V8KILR Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I can read. If you're on gravel, you don't drive as quickly. Can you not drive? They were tarsealed roads with a little bit of gravel at the intersection which I have already mentioned. I never said they were gravel roads. How can pulling out from an intersection when stationery be driving too fast? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 They were tarsealed roads with a little bit of gravel at the intersection which I have already mentioned. I never said they were gravel roads. Driver error then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V8KILR Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Driver error then. No. Traction control error which all future occurances of were eliminated by its removal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st3ven1 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Did you not read what I said? Do not assume that it is a cliche! I was pulling out from a side road on to a main road and the side road had a little bit of gravel thrown on to it as many back road intersections in NZ do. As I pulled out, the tires spun on the gravel leaving me in the path of an oncoming truck with no power. As mentioned only pressing the button to turn off the traction control saved my life. This was in the dry with excellent tires and suspension. The factory traction control is EXTREMELY dangerous and I would never own a TT Supra without removing it. Did you read what I said? So "the side road had a little bit of gravel thrown on to it as many back road intersections in NZ do" leads me to believe that you were not driving to the conditions of the road. Gravel junction and you tried to pull out quickly in front of a truck, even a modern car would activate it's traction control system in this situation(although it would probably do it in a more progressive manor). Couple of other things to note: You are at a give way whether that is a slip road or junction, You have to give way to oncoming road users. If you cause another road user to change either speed or direction you would fail your driving test. Fact. It amazes me the people in this country that pull out into other road users paths and expect them to slow down! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 No. Traction control error which all future occurances of were eliminated by its removal. Mate, you misjudged the conditions. Nothing to do with a false 'problem' with the traction control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyson Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Rubbish. There is no chance that the system has caused more crashes than it's caused, if this were the case it would be a blanket removal of the system on the forum. As I've already said it will have saved hundreds of people new to RWD in the dry and loads of people not used to the power in the wet. And as for the cliche of pulling out in front of a lorry(which everyone seems to be doing). If a stock TT(assuming standard suspension in good condition and proper tyres) was to pull out in front of a lorry from a junction at WOT in the dry it would not lose traction and the traction control would not intervene. So my suggestion is that all of these examples of people "pulling out in front of lorries" were either driving too fast for the wet conditions or had sub standard suspension/tyres or both. Don't get me wrong I run with it off most of the time but have plenty of experience of RWD cars and handling them sideways.(had six RWD cars and used three of them for drifting) As for removing the TC, you're my hero. How many miles have you done this year? Did you read what I said? So "the side road had a little bit of gravel thrown on to it as many back road intersections in NZ do" leads me to believe that you were not driving to the conditions of the road. Gravel junction and you tried to pull out quickly in front of a truck, even a modern car would activate it's traction control system in this situation(although it would probably do it in a more progressive manor). Couple of other things to note: You are at a give way whether that is a slip road or junction, You have to give way to oncoming road users. If you cause another road user to change either speed or direction you would fail your driving test. Fact. It amazes me the people in this country that pull out into other road users paths and expect them to slow down! I agree with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V8KILR Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Did you read what I said? So "the side road had a little bit of gravel thrown on to it as many back road intersections in NZ do" leads me to believe that you were not driving to the conditions of the road. Gravel junction and you tried to pull out quickly in front of a truck, even a modern car would activate it's traction control system in this situation(although it would probably do it in a more progressive manor). Couple of other things to note: You are at a give way whether that is a slip road or junction, You have to give way to oncoming road users. If you cause another road user to change either speed or direction you would fail your driving test. Fact. It amazes me the people in this country that pull out into other road users paths and expect them to slow down! It was a tarseal junction that just had a very small amount of gravel on it. Anyone who was unaware how bad the stock traction control is would have done exactly the same as me. There was plenty of room for me to pull out and cross the road before the truck, but not when the traction control kicks in and left me sitting in the middle of the road. Since removing the traction control about 13 years ago (I have owned my TT Supra for 14 years and have track and drag raced it for all that time), I have never had any further traction issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V8KILR Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Mate, you misjudged the conditions. Nothing to do with a false 'problem' with the traction control. Not allowing for the extremely bad traction control system is what I misjudged. Hopefully everyone now knows how bad it is and allows for this when driving if they have not removed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Not allowing for the extremely bad traction control system is what I misjudged. Hopefully everyone now knows how bad it is and allows for this when driving if they have not removed it. No, how hard you need to press the throttle pedal is what you misjudged Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V8KILR Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Hopefully you don't find out why I'm correct about the traction control being dangerous the hard way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Hopefully you don't find out why I'm correct about the traction control being dangerous the hard way. I don't own a Supra anymore. I've had two though, one circa 400bhp and one around 600bhp. My current car doesn't have any driving aids at all - it doesn't even idle without driver input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirk Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I've driven a fair few TTs in the past year, stock and bpu, with stock TC and I have never suffered from these 'pulling out of junction' problems. Perhaps my right foot is broken and I'm not using it correctly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st3ven1 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Perhaps my right foot is broken and I'm not using it correctly? Yup sounds like you have one of those old analogue right feet, you need to "upgrade" to a digital input to see these results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dnk Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 (edited) One thing i will say is on my first UK car, 18 months old with very low miles and totally stock that the traction control was way to harsh, i actually thought i'd broke it the first time it cut in on me. There was no progression it just felt like the engine had been turned off and took a few seconds for it to recover. Edited October 22, 2012 by Dnk (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I don't know why they have nerve to even call it traction control, at least on the J spec, there is no intelligent power modulation to a slipping wheel like the modern systems, Its just a basic ABS sensor detects wheel spin (eventually) and then just closes the secondary butterfly in the throttle, resulting in you stranded in the middle of the junction or roundabout you have just tried to make a quick bid to get out of, with all the traffic bearing down on you while the Supra just crawls forward, while it waits for the butterfly to reopen, so it can do it all over again because you still have your boot in it trying to make progress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dnk Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 (edited) It's only really bad when you have the weight of the car transferring from one side to the other thus making it easier for one of the rears to lose grip and trigger the traction control. Once your moving its way less obvious but i've had it cutting in at around 90 on a straight and dry rd that had a bit of a crest on it Edited October 22, 2012 by Dnk (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirk Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Don't get me wrong I am no way saying its a great system because it isn't (especially on pre facelift) BUT if you can predict when its about to cut in its livable. I can happily tolerate the facelift version as its nowhere near as bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dnk Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Having had it cut in a few times at very slow pull offs either turning right or left or on roundabouts i turn mine off now as its just too on or off for me. I don't doubt it's saved plenty of people from losing the back end but i'd rather balance my driving to the conditions and am quite happy to control some wheel spin out of a junction Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benkei Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Mine cut in the other night seemingly out of the blue with no warning. Pulling off the gym car park in the wet, not fast or aggressive as it was late ad no one around so no need to rush, but the rears slipped due to the wet road and the TC cut the engine power straight away and put me into Snow Mode! I pressed the TC Off button and I got full engine power again after a second or two. I thought it was over-kill, inconvenient, and unintelligent. I know it's been said that maybe it was good 10 years ago when it was new, but if it's useless now then it must have been useless then too, just maybe nothing better to compare it with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheefa Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 To be fair I agree with all comments here. Yes it can be dangerous if you misjudged the road conditions and slip whilst hanging precariously at a junction, but YOU still misjudged the conditions. It certainly can be detrimental if you haven't understood how, when and why it cuts in. I don't think it's outright dangerous, just bad mannered at times. Driving with it off is probably a safer bet in many ways if you constantly trigger it - which would be quite worrying in the first place. I do intend on removing it asap and fitting Syvecs or RL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveR Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I always used to just switch off the stock system whenever I got into the car. Standard procedure became: gearbox in neutral, turn key, switch off TC, clunk-click... Go! I never had any particularly hair-raising experiences like some here are claiming, but I did experience it cutting in on inappropriate (and therefore extremely annoying) occasions. The orange light never bothered me either! I now have a Syvecs S6 with 5 TC settings (mapped by RyanG, of course), but to be honest I've got so used to trusting my right foot I've had it in the "Off" position since I picked my car up. I must make a note to see how well it works! This isn't me trying to sound heroic or anything, by the way, I just found I preferred to be in (what I consider to be) full control. If it then all went wrong at least I could only blame myself, not an outdated TC system. Touch wood I've had no issues so far! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marc_p Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 Rubbish. There is no chance that the system has caused more crashes than it's caused, if this were the case it would be a blanket removal of the system on the forum. As I've already said it will have saved hundreds of people new to RWD in the dry and loads of people not used to the power in the wet. And as for the cliche of pulling out in front of a lorry(which everyone seems to be doing). If a stock TT(assuming standard suspension in good condition and proper tyres) was to pull out in front of a lorry from a junction at WOT in the dry it would not lose traction and the traction control would not intervene. So my suggestion is that all of these examples of people "pulling out in front of lorries" were either driving too fast for the wet conditions or had sub standard suspension/tyres or both. Don't get me wrong I run with it off most of the time but have plenty of experience of RWD cars and handling them sideways.(had six RWD cars and used three of them for drifting) As for removing the TC, you're my hero. How many miles have you done this year? Believe what you want, but my view is that the TC system is just pure dangerous, especially at BPU. Probably covered around 40,000 miles since removing the TC, 10,000 miles this year in the current Supra. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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