Scott Posted February 18, 2011 Author Share Posted February 18, 2011 I had an RPS 6 puck on mine Scott. Granted i didnt do many miles, but it was smooth on uptake (despite half the distance i drove being unmapped and frankly not that nice) just heavier than OEM 'feel' I'm getting so many contrasting opinions on these clutches. I had an RPS stage 2 on my MR2 and I absolutely hated it. The weight was ridiculous but liveable for me, what I couldn't abide was the biting point. It was so low it was ridiculous. I tried adjusting the pedal but it made very little difference. I've read that the only way to get it correct was a modified master cylinder. That was an organic RPS though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 18, 2011 Author Share Posted February 18, 2011 When i went single i spent around the £10k mark with Michel, that was mainly for the fully built engine, good size fuel system from tank, and ecu, new pump, crank dampener, labour, mapping and a few other bits. The intercooler, turbo, downpipes, manifold, wastegate, exhaust, fuel rail, injectors, clutch, cams, intake and filter i'd already bought, some second hand, some new. So i guess you could put my build at more the £15k'ish. But i wanted to do it properly, no weak points, and i wanted an engine that would last as long as the stock one does running twins. I've only done about 5k in mine since the build but i would have no doubts that my engine, running what little boost it does, could happily do another 100k on top running the power it is, and i'd be confidant that if i ran another half a bar and got the power up to closer to 700 that it'd last as long. From what i've seen with singles, its the cars running higher boost that are less reliable. Am I right in saying you got a built engine and a single turbo setup for £15k? Half would be accumulated to the actual single setup costs and the other half to making sure the engine was futureproof? That is a really good idea of the costs involved then as I thought going with a built engine would be a LOT more expensive than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Am I right in saying you got a built engine and a single turbo setup for £15k? Half would be accumulated to the actual single setup costs and the other half to making sure the engine was futureproof? That is a really good idea of the costs involved then as I thought going with a built engine would be a LOT more expensive than that. Around that price buddy. i've never really added it up. I did drop very lucky with the some of the single parts though, i could add another £5k to that if i hadn't, plus i could add another £1k to that if i'd upgraded the head, which i didn't, was never planning on running higher revs than standard or a larger turbo than a t67 so didn't see the need. People will argue that a built engine is no guarantee of futureproofing though, quite a few of the singles that have failed on here have had built engines. It's just down to personal preference at the end of the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Given the experience you have now, do you not think that a reliable single can be built for around £10k? Starting with a good base of course. That's the rub though, I have the experience now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 18, 2011 Author Share Posted February 18, 2011 That's the rub though, I have the experience now. Me too, thanks to all you lot faffing around previously Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Me too, thanks to all you lot faffing around previously Quoted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 18, 2011 Author Share Posted February 18, 2011 Quoted Hahahaha. I don't drive my car often so I won't be as restricted to certain criteria. In the last 3.5 years I have done 4k lol. Would take me 40 years to be doing your 50k miles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesy Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 That all adds up to just over £7k not including fitting or the gaskets & bits and bobs etc etc. The fitting and bits and bobs can easily cover the £3k dependant on what you are after, add into that that I probably saved £1k on the parts I got from JP (I would have bought lesser parts totalling around £3K), it can be done. And in my humble opinion it can be done properly. . So now you're saying YOUR build, using 2nd hand parts for some bits, and doing some labour yourself will come in at 10k - you're contradicting yourself mate And all the other "nice" bits people do, and maintenance ARE essential if you want your set up to last. You wouldnt have to replace valve stem seals, shims, gaskets, brakes etc if you werent going for bigger power so infact it is actually part of the build. You can jump from a stock 320bhp TT to a 500-700bhp single without doing these bits - just whacking a turbo kit, ecu and getting it mapped wont be enough. Everyone's build is different, but in essence you will need to spend around £10k min to "go single" .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Hahahaha. I don't drive my car often so I won't be as restricted to certain criteria. In the last 3.5 years I have done 4k lol. Would take me 40 years to be doing your 50k miles Fair one - I guess it depends how addicted you get to driving it! My miles were at pretty serious speeds as well... I don't take many prisoners Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 18, 2011 Author Share Posted February 18, 2011 (edited) So now you're saying YOUR build, using 2nd hand parts for some bits, and doing some labour yourself will come in at 10k - you're contradicting yourself mate And all the other "nice" bits people do, and maintenance ARE essential if you want your set up to last. You wouldnt have to replace valve stem seals, shims, gaskets, brakes etc if you werent going for bigger power so infact it is actually part of the build. You can jump from a stock 320bhp TT to a 500-700bhp single without doing these bits - just whacking a turbo kit, ecu and getting it mapped wont be enough. Everyone's build is different, but in essence you will need to spend around £10k min to "go single" .... No I'm not, my build is completely different to the cost of going single. I am building my car up in preperation of going single, 2 completely different costs. Face it Jamesy, you aren't grasping it here Edit: Just to add. If you look at my list you will see that I listed what is the single build, what is the optional extras and what is the maintenence in my list. I have clearly stated 3 different costs. If you want to know how much my etire build cost add them all together. If you want to see how much actually changing to single turbo cost you only need look at the total of the first list. Edited February 18, 2011 by Scott (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobSheffield Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Face it Jamesy, you aren't grasping it here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 The thread title is "actual single cost discussion" so I suppose that means both new and second-hand, tuner-built and home-built. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 18, 2011 Author Share Posted February 18, 2011 (edited) Loads missed out but when talking about going single. The actual cost to do so can be captured in the first 2 lists. The 2nd list is goal/budget dependant. I think everything in the first list is pretty much a given. The last 2 lists are probably infinitely variable and will totally depend on the current condition of your engine. Single List Required: Manifold Turbo Downpipe Wastegate Injectors ECU Intercooler Piping from turbo to intercooler Filter Filter Piping Oil Feed/Return Lines (Possibly water also) Fuel Pump Service Various Gaskets, nuts, bolts, bits & bobs Breather setup Single List Optional Extras Power/spec Dependant (Option tick sheet 1) Intake Manifold (Usually brings with it a lot of changes such as throttle body, fusebox, battery relocation etc) Unrestrictive Exhaust Intercooler Cams Boost Controller Traction Control Fuel Rail Fuel Pressure Regulator Clutch Springs/Retainers (Cam/Rev dependant) Oil Cooler BOV Colder Spark Plugs Engine Bay Tidy Recommended Prior to Major HP Increases: AFR Gauge EGT Gauge Oil Pressure Gauge Oil Temp Gauge Boost Gauge OEM Oil Pump OEM Water Pump Stem Seals Optional Prior to Major HP Increases: Built bottom end Built Head Freshened bottom end/head (This list could be endless) Edited February 18, 2011 by Scott (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesy Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 No I'm not, my build is completely different to the cost of going single. I am building my car up in preperation of going single, 2 completely different costs. Face it Jamesy, you aren't grasping it here Edit: Just to add. If you look at my list you will see that I listed what is the single build, what is the optional extras and what is the maintenence in my list. I have clearly stated 3 different costs. If you want to know how much my etire build cost add them all together. If you want to see how much actually changing to single turbo cost you only need look at the total of the first list. fc(k me you're like a dog with a bone today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesy Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 No I'm not, my build is completely different to the cost of going single. I am building my car up in preperation of going single, 2 completely different costs. . EXACTLY!! You're having to make your car ready to be a single turbo - that is a cost you wouldnt do if you werent going single. so in that case it IS part of the cost of transforming your car to a single!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RCK10 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Confused.com This seems to be more of a "what you need" thread than what it costs. Tbh, ive no idea about singles and costs, but from what ive read so far i cant see where the argument is? All of the comments ive read so far seem to make sense. Its just yous are trying to compare two completely different styles of build! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 18, 2011 Author Share Posted February 18, 2011 My argument and my entire basis for starting this thread is that people throw around figures based on what they have done, the options they have chosen and the preventative maintenence they have carried out. As we all know these costs can SERIOUSLY add up but we can only advise on what we think is good practice. We can't very well say well it cost me xxxxxx to go single so you better budget that way when it could easily cost more or less. I was told to budget for 10k minimum when I started asking the questions. This figure can vary so wildly dependant on a whole host of criteria so I think it is better to simply quote what we know it will cost (within reason, parts choice will always govern the cost) rather than throwing out wild speculation about the current state of the car/engine. As an example if I were to factor in the cost of UK spec brakes all round, goodridge brake hoses all round, 3G RS brake discs all round, 19" alloys with 10" rear, 265 rear tyres, FMIC, new oil pump, new water pump, new FMS, etc etc etc into my build then I would be WAYYYYYYY over budget. But I'm not, because I already have them on the car. People who don't have those things on the car may want to spend the extra to get them, they may not. We can only advise based on our experience but some people can't see the wood for the trees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_jza80 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 IMO, an EGT/AFR gauge should be a required part of going full BPU, never mind single. I would argue that tyres are a required cost of going single, as many tyres really won't be upto the task, where they may have been ok at BPU. If you already have UK brakes, even the stock setup will be ok for a small single. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 18, 2011 Author Share Posted February 18, 2011 EXACTLY!! You're having to make your car ready to be a single turbo - that is a cost you wouldnt do if you werent going single. so in that case it IS part of the cost of transforming your car to a single!!!!!!! I would be as well hammering nails into my forehead. You can't just pluck a figure out of the sky and say this is what it costs for a good car build. You CAN say this is what it costs to buy decent parts in order to go single (my argument) but you will need to factor in costs for things that need refreshing and things that you want to upgrade at the same time for safety/handling/preference. The first part, the going single, is what it costs to buy all the parts in order to go single... you know... the single parts that I have been talking about since post 1. The 2nd part is going to depend on the condition of the engine. The 3rd part is going to depend on the wants/needs of the end user. If you have a look you will notice that you can give a reasonable quote on part 1. Parts 2 and 3 are infinitely variable. You could spend £20k on the best single parts that money can buy, top dollar everything, and have your car blow up after 2 miles due to a faulty oil pump/water pump etc etc. My point was that you can't just say it costs xxxx to go single and incorperate the costs of the preventetive maintenence into that as they are 2 completely seperate things. 1 is the single build, 2 is making the engine reliable to handle the power goal. They are 2 completely seperate quotes that go hand in hand with a single build yes, but they are completely different things to discuss when someone asks for advice on the costs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 18, 2011 Author Share Posted February 18, 2011 IMO, an EGT/AFR gauge should be a required part of going full BPU, never mind single. I would argue that tyres are a required cost of going single, as many tyres really won't be upto the task, where they may have been ok at BPU. If you already have UK brakes, even the stock setup will be ok for a small single. Totally agree that they are important, they are only a recommendation though not a requirement to the cost of the build. These are things I would factor into the recommendation bracket (even though they would all be highly recommended lol) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_jza80 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 The £10k figure is banded around alot as that has been the approximate average cost of many people going single. It's been proven before that it can be done for less. Wether it should or not, is a different argument. I went through this pricing process in great detail with my UK spec. By the time i'd finished, I was looking at around £12k for everything on the turbo side, plus many thousand of pounds extra for other things (brakes, bodykit, suspension etc) It worked out far more economical (for me) to sell my UK spec for a very low price, and spend my single budget on a fresh import with the work already done. If you're trying to save money while going single, this can be by far the most economical method. However, like ANY second hand purchases, it's always a gamble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 If you're trying to save money, don't go single full stop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_jza80 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 If you're trying to save money, don't go single full stop. To an extent, but there are various price levels to going single. One could easily spend more than £20k on components alone going single, but that doesn't necessarily mean you should Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 To an extent, but there are various price levels to going single. One could easily spend more than £20k on components alone going single, but that doesn't necessarily mean you should Yes but don't forget fuel costs, maintenence, insurance. It isn't just mechanicals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_jza80 Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Yes but don't forget fuel costs, maintenence, insurance. It isn't just mechanicals. My single was cheaper to run than my BPU UK spec auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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