msupra1 Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 Hi gents. Looking for some advice and help. Long story short, shortly after my tune early 2015, I had my turbo rebuilt. The rebuild shop was claiming oil starvation was the culprit. The car was tuned for 600whp (high 600's bhp). It was running 10w40. So after I got the Borg Warner S366 rebuilt. I ran it for 6 months last year for about 3500 miles before it started shooting blue smoke again. I just got around to getting it rebuilt again. They are now saying the inside of the turbo was fried, the bearings, and had dried up oil on it. They rebuilt it to factory spec + beefed the turbo up to tolerate higher heat this time around. The car at this moment is just had the whole fuel system redone for E85 fuel. The other mods remain the same, such as full 4" dp / exhaust, gsc s1 cams with springs/retainers, greddy 3 row, and all other supporting mods. The bottom end is unopened and stock (87k miles). So i'll see how long the bottom will last me.. but got some other guys here pushing more power then that for years. I'm trying to decide what weight oil is good for around 800bhp. I was thinking 10w50 because the last 10w40 didn't seem to hold up. My only concern is how thick in oil can I really go for stock bottom. And would an oil cooler be a good idea? For the majority, this car is used driving around town and on cruises. Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 Would a thicker oil help your situation? I certainly wouldn't be using a 10w50 in Canada during the cold months, I'd be aiming more at a 0w30 to be honest. In our oil FAQ it's recommended for us to drop to 5w40 in the Uk when single turbo. I always assumed that was to have the oil a little thinner to move around the system more freely with less friction. Don't base your choice on what I'm saying here, I just want to give you some food for thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msupra1 Posted February 26, 2016 Author Share Posted February 26, 2016 I don't live in the cold part of Canada ..The weather now is averaging above 10c daytime, and is anywhere from 20 to 35c in the summer. The car is not driven in winter. Most start taking their cars out in February and store them in October. I was reading about that too thick of an oil, like 10w60 isn't necessary the best for an unopened stock bottom end.. because it wasn't designed to flow that thick of an oil... but it seems like many are running 40 and 50 weight from my searches. So considering it's not cold but mild and getting warmer... just trying to see if something like a 10w50 would be okay for the bottom end. Or another option may be sticking with 10w40 and get an oil cooler. If I don't have to dish out the money for one, I would prefer not to... but if greatly helps I will probably. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 I'd be looking at 5w40 or possibly even 5w30 given your circumstances to be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bignum Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 Do you have a oil temp gauge, chances are your oil is cooked due to not having a seperate cooler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msupra1 Posted February 26, 2016 Author Share Posted February 26, 2016 I wasn't running one but I did purchase an oil temp gauge now. I will perhaps stay with 10w40 or 5w40... and monitor the oil temps and take things from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwilkinson Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 When was the oil pump last changed? Could this be a culmination of issues? Incorrect oil viscosity, insufficient cooling and maybe a tired oil pump? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mellonman Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 (edited) Do you have the correctly size oil feed nipple? I know that dbb turbos have a reducer , so if you have one of these fitted and running a journal bearing you will suffer oil starvation. Also if your not running one on a dbb turbo you will blow your oil seal due to the larger volume of oil. Edited February 27, 2016 by mellonman (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msupra1 Posted February 27, 2016 Author Share Posted February 27, 2016 Do you have the correctly size oil feed nipple? I know that dbb turbos have a reducer , so if you have one of these fitted and running a journal bearing you will suffer oil starvation. Also if your not running one on a dbb turbo you will blow your oil seal due to the larger volume of oil. The turbo oil line kit I purchased years ago, I wasn't sure on the sizing. I purchased a proper 4an 1/4 inlet line which is the correct one for a billet S366 So there is a few factors why I had these issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Is there a restrictor in the oil feed? Measure the oil pressure in the feed line. Is the drain big enough and unobstructed? You need to measure oil temps in the sump, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supraleeturbo Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 I use 10w 60 bud running 700 horsepower, the oil your using isn't used on anything other than stock, that's what I've been advised by my tuner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 I use 10w 60 bud running 700 horsepower, the oil your using isn't used on anything other than stock, that's what I've been advised by my tuner That sounds WAY too thick to me. Stock is 5w30. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Is there a restrictor in the oil feed? Measure the oil pressure in the feed line. Is the drain big enough and unobstructed? You need to measure oil temps in the sump, too. This! And are you allowing the engine to run on after a boosted run so the turbo can cool a little? as this combined with bad flow through the turbo from too small a restriction wont help, is the turbo also water cooled? it wont be the oil grade, a good fully synthetic 10W40 should be up to it as long as your not seeing very high oil temps, I presume you have a cooler fitted? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Doom Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 That sounds WAY too thick to me. Stock is 5w30. 10w30 if he's TT 5w30 is NA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 10w30 if he's TT 5w30 is NA Is that 100%? I always thought it was 10w30 in Japan due to the hotter climate, whereas the UK Supras were 5w30? I was sure I read that somewhere but it was probably just an assumption. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Doom Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 They actually specify 5w30 for NA but for TT there's a temperature chart. It's pretty much 10w30 though unless you have temps lower than -18c The chart in the user manual suggests that 5w30 isn't great if you're stating your car at over 10c which is most of our summer months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 The 5 in 5W30 just means it will be better at lower starting temps IE better flow, using it instead of 10W30 wont have any impact at higher starting temps at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Doom Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 The 5 in 5W30 just means it will be better at lower starting temps IE better flow, using it instead of 10W30 wont have any impact at higher starting temps at all. So do you think the chart is saying 10w30 is the recommended weight for a GTE engine startup (probably due to the addition of the turbos etc) but you would need to run 5w30 if you're starting the car in a cold environment? Otherwise, surely the chart would be the same as the NA (GE) one which just has one big arrow for 5w30 across the whole range? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 So do you think the chart is saying 10w30 is the recommended weight for a GTE engine startup (probably due to the addition of the turbos etc) but you would need to run 5w30 if you're starting the car in a cold environment? Otherwise, surely the chart would be the same as the NA (GE) one which just has one big arrow for 5w30 across the whole range? It is, I think you may be misinterpreting it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 It's been a while but I remember -30 not THAT long ago. Doubt I'd be out in the Supra in that weather though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Budz86 Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 Running 800rwhp here and only use 10-60 in mine. Ran 10-40 in my BPU TT and spun a main bearing after around 6 to 9 months. Oil was just too thin when driving it hard, causing oil starvation. Plus the pump was having to work too hard to cope. All this was confirmed on the Syvecs data logs, so I know what I'll be using in future Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 (edited) No sure just how the oil was too thin when driving hard? and how the pump would have to work harder, thicker oil would put the pump under more stress, it is possible that due to rod loadings the oil was forced from the bearing surface, causing it to spin, but the viscosity shouldn't be the deciding factor, it will be more likely due to the component make up and shear factors, or even a tight or misshaped bearing or even the material, or just plain bad luck. Edited February 28, 2016 by Tricky-Ricky (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Budz86 Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 Oil was way too thin when hot and had the viscosity of water almost! Pump was most likely worn too, which wouldn't have helped, but bottom line was the oil wasn't doing its job when I was pushing the car. Kept getting low oil pressure trips on the syvecs under hard braking even when I changed the threshold to trip at less than 1 bar; this was happening at high speed and high revs. One shell spun and the others were heavily scored. I had a built engine waiting to go in so wasn't bothered about the warnings, stupid I know, but the truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 Sounds like your pump was knackered Budz. 40 oil should be fine at 100degc. Thin oil would suggest hot oil and low pressure would suggest that the pump was perhaps to blame, especially for the low oil pressure. 1 bar at high revs is stupidly low. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 Exactly! which Is why I asked the question, a 10w40 oil should be still w40 at up to 120C or higher if synthetic, so wont go thin unless contaminated with fuel, agreed! the pump or the pressure release valve would be the culprit, or simply worn bearings will reduce oil pressure, the 2JZ oil pump is pretty tough, mine was knacked yet still kept good pressure with no problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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