agree that after being initially tightened they should be checked shortly after or after massive changes in heat etc. The grease is not going to make any difference though is it? I appreciate that tension on bolts can "relax". I think there has been a massive misunderstanding regarding CW's post. H. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2 MSW Posted April 25, 2016 Share Posted April 25, 2016 Agreed with that bit just letting you know it will be on your track check list you have to check when we do the first one Theres no such thing as just turn up and rag your car round all day, well not if you want your car to last theres not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havard Posted April 25, 2016 Share Posted April 25, 2016 Agreed with that bit just letting you know it will be on your track check list you have to check when we do the first one Theres no such thing as just turn up and rag your car round all day, well not if you want your car to last theres not Ok, you can check shit like that. I'll get the brews in..!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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