Samurai 20V Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 (edited) Guys, Decatted my car and the dreaded Turbo seals have showed their hand.... I am not gonna do the single turbo conversion as yet, maybe in the future.. So my options are 2nd hand twins or hybrids.. I checked out the Whiftbitz hybrids, as per the link below, my questions are as follows... 1. Will these run on the Jspec Stock Ecu and injectors? 2. Can I just run a restrictor and EBC to 1.2 bar as per the usual BPU until I get the car back to S.A to map it properbly? 3. Anybody using the hybrids? If this is not acceptable, I need to look for good 2nd hand units... Thks. http://whifbitzperformancetuning.co.uk/toyota-supra-supra-turbo-upgrades-turbochargers-garage-whifbitz-p-1572.html Edited September 11, 2011 by Samurai 20V (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirk Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 There only rebuilt turbos. The only difference is they have steel turbine shafts vs the original ceramic's. Just run them the same as you do now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 If you are looking to go single in the future then I would recommend just picking up a decent 2nd hand set to be honest. Not much point in putting money into hybrids, money that you won't get back, only to switch them out for a single later down the line. You can get decent tubbys for around £250-£300. You don't need the whole assy so shipping won't be THAT bad. However, is it definitely the turbo seals and not the valve stem seals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Actually, having hybrids is a little "safer" in terms of fueling when compared to ceramic jspecs when going above 1 bar/"BPU" They are slower to spool which will help that nasty lean crossover point you get with the ceramics. They'll be at 100% duty above 1 bar anyway and still be quite rich with the 440's, so there is plenty of room provided the fuel system is working well. 1) yes 2) yes, no need to remap unless you really want to 3) plenty on here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samurai 20V Posted September 2, 2011 Author Share Posted September 2, 2011 If you are looking to go single in the future then I would recommend just picking up a decent 2nd hand set to be honest. Not much point in putting money into hybrids, money that you won't get back, only to switch them out for a single later down the line. You can get decent tubbys for around £250-£300. You don't need the whole assy so shipping won't be THAT bad. However, is it definitely the turbo seals and not the valve stem seals? The car is smoking when approaching a traffic signal, when I stop then a huge plume goes past the window, if I give it a blip then it smokes again.. The VSS are worn though, get some smoke on cold startup.. I came across these twins for sale, equivalent of £270, what do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samurai 20V Posted September 2, 2011 Author Share Posted September 2, 2011 (edited) Actually, having hybrids is a little "safer" in terms of fueling when compared to ceramic jspecs when going above 1 bar/"BPU" They are slower to spool which will help that nasty lean crossover point you get with the ceramics. They'll be at 100% duty above 1 bar anyway and still be quite rich with the 440's, so there is plenty of room provided the fuel system is working well. 1) yes 2) yes, no need to remap unless you really want to 3) plenty on here Thanks... Running them at the full 1.4bar with the stock ecu and injectors might be pushing it though? I will contact Paul and ask him more on the Whiftbitz's one.. Edited September 2, 2011 by Samurai 20V (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samurai 20V Posted September 2, 2011 Author Share Posted September 2, 2011 (edited) However, is it definitely the turbo seals and not the valve stem seals? So this got me thinking, went and did some testing.. The car has been showing signs of worn valve stem seals before the decat. First checked the oil level, it is quite a bit over the full mark.. Then took it for a spin, smoke was much reduced, it seemed to only smoke after idling abit in traffic, not when decelerating... I havent been driving on full boost because I am running in the new clutch, but I am hoping that it is not the turbo seals but the vss playing up cos of the extra oil.. I think I will run the car for a while and see how it behaves before making any decisions, if I can save the money for the single I'd rather do that.. Opinions? Edited September 2, 2011 by Samurai 20V (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Those turbos look OK, although one of the pictures shows one of the fins is bent? Might be the actual picture though. I would also want to see the turbine side though, that can be chipped just as easily and cause efficiency to be lost Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samurai 20V Posted September 2, 2011 Author Share Posted September 2, 2011 Those turbos look OK, although one of the pictures shows one of the fins is bent? Might be the actual picture though. I would also want to see the turbine side though, that can be chipped just as easily and cause efficiency to be lost Could be the pics making it look bent... Car is hardly smoking today, gonna run it for a while and see... No pics of the turbine side.. Will keep looking for others that come up..I should have bought your turbos, they looked good! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Could be the pics making it look bent... Car is hardly smoking today, gonna run it for a while and see... No pics of the turbine side.. Will keep looking for others that come up..I should have bought your turbos, they looked good! Yeah the ones I had were really good, I was plesantly surprised Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samurai 20V Posted September 2, 2011 Author Share Posted September 2, 2011 Yeah the ones I had were really good, I was plesantly surprised Hopefully if I need a set I can find one in the same condition.. On the plus side, the car is so much more responsive on with the double decat, an only revving it till 4000rpm... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marc_p Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 You'd be surprised at the smoke the VSS's give off when there worn, I just replaced mine, it never smoked whist moving but as soon as the car went to idle it started smoking, then when I blipped the throttle to set off, a massive plume of blue smoke would rise up behind, the car must of looked fooked when I was queing into Japfest this year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marc_p Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Just to add, if you have just gone BPU, that is when the VSS's usually show themselves up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 What Marc put is the reason I asked about you being certain. I was pretty sure with the tubby seals being worn that you would get smoke coming out on boost and on WOT rather than when idling, pulling away and pulling up. It isn't really good news as it's a fairly expensive job but at least it can put your mind at ease a little Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Turbo seals will make the car smoke on idle and at very low speeds when the car is hot. I'll never forget the night mine gave way. I'd been having a serious duel with a Ferrari California and then drove into central London... my car was billowing smoke out of the back like a steam train Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samurai 20V Posted September 2, 2011 Author Share Posted September 2, 2011 What Marc put is the reason I asked about you being certain. I was pretty sure with the tubby seals being worn that you would get smoke coming out on boost and on WOT rather than when idling, pulling away and pulling up. It isn't really good news as it's a fairly expensive job but at least it can put your mind at ease a little You are correct Scott... I appreciate your good sense, I was pretty worried last night... Thanks Marc, you have put my mind at rest.. Rather receive bad news that I knew about than new bad news.. I am planning to replace the VSS, just deciding were to do them, in SA or Japan, based on cost.. And whether to take the head off or not.. Thanks guys.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samurai 20V Posted September 2, 2011 Author Share Posted September 2, 2011 Turbo seals will make the car smoke on idle and at very low speeds when the car is hot. I'll never forget the night mine gave way. I'd been having a serious duel with a Ferrari California and then drove into central London... my car was billowing smoke out of the back like a steam train Do you mean smoke continuously on idle, not when you blip the throttle? If not then that's contrary to Scott and Marc's opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Do you mean smoke continuously on idle, not when you blip the throttle? If not then that's contrary to Scott and Marc's opinion. Mine smoked when I'd been sat still for a little while, and then when I moved off slowly. As soon as I put some pressure through the turbo it went. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marc_p Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Mine smoked when I'd been sat still for a little while, and then when I moved off slowly. As soon as I put some pressure through the turbo it went. But when you floored it I bet you got smoke when it spooled didn't you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 But when you floored it I bet you got smoke when it spooled didn't you? I didn't notice that, but then again it was a single turbo and I wasn't staring at my rear-view mirror all that often it certainly wasn't anywhere near the amount of smoke that I got at idle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samurai 20V Posted September 11, 2011 Author Share Posted September 11, 2011 Guys, I have been reading the threads on here about VSS and turbo seals and I am confused.. The car gives off a puff when started from cold, but clears up after that. It is fine when cold, no smoking at all.. When it heats up then it smokes when approaching a traffic light. It then smokes on take off.. It also smokes at times continuously on idle. I reckon it is turbo seals, but some of the posts on here are confusing me. I rechecked the oil level, it is on the full mark, it was slightly overfull, I drained some out.. Help please, I cannot stand a smokey motor and want to get to the bottom of this.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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