Bailey. Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Not getting any info on my build thread so thought I would try here, I'm taking my engine out next week to change the oil pump before my single build, my question is do I take the block apart and replace bearings and piston rungs. Or do I just go with my original plan and just change the rod bolts??? How much more time is involved in this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Mitchell Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 its a bigger job removing the pistons ect, if your planning this why not go for a rebuilt bottom end with different pistons ect?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey. Posted February 13, 2011 Author Share Posted February 13, 2011 its a bigger job removing the pistons ect, if your planning this why not go for a rebuilt bottom end with different pistons ect?? A few things really, I seem to see more built bottom ends blowing than stock ones, obviously cost( not a great problem, but still a factor). Just really never planned to down that route just yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieP Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Did i not read you had low compression? You only notice built engines failing because they are on cars that run a lot more power, stock engine would not last 2 min in my car, infact i didnt last 2 min when i hit 700bhp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Mitchell Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 i agree with jamie but totally understand the additional cost ect ect. what bhp figures are you looking at having? go for the rebuild dude while the engine is out and nearly stripped down anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey. Posted February 13, 2011 Author Share Posted February 13, 2011 Did i not read you had low compression? You only notice built engines failing because they are on cars that run a lot more power, stock engine would not last 2 min in my car, infact i didnt last 2 min when i hit 700bhp. No Jamie comp results were ok, but leak down test were not up too par on 3 cylinders iirc. Believed to be down to valves not seating properly( could hear the air leaking into the inlet side) Hence why the heads getting refreshed. On the engine thing there is plenty of stock blocks running over 600hp, with no issues thousands of miles later, I'm not looking for upwards of 800hp like alot of guys, just wouldn't be able to use that kind of hp around here,the plan was to go built next year after I had got over the cost of going single. Purely for a reliability thing, not to rise the ponies! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey. Posted February 13, 2011 Author Share Posted February 13, 2011 i agree with jamie but totally understand the additional cost ect ect. what bhp figures are you looking at having? go for the rebuild dude while the engine is out and nearly stripped down anyway. I'm starting to consider it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Mitchell Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 good man, dont worry i get my arm twisted all the time... would be a serious machine though in all seriousness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nasoup Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Yes do the rings and the bearings Andy, it's not a big job if the engine is out anyway. You'll need a tool to get the pistons back in, which is basically a sheet of tin and 2 big jubilee clips, but apart from that it's pretty easy to get the krank etc out. GL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieP Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 No Jamie comp results were ok, but leak down test were not up too par on 3 cylinders iirc. Believed to be down to valves not seating properly( could hear the air leaking into the inlet side) Hence why the heads getting refreshed. On the engine thing there is plenty of stock blocks running over 600hp, with no issues thousands of miles later, I'm not looking for upwards of 800hp like alot of guys, just wouldn't be able to use that kind of hp around here,the plan was to go built next year after I had got over the cost of going single. Purely for a reliability thing, not to rise the ponies! Depends on the condition/mileage of the engine, some fail at stock power, some are fine at 550-600bhp for many miles. I can count on one hand the number of people that have made into the 700's and i will be surprised if they have even done a couple of thousand miles between them yet. You not looking for upwards of 800bhp you say, does that mean you want around 800bhp? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky49 Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Ummm, if the engines coming out then why not. But then again if your going for around 600 then do you really need to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Mitchell Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 the thing that i think is... if your running say 600bhp on stock engine the wear is going to be far more than its intended use and wont last long. with a built engine atleast you have the option of buying a bigger turbo and going for bigger figures, as i hear the BHP bug is hard to shake off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey. Posted February 13, 2011 Author Share Posted February 13, 2011 Depends on the condition/mileage of the engine, some fail at stock power, some are fine at 550-600bhp for many miles. I can count on one hand the number of people that have made into the 700's and i will be surprised if they have even done a couple of thousand miles between them yet. You not looking for upwards of 800bhp you say, does that mean you want around 800bhp? Nowhere near 800 hp, im using a 6765 so dont think that will even make 800 horses, but was planning to get the car mapped on high boost at around 1.5bar aiming for 600-650hp, which is hopefully realistic. what was the part that failed on your stock engine jamie? Ummm, if the engines coming out then why not. But then again if your going for around 600 then do you really need to. i agree totally, why not, it just wasnt planned, and would have been quite happy to do the rod bolts etc myself. but when your talking about building a block for huge hp with all new parts, not only is it the cost in parts, im not sure i would want to be playing with all those new parts, so would be looking for someone to build it, so i will have to get an idea of what kinda labour is involved in this? The need it part of your comment is also in my mind. the thing that i think is... if your running say 600bhp on stock engine the wear is going to be far more than its intended use and wont last long. with a built engine atleast you have the option of buying a bigger turbo and going for bigger figures, as i hear the BHP bug is hard to shake off. where is the wear though, on the bearings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieP Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Nowhere near 800 hp, im using a 6765 so dont think that will even make 800 horses, but was planning to get the car mapped on high boost at around 1.5bar aiming for 600-650hp, which is hopefully realistic. what was the part that failed on your stock engine jamie? My red single failed at 612bhp and 50,000 on a stock engine, started to breath very heavy, rings looked to fail, black one bent a rod a 730bhp and also about 50,000 miles, black one was fine at 600bhp for a long time, soon as i put it up to 730bhp it failed within a couple of thousand miles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey. Posted February 13, 2011 Author Share Posted February 13, 2011 My red single failed at 612bhp and 50,000 on a stock engine, started to breath very heavy, rings looked to fail, black one bent a rod a 730bhp and also about 50,000 miles, black one was fine at 600bhp for a long time, soon as i put it up to 730bhp it failed within a couple of thousand miles. see my thoughts were rod bolts were the weak point, and the bearings do wear so it would be a good idea to change these, along with oew piston rings. quite rare to get a stock rod fail though isnt it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieP Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 see my thoughts were rod bolts were the weak point, and the bearings do wear so it would be a good idea to change these, along with oew piston rings. quite rare to get a stock rod fail though isnt it? It happens, just not many people push them so far, vase had a stock rod come out the side of his block iirc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky49 Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 My red single failed at 612bhp and 50,000 on a stock engine, started to breath very heavy, rings looked to fail, black one bent a rod a 730bhp and also about 50,000 miles, black one was fine at 600bhp for a long time, soon as i put it up to 730bhp it failed within a couple of thousand miles. You do drive them like an animal though mate ( as they are intended ). I made 750+hp but I turn the boost setting down as I dont want to blow it up. I will be building an engine this year from one of my spare engines but I know if anything happens I can drop this current engine back in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey. Posted February 13, 2011 Author Share Posted February 13, 2011 I made 750+hp but I turn the boost setting down as I dont want to blow it up. I will be building an engine this year from one of my spare engines but I know if anything happens I can drop this current engine back in. Thats an ideal way of doing it mate, what kind of labour costs are involved in building a block? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagman Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Before you even get to bearings and rings - that engine needs to be cleaner than a clean thing on cleaning month by a guy with OCD for cleaning ! Send for hot tank clean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky49 Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 I dont know mate Jamie has had a couple built so could answer this better. Just drop Lee a pm im sure he could give you an idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey. Posted February 13, 2011 Author Share Posted February 13, 2011 I dont know mate Jamie has had a couple built so could answer this better. Just drop Lee a pm im sure he could give you an idea. i may just do that, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Whiffin Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 If your not going more than 650bhp then keep it stock. ARP studs will help for sure. But if you have leakdown problems, while it's apart it's probably worth getting a hone and new set of rings, you don't want to put it all back in to find out it's still got leakby? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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