Hamilton, spoilt brat !

[Paul]

Massa is half a car length in front arriving at the corner and has the line, Hamilton doesn't let off and can be seen cleary off the track on the inside of him in the last photo.

[Paul]

Penalties for what - Racing??

 

He is aiming for 'gaps' that only exist if he goes off the track, look again and he is over the kerbing?

[edinlexusV8]

Yeah ok it is too optimistic for Lewis to try something like that but it is still a racing incident. Both are committed to the same corner though one is half a car lengths ahead but the person who has the inside line is Lewis and the one who cut the line is Massa.

[edinlexusV8]

He is aiming for 'gaps' that only exist if he goes off the track, look again and he is over the kerbing?

 

Nothing wrong with using the kerb. Most of driver do use atleast part of the kerb every corner. Again if you look at experienced drivers they leave enough spare to avoid an accident including Schumi, Lewis, Jenson, Alonso.

 

Same thing happened in Singapore 2010 between Webber and Lewis and nobody got penalised.

[Paul]

I just thought that Hamilton today was being optimistic and it probably came through frustration, seen it before in his racing and imo the race officials were right to pull him up on it otherwise F1 would turn into bumper car racing like we see in Touring cars.

[Wez]

otherwise F1 would turn into bumper car racing like we see in Touring cars.

 

There is nothing wrong with touring car racing, in fact as a spectator sport I would say it's very exciting

[edinlexusV8]

Monaco Grand Prix has sparked a ferocious debate. Sean (one of the f1fanatic members) put it this way:

Let’s face it, at Monaco, ANY pass can be judged ill-advised so they should arguably all just follow each other round and you could put “no overtaking” signs up all around the circuit.

 

I agree with those saying it’s a question of philosophy and consistency. Either you want overtaking in F1 or you don’t, and the gap between an OK pass and an avoidable collision is far too narrow at the moment, too arbitrarily judged, not consistently judged and always with the comfortable benefit of hindsight by people in suits – it’s just saying “only have a go when you’re 100.0% certain you can make the pass” and it mitigates against the one thing the sport has been trying to achieve all these years.

 

At Monaco especially – as you saw when Schumacher passed Hamilton – passes are only made when there’s a level of co-operation from the guy being passed. There are still plenty of cases of drivers “closing the stable door after the horse has bolted” but the stewards have a tendency to rule that the quicker guy should have just sat in the queue and not done anything, and it’s never the fault of the guy doing the blocking.

 

We need to recognize that sometimes if you put a bunch of guys in a broom cupboard with 700 horsepower each, mix them up and tell them to race, some of them actually will and they won’t always agree. There’s such a thing as a racing incident and I’m personally glad that some drivers, like Hamilton and Schumacher today, are prepared to have a go.

Sean

 

I totally agree with Sean!!

[Havard]

There is nothing wrong with touring car racing, in fact as a spectator sport I would say it's very exciting

 

I would rather watch BTCC all day compared to F1. I always used to watch F1 years ago as I was guaranteed to get some kip on a sunday afternoon..!!

[a98pmalcolm]

I dont really like F1 but i like Hamilton as a person i think hes a nice guy and has done very well for some of the things hes been through..

[creative]

Yawn....

 

typical F1.

 

well done hamilton for speaking up.

 

and this

We need to recognize that sometimes if you put a bunch of guys in a broom cupboard with 700 horsepower each, mix them up and tell them to race, some of them actually will and they won’t always agree.

 

made me laugh! I can see it now, all squished in....

[Tony]

Yeah ok it is too optimistic for Lewis to try something like that but it is still a racing incident. Both are committed to the same corner though one is half a car lengths ahead but the person who has the inside line is Lewis and the one who cut the line is Massa.

Lol Massa is in front so has the line, F1 is not a contact sport, unlike touring cars (which i like a lot) Hamilton is from the school of senna, if you dont get out of my way i will crash into you. Silly as it sounds back in the day that sort of thing could kill you. Anyway i thought you had to race on the track NOT OFF IT. Think you will find cutting corners to gain a advantage is cheating not racing

[Paul]

Lol Massa is in front so has the line, F1 is not a contact sport, unlike touring cars (which i like a lot) Hamilton is from the school of senna, if you dont get out of my way i will crash into you. Silly as it sounds back in the day that sort of thing could kill you. Anyway i thought you had to race on the track NOT OFF IT. Think you will find cutting corners to gain a advantage is cheating not racing

 

Cheers Tony, my point exactly.

[Bailey.]

He didn't cut the corner!!!!!!!!!! Clearly had no where to go! Simples!!! If you look at the the racing line there most of the drivers hit the apex almost on the exit of the hair pin, massa almost does it on the way in.lol

We will never get a right or wrong because everyone has there own opinion of what should be right and wrong in the sport!!!

[Dnk]

Lol Massa is in front so has the line, F1 is not a contact sport, unlike touring cars (which i like a lot) Hamilton is from the school of senna, if you dont get out of my way i will crash into you. Silly as it sounds back in the day that sort of thing could kill you. Anyway i thought you had to race on the track NOT OFF IT. Think you will find cutting corners to gain a advantage is cheating not racing

 

 

Yep thats my thoughts on it as well

[Paul]

The bottom line is that there wasn't enough room for him on the inside, Massa was half a car in front and already cutting into the apex so there is no way any car could have got through without barging which is what Hamilton did.

[Bailey.]

On the first lap msc went up the inside of Hamilton on exactly the same corner, instead of causing possible damage to his car and other drivers he yielded. Topic is simple to me, he needs to be a bit more carful on some of his over taking at Monaco and Monaco alone! As I said yesterday any other race track it just wouldn't have happened, he would have been gon up the road.

As for the comments he made, they don't offend me' and show he is a guy who want to win real bad!

[Tony]

He didn't cut the corner!!!!!!!!!! Clearly had no where to go! Simples!!! If you look at the the racing line there most of the drivers hit the apex almost on the exit of the hair pin, massa almost does it on the way in.lol

We will never get a right or wrong because everyone has there own opinion of what should be right and wrong in the sport!!!

You said it he had no where to go, no gap no chance so you brake to avoid contact, this the art of racing out braking etc etc not stock car car racing, a completly different art form. You can get it right & there is right and wrong within the rules.

[RedM]

F.errari

I.ncident

A.ssistance

[Thorin]

Hamilton was in the wrong in both incidents. Yes his black comment was meant in jest, but he still came across as a petulant little brat.

 

You crash into someone and you can expect to be up before the stewards. That's not being victimised. As for insulting other drivers for getting in his way, that's not going to make him any friends.

[neo2810]

Hamilton is a lousy driver and the only reason he is in the front is because he has a faster car.

 

That's just about the most uneducated comment of the thread, and this us thread is not lacking those, well done...

[j_jza80]

i think monaco should be dropped

 

its the most boring race of the whole season and theres hardly any overtaking

 

its like watching a scalextric race

 

i think they only race monaco now because its a historic circuit of F1

 

if they had any sense for the racing aspect, they would ditch it

 

I'm not a massive F1 fan, but I really enjoyed yesterday's GP. The racing between Vettel, Alonso and Button towards the end was fantastic, some of the best I've seen for ages

[edinlexusV8]

Some of you guys think there is no place for Massa to go. But I dont agree with that. Earlier during the race shumi passed Lewis at the hairpin. There is two cars width around that hair pin.

 

 

If Massa is taking a particular line in at that hairpin that is fine usually but when you have another half of a car up your inside you cannot still turn in just the way you were doing when there was no car up the inside. This accident was avoidable. I think Massa did turn in a bit too much. He might aswell followed Webber as he was doing but right at that corner he decided to turn in the maximum he could so that he can close the door on Hamilton. But hamilton being Hamilton already commited to that corner (though he is not exactly on the racing line) he too has no where to go but onto the kerb.

Racing line is only the fastest line to go round the race track. Just because you are on the racing line doesnt mean that you dont have to consider cars that may be coming on the inside of the corner to do an overtake.

 

To be honest Massa was just following webber leaving a car's width on the track to the inside just before the hairpin. Then Webber went a bit wide at that hairpin which Massa noticed and dived into that gap not noticing Lewis was also aiming for the same gap. This is where I think the whole collision occurred.

 

If you draw a trace for Massa's line at this corner (in the following 3 pics) you can easily see that he changed his direction quite a bit more than usual! Esp considering Lewis is on the inside (only by just) still I think Massa could have avoided the collision. From the third pic below he had enough space to his right. He might have chosen to use that by following Webber and get a better traction on the exit of the hairpin and still be ahead of Lewis and be on the inside for the next immediate corner/right turn.

 

 

 

 

Infact Massa turned in so much into the corner that Webber clipped his front wing.

[edinlexusV8]

Also Lewis was voicing his concerns about the inconsistency in Stewards giving penalties. Similar event happened in Singapore last year between Webber and Hamilton. Webber never received any penalty for that.

 

[video=youtube;Ynp28-jt8J0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ynp28-jt8J0

[edinlexusV8]

Listen to another driver's review of the incidents (Anthony Davidson) .... BBC Podcast on FiveLive ... Listen from 15 mins onwards reg Hamilton's incident.

 

http://downloads.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/fivelive/cff1/cff1_20110529-1912a.mp3

[Paul]

Also Lewis was voicing his concerns about the inconsistency in Stewards giving penalties. Similar event happened in Singapore last year between Webber and Hamilton. Webber never received any penalty for that.

 

So the inconsistency of the decisions, maybe the others should have been penalised too rather than Hamilton being in the right?

Why would the stewards pick on him ?