Style Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Hoping for some pointers please. Just making sure something stupid isn't staring me in the face I've followed the hoses and everything has been plumbed in as per my diagram: Does this look correct? It's a single turbo setup with a Turbosmart wastegate running a 5psi spring. The boost solenoid is controlled by the ECU but seems to have no effect on controlling the boost. Completely de-energised it will behave the same. it boosted all the way to 1bar and was going to continue if allowed to do so. I'm fairly certain there is no leaks in the hoses. Points I have noticed is that I can't hear the BOV opening and also that the boost gauge is hooked up to a different location from the system. Could this cause a problem running everything from here? And would an unopening BOV cause overboosting? There's is a vent on the solenoid so I'd have thought that would save the day if that happened Final thought is that there might be a blanking bolt missing from the wastegate which is allowing equal pressure to flow through it and boost will just climb until it maxes out. Car's booked in for a final map tweak on Monday so hoping to have this solved for the car to finally be road worthy! Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mellonman Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 by pass the boost controller completly , then you will know if its the wastegate or the boost controller , thats the joy of single turbos very simple to work on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Style Posted August 27, 2015 Author Share Posted August 27, 2015 by pass the boost controller completly , then you will know if its the wastegate or the boost controller , thats the joy of single turbos very simple to work on Good place to start, nice and easy like you say Would disconnecting the hose between the boost controller and wastegate be all I need to do for that then? Hopefully I've got a small enough screw I could plug the other side with if need be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2 MSW Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Good place to start, nice and easy like you say Would disconnecting the hose between the boost controller and wastegate be all I need to do for that then? Hopefully I've got a small enough screw I could plug the other side with if need be Correct and just leave the top port of the wastegate to vent to atmosphere. Better still run a pipe into the car from the top port and that way you will be able to tell if the wastegate is allowing any air into the top chamber. It could be just stuck too - blow compressed air into both ports of the Wastegate to make sure there is no debris blocking the diaphragm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mellonman Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 yep preassure referance from the turbo straight to the bottom of the wastegate and you should boost to spring rate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Style Posted August 27, 2015 Author Share Posted August 27, 2015 Correct and just leave the top port of the wastegate to vent to atmosphere. Better still run a pipe into the car from the top port and that way you will be able to tell if the wastegate is allowing any air into the top chamber. It could be just stuck too - blow compressed air into both ports of the Wastegate to make sure there is no debris blocking the diaphragm yep preassure referance from the turbo straight to the bottom of the wastegate and you should boost to spring rate Okay thanks guys, will give that a go and see what happens. I can hear the wastegate open as normal between gears so think its okay. But I'll give it a blow to make sure. If I'm still spiking I'll get the car up and try get a better look at the wastegate. Just hoping its an easy fix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_jekyll Posted August 29, 2015 Share Posted August 29, 2015 wastegate between gears? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Style Posted August 29, 2015 Author Share Posted August 29, 2015 wastegate between gears? Yeah dude. Coming off the throttle the wastegate flutters away like it should. I took the boost controller out of the loop this evening and went for another blast. Still over boosting so I'm thinking its wastegate now. Paul tells me it's a 5psi spring inside it so that should be fine. kind of lost on what else it could be now. Any other ideas? Is it okay where I have the boost hoses run into the inlet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 The Flutter isn't wastegate is it? thats compressor stall? due to no bov, or bov not working Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzi Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Quite a few people on the US forum have experienced problems with the turbosmart wastegate sticking from new or shortly after install. They disassembled it, cleaned it and put it back together. The problem never came back. Worth a shot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Read Ric's reply above,mI think you are not understanding how and when a wastegate should open. Personally I would never run a blow off or re-circualting valve on any turbo engine, just something else to go wrong. And no, they DO NOT reduce lag.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mellonman Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Now im at home I can see your diagram, where are you taking your turbo preasure reference from? Its before the throttle body right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Style Posted August 30, 2015 Author Share Posted August 30, 2015 The Flutter isn't wastegate is it? thats compressor stall? due to no bov, or bov not working When I went out last night I could hear the BOV working on boost. On top of that there was what I think is the wastegate. I have a short video of the noise under very low positive boost. See what you think: Quite a few people on the US forum have experienced problems with the turbosmart wastegate sticking from new or shortly after install. They disassembled it, cleaned it and put it back together. The problem never came back. Worth a shot. Really? That's good to know cheers dude. thought they would've been pretty bullet proof but will certainly have a look Read Ric's reply above,mI think you are not understanding how and when a wastegate should open. Personally I would never run a blow off or re-circualting valve on any turbo engine, just something else to go wrong. And no, they DO NOT reduce lag.... What does the linked video sound like Chris? Hard to make out as it was base map at the time. Now im at home I can see your diagram, where are you taking your turbo preasure reference from? Its before the throttle body right? The second pic has one reference for the wastegate etc after the throttle body and after the y-pipe. Boost gauge is the same, just taken from a different place but quite close. Seems to be where most NA-T's take their references from. Could it cause a problem? Inaccurate readings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzi Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Do you know when your bov opens? Say you have a spring in your bov that opens at 7psi and youre only running 5psi I will not open fully hence the flutter sound. As Chris said bovs are more things to go wrong. I've never fitted one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mellonman Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 I would of thought it will case you issues mate , its fine for the boost gauge as that will actually be what the engine is getting but as for the wastgate think it will need to be turbo side as when you lift off the turbo still spins making boost (thats why bov go pshh), but the way you have it will see vacuum from the closed throttle body. If this setup would cause over boost or not I dont know ? But its not correct the turbos them self normally a nipple for boost reference Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Style Posted August 30, 2015 Author Share Posted August 30, 2015 Do you know when your bov opens? Say you have a spring in your bov that opens at 7psi and youre only running 5psi I will not open fully hence the flutter sound. As Chris said bovs are more things to go wrong. I've never fitted one. The BOV has an adjustable nipple on top that I can use to alter when it opens. I'm not sure exactly when it opens but can have a play and see if i can get it to open earlier. BOV came with the kit i bought so thought I'd run with it. I would of thought it will case you issues mate , its fine for the boost gauge as that will actually be what the engine is getting but as for the wastgate think it will need to be turbo side as when you lift off the turbo still spins making boost (thats why bov go pshh), but the way you have it will see vacuum from the closed throttle body. If this setup would cause over boost or not I dont know ? But its not correct the turbos them self normally a nipple for boost reference My thinking as that when the throttle body closes, there is a vacuum pulled and that's what lifts the BOV and releases all the pressurised air from the turbo, inter cooler, pipe work etc. If the wastegate is jammed I guess it'll just boost to its hearts content. Might have to pull it apart and see what spring is inside it and try determine if it's working properly to take it out of the equation. Dazzi's comment about US folk having trouble with them is worrying me and I've been damaging the turbo with surge up until now I had a look at my BW turbo and no sign of a boost nipple or anything dude. Seems as though people drill and tap themselves if they want to run from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Style Posted September 1, 2015 Author Share Posted September 1, 2015 So just an update here. I took the BOV out all together as I found it was leaking big style. Air was just blowing right out of it, it's now in the bin and been replaced with a new pipework elbow without the adapter. Fired up the car, went for a blast and STILL overboosting Only thing left to check is the wastegate so looks like there's something up with it. Will pull it off and have a look at it. On top of that, the car has now developed a cutting out issue where the car just loses idle all together and will then not start, just turn on the starter motor and not catch. Disconnect the battery and try again and it will fire sometimes, run for a few seconds and die again. I'm thinking that I'm resetting the ECU when I disconnect the battery and then I've maybe got a vacuum leak that the ECU can't hold idle against? If I can get the car moving, it behaves a lot better at higher revs. Will clean the ICV, check fuses, dizzy and fuel pump electrics. Hopefully there's something there that will solve the problem. I also want to move my pressure reference for the wastegate to the other side of the throttle body. Wondering if the vacuum has damaged the diaphragm in the wastegate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2 MSW Posted September 1, 2015 Share Posted September 1, 2015 your pressure reference for the wastgate is after the throttle??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Style Posted September 1, 2015 Author Share Posted September 1, 2015 your pressure reference for the wastgate is after the throttle??? Yeah, laziness from the garage that did the conversion! There was no pressure reference fitting on the turbo when I got it so they never bothered plumbing in one themselves and just ran a hose from one of the vacuum lines on the inlet manifold as per the pic in post 1. In theory it works I guess but wastegate shouldn't be seeing vacuum when coming off throttle I'd have thought. They tee'd off to the BOV as well from the same line. I've binned the BOV and taken the wastegate reference line off so need to find a place to put that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_jekyll Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 Needs to come from before the throttle dude. Pref straight from the turbo housing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
berg Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 Think i used one of these one my old one, housing itself had no pressure port so fitted this into the hose that comes directly from the housing http://www.murraymotorsport.com/assets/products/11146/large/SST_S.hose.jpg?1390213322 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Style Posted September 5, 2015 Author Share Posted September 5, 2015 Thanks chaps. I ordered one of those fittings earlier in the week and going to put it on the silicone elbow joint to improve things. Cars not getting spark now so looking into that. Possibly crank sensor and gear. We shall see Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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