Homer Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 The r154 will handle the figures you're talking about with ease. The GT35r is a great choice IMO, it's been used here by many to acheive 550-600hp without massive boost (above 1.7 bar), but retaining early spool and almost no lag. Some of the larger turbo's mention here will certainly move the peak torque point up the range so as you already know, lots of research needed to find what's best for you. There are some (rather pricey) billet wheel options available recently which seem to be able to offer quicker spool without compromising peak power. They're a lot of money for the extra spool, so I think that unless you have a fair amount of money to spend the G35r is a good start point for your project. The stock cams are great for mid range power on sensibly sized turbo's, but will cause issues higher up the rev range. Even on something like a T67dbb they'll start to choke up above 6krpm. Are you looking to retain the stock rev limit? It should really be fine to raise to 7.2k rpm without opening the engine but again stock cams will make that extra rpm fairly worthless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 The GT35r is a great choice IMO Agree, proven reliability and very responsive, the Garrett GT35R or GTX35R would be my first choice if building a fast road car for everyday use. At the power goals you are wanting I wouldn't bother with an aftermarket intake manifold/throttle, I would put the money towards the GTX35R turbo instead. I would go with the Power Enterprise SH800A 800cc Injectors (side feed/high impedance), these are a straight swap for the stock injectors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Just been looking at the cast/tubular manifold link, interesting stuff! Could very well be what I need! I don't think you'd be able to use a standard single turbo kit/exhaust manifold, the FD3 engine bay looks too narrow to me, I think you'd need to get a tubular manifold custom fabricated to fit the available space. It'd be a lot simpler, probably cheaper and probably more reliable to use a cast manifold IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwdwiganer Posted June 18, 2011 Author Share Posted June 18, 2011 I'm not too sure about the rev limit, will be something I will have to look into and possibly get a bit more advice from you guys on here on this! Pretty sure I'll be staying with stock cams, so if raising the rev limit with stock cams is pointless I will leave it as Toyota intended, unless anyone knows otherwise. Sorry for my slow replies, I'm away at the moment picking the rx7 up for the conversion, but thanks for all your help so far! The r154 will handle the figures you're talking about with ease. The GT35r is a great choice IMO, it's been used here by many to acheive 550-600hp without massive boost (above 1.7 bar), but retaining early spool and almost no lag. Some of the larger turbo's mention here will certainly move the peak torque point up the range so as you already know, lots of research needed to find what's best for you. There are some (rather pricey) billet wheel options available recently which seem to be able to offer quicker spool without compromising peak power. They're a lot of money for the extra spool, so I think that unless you have a fair amount of money to spend the G35r is a good start point for your project. The stock cams are great for mid range power on sensibly sized turbo's, but will cause issues higher up the rev range. Even on something like a T67dbb they'll start to choke up above 6krpm. Are you looking to retain the stock rev limit? It should really be fine to raise to 7.2k rpm without opening the engine but again stock cams will make that extra rpm fairly worthless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted June 18, 2011 Share Posted June 18, 2011 With stock cams power will start to drop off before the stock 6800 rpm rev limit, so no benefit real benefit raising it. I used in256/ex264 cams on mine with a 7K rpm limit this helped it pull a bit longer, see dyno HERE I would choose to fit cams before the intake plenum you were considering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
safcdixon Posted June 18, 2011 Share Posted June 18, 2011 http://www.tech2motorsports.com/rx7.php it may be worth looking at that site its the site i was gonna use for my fd3s 2jz conversion, until i saw the light and bought a supra, they have all the custom gear you need to install it in the smaller fd engine bay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwdwiganer Posted June 20, 2011 Author Share Posted June 20, 2011 http://www.tech2motorsports.com/rx7.php it may be worth looking at that site its the site i was gonna use for my fd3s 2jz conversion, until i saw the light and bought a supra, they have all the custom gear you need to install it in the smaller fd engine bay. I did look at this when first thinking about doing the swap, and I thought exactly the same about just buying a Supra with a single turbo kit already fitted! That 'kit' conversion from the US is big money. The only reason I decided to pursue the conversion is because I have a friend that owns his own engineering company that wants to make his own custom subframe, mounts and fit the engine and box in the RX7 I recently purchased with a water leak and no MOT for only £1500... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 You have considered that many kits assume you have a LHD car, haven't you? The tech2 diff cradlle looks very frail, one of the bi issues with RX-7 FD transplants is the replacements for the PPF (power plant frame) are illconceived and feed loads into the floorpan. Feeding loads into a proper welded n roll cage would be a lot better. You need to find if an off the shelf turbo manifold and downpipe will fit a RHD car. I reckon this will cost a LOT LOT more than you are anticipating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwdwiganer Posted June 21, 2011 Author Share Posted June 21, 2011 You have considered that many kits assume you have a LHD car, haven't you? The tech2 diff cradlle looks very frail, one of the bi issues with RX-7 FD transplants is the replacements for the PPF (power plant frame) are illconceived and feed loads into the floorpan. Feeding loads into a proper welded n roll cage would be a lot better. You need to find if an off the shelf turbo manifold and downpipe will fit a RHD car. I reckon this will cost a LOT LOT more than you are anticipating. I know this is no easy conversion, but I have a really good, proven engineer carrying out the conversion. He will be manufacturing his own kit to fit the engine and box into the FD. I must admit i'm more concerned about the wiring that will be involved just to get it running! Downpipe won't be a problem, manifold possibly, but looking into that as we speak. I am considering using a cast manifold but will be checking what room there will be in the engine bay before deciding on one for sure! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 Contact members dandan and Wez about cast manifold options, they've both done their own builds and have experience of the different cast manifolds that are available. dandan's Project Thread Wez's project Thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwdwiganer Posted June 21, 2011 Author Share Posted June 21, 2011 Thanks, just had a quick look... The treadstone cast manifold from the US seems cheap to buy at least! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 Thanks, just had a quick look... The treadstone cast manifold from the US seems cheap to buy at least! Yes they look decent, the wastegate port looks far to small to flow enough to control a GT35R, think it would definitely need machining out bigger, Dan's thread details the modifications he made to his. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 Ryan.G had similar constraints when building his mid-front engined Supra. I think he still had some space issues with the cast manifold and went for an XS power one in the end. Not an ideal solution due to the poor manufacturing quality, but it seemed to work well for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwdwiganer Posted June 21, 2011 Author Share Posted June 21, 2011 I must admit I have been looking at the XS Power manifolds too, I suppose only time will tell when I know exactly just how much room I will have to play with. Trying to choose the right turbo is proving to be a bit of a nightmare though! I was convinced a GT35r would produce the figures I want, with stock cams, head gasket and bolts, but is up to 600hp atf safe with this set up? What boost do you think I might have to run to achieve this safely? Would a t61 be a better option? Possibly a bullseye series turbo from Whifbitz? I'm slightly lost when it comes to turbo's as there are so many available! I'm simply looking for one to produce the kind of power I want on a stock engine... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 I must admit I have been looking at the XS Power manifolds too, I suppose only time will tell when I know exactly just how much room I will have to play with. Trying to choose the right turbo is proving to be a bit of a nightmare though! I was convinced a GT35r would produce the figures I want, with stock cams, head gasket and bolts, but is up to 600hp atf safe with this set up? What boost do you think I might have to run to achieve this safely? Would a t61 be a better option? Possibly a bullseye series turbo from Whifbitz? I'm slightly lost when it comes to turbo's as there are so many available! I'm simply looking for one to produce the kind of power I want on a stock engine... A GT35R with 1.6 or 1.7 bar should see you close to 600fwhp. The T61 sized precision turbos are more or less the same as the GT35R, members have got to the 590bhp range on those without going above 1.7 bar. The T67dbb is another one to look at as it'll get you closer to 600bhp without quite as much boost, but will retain similar spoolup, though obviously the compressor housings are bigger on those so fitment may be an issue. The bullseye turbo's are pretty physically big, some of them are twin scroll so the exhuast housings are huge. It would be worth making a call to Paul Whiffin to see what he can suggest considering the physical size constraints. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 I must admit I have been looking at the XS Power manifolds too, I suppose only time will tell when I know exactly just how much room I will have to play with. Trying to choose the right turbo is proving to be a bit of a nightmare though! I was convinced a GT35r would produce the figures I want, with stock cams, head gasket and bolts, but is up to 600hp atf safe with this set up? What boost do you think I might have to run to achieve this safely? Would a t61 be a better option? Possibly a bullseye series turbo from Whifbitz? I'm slightly lost when it comes to turbo's as there are so many available! I'm simply looking for one to produce the kind of power I want on a stock engine... The GT35R at 1.5bar will make around 550hp, 600hp would need 1.8-2.0bar, it'll be similar figures with any 61mm turbo. A 67mm turbo at 1.5bar will make around 600hp. The GTX35R I mentioned earlier is claimed to flow 10% more than the GT35R with similar/faster spool up, so at 1.5bar it should be good for around 600hp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 A GT35R with 1.6 or 1.7 bar should see you close to 600fwhp. The T61 sized precision turbos are more or less the same as the GT35R, members have got to the 590bhp range on those without going above 1.7 bar. Is that with stock cams? Thought it'd need a bit more than 1.7bar, but never pushed mine that high to see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwdwiganer Posted June 21, 2011 Author Share Posted June 21, 2011 Thanks for the fast replies! I really don't know what I would do without this forum! Right I will look into all the options you have both listed above, really do appreciate your suggestions! Sorry to keep questioning what 'safe' boost I should be ok to run on my standard 2J engine, i'm not used to options where power figures like this are so easily achieveable! I'm used to my Nissans that seem to melt at anything above 1.3 bar! A T61 precision or GTX35r look like the favourite two I will be looking at. The t67 turbos sound to me like the ideal turbos for a Supra?... but seems to me in my case with the engine being fitted in an RX7 (so limited space) and with standard engine (headgasket and cams) I think it might be physically too big or create too much turbo lag without the other engine modifications needed to run higher power, this is only my limited understanding of course! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 Is that with stock cams? Thought it'd need a bit more than 1.7bar, but never pushed mine that high to see. Good point Nic, the cars I am thinking of had 264 HKS cams, so maybe 30bhp or so less with the stockers at the same boost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 The t67 turbos sound to me like the ideal turbos for a Supra?... but seems to me in my case with the engine being fitted in an RX7 (so limited space) and with standard engine (headgasket and cams) I think it might be physically too big or create too much turbo lag without the other engine modifications needed to run higher power, this is only my limited understanding of course! IMO the T67 dual bearing turbo's offer the best compromise between early spool and peak power, however if you are going for a cast manifold it's going to be a bit of a restriction so may be best looking for a smaller turbo like the ones mentioned earlier. The T67dbb works fantastic on the tubular manifolds (I had one on an XS power on my old Supra), it spooled as fast as a T61, but gave a much lower drop in torque at 5.5krpm+ Only the stock cams choked up a bit above 6krpm or so, but it would still pull nicely to redline. Have a play with the dyno comparisons at http://www.2bartuning.com, but make sure you select ones with stock cams and inlet as they can make a big difference when combined. I honestly think your first step should be to get the engine droped in to see what space you have to play with. EDIT: Missed your question about the boost/power for stock engines. Many people here have run 1.6 bar on the smaller T61/T67 sized turbo's without issue, it's when the power is climbing above 600bhp/500ib/ft along with raised rev limits that the stock engine may start to struggle with hard use/high mileage. My old one has a T67dbb running 1.4 bar and has been fine since 2007 with daily use. It's "only" 550bhp, but at this level they should be very reliable provided the engine is strong, there's a good ECU and mapper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 In fact, have a look here (this is a T67dbb on a cast manifold): http://www.mkivsupra.net/vbb/showthread.php?249201 621bhp @ 1.7 bar with a stock engine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpo Posted June 22, 2011 Share Posted June 22, 2011 i got 619bhp off my gt35r @ 1.7 bar,had 1000cc injectors,f-con v-pro gold,twin pumps,1 x hks 264 camshaft,some small headwork,etc i have the car running on 1.4 bar now and its making 520hp....thats on a 1jz vvti engine from a jzx100 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwdwiganer Posted June 22, 2011 Author Share Posted June 22, 2011 In fact, have a look here (this is a T67dbb on a cast manifold): http://www.mkivsupra.net/vbb/showthread.php?249201 621bhp @ 1.7 bar with a stock engine You are right, I will have to wait and see what space I have to play with. I think going off what I have seen so far I may go for a t67dbb turbo possibly off the shelf from whifbitz (if they do one) or unless anyone can recommend another good UK supplier as i'm pretty sure the Precision turbos are only available from outside the UK? This is of course if everything will actually fit! If this is an issue a t61 may be my only option! I am hoping that an XS Power manifold will fit too (I know the quality is questionable...) but you were right, only time will tell! I know I am really indecisive, but the impressive power figures ive seen at quite low boost with t67 turbos is the thing that is putting me off going for a t61. Will there be much difference in spool up times between the two with my standard engine? I don't want the car to be too laggy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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