Decat MOT query/ BPU without decat

[rossky]

Hi all,

 

Unfortunately in Ireland cars over certain year hav to do an MOT every year, so I presume the Supra will fail the MOT with the 1st decat out, I think.

I have at the minute the first decat in with second decat remove and a HKs super dragger which all passed the MOT.

 

I know want to do a complete BPU but really dont want to be puttin in a 1st decat every year for the MOT as that will just annoy me, what do you guys do? When I had a GTR japspeed done a decent Highflow cat which would be ideal but I cannot find one anywhere for the supra.

 

So worst case scenario how does the car perform to BPU with the 1st cat still in?

 

Look forward to yer thoughts?

 

RC

[Whitesupra95]

Take the first cat out and only put the second cat in once a year. A lot easier that way, should only take 30mins.

[skippyboyo1]

I think you guys are insane messing around putting cats back In.

 

Just ask around and find a better mot station wink wink.

[supra_ufo]

i think you guys are insane messing around putting cats back in.

 

Just ask around and find a better mot station wink wink.

 

this!

[Swampy442]

Not sure what the emission rules are over there, but imports have different emissions rules on the main land. A modern, injected car should have no issues passing emissions, hell an old Soarer of mine passed with no cats and a smoking turbo.

[Havard]

Friendly MOT station ftw..!!

[Guest Roger NE]

Certainly here in the UK there is no legal requirement to have a Cat fitted . . . (and if an MOT garage tries to tell you otherwise, they are WRONG!)

 

It's just that post 1993 cars have to pass what is normally referred to as a CAT Emissions test . . . it just means that the emission levels it has to pass are much lower . . . but my car passes them fine without ANY Cats fitted !

 

(I would imagine the rules in Ireland are very similar)

[Dim Sum]

Same with everyone.

I run de-cats for the last three years and had no issue at all. If you are worried before you book a mot go down there and ask them it don't hurt. All they can say is no, if so move to the next MOT station.

[Whitesupra95]

I have a friendly mot station too lol

 

In the uk imports go through a non cat test if they are registered before July 95.

[Guest Roger NE]

Well they shouldn't have to be "friendly" . . . as they're doing nothing wrong!

 

It's just that some of them don't properly understand the Regulations.

 

Any Supra should pass the "CAT Test" without any Cats fitted . . . and the figures for the "Non-CAT" test are absurdly high !

[SteveC]

Well they shouldn't have to be "friendly" . . . as they're doing nothing wrong!

 

It's just that some of them don't properly understand the Regulations.

 

Any Supra should pass the "CAT Test" without any Cats fitted . . . and the figures for the "Non-CAT" test are absurdly high !

 

I believe some Supras may not need to have the cat test, but not all.

 

My local MOT tester showed me the official info that stated that my '95 UK Supra was supposed to pass the cat test.

[Guest Roger NE]

My local MOT tester showed me the official info that stated that my '95 UK Supra was supposed to pass the cat test

 

Sure . . . but the point I'm making is that your 1995 UK Supra a) Doesn't actually need to have any Cats fitted, and b) it should be capable of passing the "Cat Test" figures WITHOUT any Cats fitted.

[Tayfun.tugra]

I had this problem last year with bpu both cats out.

 

Roger is right, legally you dont have to have cats as long as you pass the emissions. I believe IanC gave me a link to the official information they should abide by.

Iirc pre June/July 1995- under 3500 ppm idle test and thats it.

[2soops]

 

So worst case scenario how does the car perform to BPU with the 1st cat still in?

 

 

I've still managed to hit fuel cut with just the 1st cat in and a Super Dragger

[rossky]

interesting. the emission laws here are dependant on year of manufacture so my 99 is expected to have co below 0.5 %. Car test centres here are pretty strict as there was a watchdog show that expossed all the bribery recently ha! My old GTR was a 91 so its emisssions band was much higher.

So firstly does anyone know wot the Co's will read with all cats removed?

2 has anyone had a Car bpu'd and left at cat in if so how did it perform?

 

Trust me if i have my way the cats will be staying out

[Tayfun.tugra]

http://www.mkivsupra.net/vbb/showthread.php?291610-MOT-failed&highlight=emissions

 

Post 15.

[Guest Roger NE]

So firstly does anyone know wot the Co's will read with all cats removed?

 

It obviously depends on how accurate your fuelling is . . .

 

Mine (with no Cats fitted) was 0.1% CO at 2500 RPM and 0.2% at idle . . . EASILY passing the CAT Test ! (even though it's only required to pass the Non-Cat Test)

 

If yours is higher than that, first thing to do is replace the Lambda Sensors

Edited April 19, 2014 by Roger NE (see edit history)

[SteveC]

Roger, is it not a case that your MOT tester is one of the 'friendly' variety?

 

Mine hasn't any cats installed and what you might call the 'official' printed emission readings (cat test) show a pass, but it actual fact it wouldn't pass is done exactly by the book... and it has brand new lambda sensors, runs very well and returns good MPG.

 

If all Supras should pass the cat test emissions without cats, then why would many people bother to refit the second cat if their MOT station wasn't that 'friendly'?

Edited April 19, 2014 by SteveC (see edit history)

[Guest Roger NE]

Because, sadly, a lot of MOT Testers don't understand the Legislation !

 

There is actually no requirement for ANY car to have a Cat fitted . . . just a requirement to be below the relevant Emissions for that Vehicle / Year band

 

Some people print out the Rules from one of the Gov websites and take it along to show them !

[SteveC]

Any Supra should pass the "CAT Test" without any Cats fitted...

 

This is what I was referring to in my last post.

 

All Supras that are running correctly (and with new lamba sensors) will not pass a correctly performed cat emissions test without a cat fitted.

[ghostbuster]

I am under the understanding that if a car was built/manufactured with a cat it must have one:taped:. Rules for MOT's have had subtle changes over the last few years. I am also under the impression that noisey exhausts are also being targeted.

[Tayfun.tugra]

I am under the understanding that if a car was built/manufactured with a cat it must have one:taped:. Rules for MOT's have had subtle changes over the last few years. I am also under the impression that noisey exhausts are also being targeted.

 

Manufactures employ the use of a cat to lower emissions to pass its tests, so by removing it should usually fail thus creating high emissions being vented into the atmosphere which is very much frowned upon by environmentalists. If it doesn't pass the legislation expect to be ordered for a retest MOT or fined by police.

For whatever reasons Toyota put two cat converters on (maybe for emissions legislation in Japan ) the car only needs one after 31 July 1995 to pass emissions and none to pass the Non cat test before 31 July 1995. Regardless if your tester is friendly or not, once your car details are entered he can do F all about the emission results as its all registered on computer, Unless he doesn't notice you reverse another car in when he goes to the toilet.

 

 

This is where a friendly tester comes in:

Loudness of an exhaust should not be louder than a standard car, this can be overlooked.
Smoke can also be overlooked.

 

 

Everything you need to know is in the link below.

In-service exhaust emission standards for road vehicles: 17th edition

[Benjy]

So what about the Reason for Rejection that says "Catalytic converter missing where one was fitted as standard"?

 

And pre '95 vehicles that are NOT in the emissions book/machines are NOT subject to a full cat test. It goes like this..,

 

BET test > 0.20% CO/200ppm HC/0.97-1.03 Lambda @ 2500rpm - 3000rpm

 

Used from 2002 > = 0.20% CO/200ppm HC/ Lambda can vary according to manufacturers specs @ 2500rpm - 3000rpm

 

Used from 08/95 = 0.30% CO/ 200ppm HC/ again Lambda can vary @ 2500rpm - 3000rpm

 

Used from 86-95 = 3.5% CO/ 1200ppm HC - NO lambda @ idle

 

Used from 75-86 = 4.5% CO/1200ppm HC - NO lambda @ idle

 

Pre 75 = visual check.

 

So basically, pre '95 with NO emissions related data = pre-cat test and CAN have cats removed.

 

95 > vehicles with NO emissions related date = 95 > 02 CAT test. Also, MUST have a cat fitted where one was fitted as standard.

[Tayfun.tugra]

So what about the Reason for Rejection that says "Catalytic converter missing where one was fitted as standard"?

I must have missed that somewhere... can you link us to an official document to clear it all up?

[Benjy]

http://www.motinfo.gov.uk/htdocs/m4s07000101.htm

 

Same goes for Diesel Particulate Filter removal. As of the beginning of this month, if a DPF has visibly been tampered with, i.e. Cut open and welded shut, it's a fail regardless of emission/smoke test results.

Edited April 27, 2014 by Benjy (see edit history)