Scott Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Really...you won't be watching because they said something about Mexicans? Touchy much? I'm ginger, and laughed my head off at Frankie Boyle mocking ginger people for 10 minutes, some of his best stand-up. I honestly don't think Clarkson, Hammond and May attend anti-Mexican rallies and such. I think they were having a joke and people got upset and complained...as people do with everything these days. Lighten up would be my advice...you'll give yourself a heart attack! Bingo. You may have a prize from the top shelf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbourner Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Would be interesting to see the viewer count from Sunday compared to the previous week(s). Well Mexians will all be asleep and Irish will apparently all be too pissed, so they're out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Well Mexians will all be asleep and Irish will apparently all be too pissed, so they're out. They may have drunkenly fell asleep in front of the TV though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbourner Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 They may have drunkenly fell asleep in front of the TV though True! Seriously, I wouldn't be surprised if figures went up, due to the 'outraged' people tuning in to find more things to be outraged about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackie Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 True! Seriously, I wouldn't be surprised if figures went up, due to the 'outraged' people tuning in to find more things to be outraged about. Possibly like when Orange used to send out stick figure jokes in texts (Like boobies or bumming stickmen) and everyone used to pass them round making Orange loads of money, Maybe it was one of the Topgear staff to be first to be "outraged" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_jekyll Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 it is all nonsence , it wont be long before the world is like that film with christian bale where emotions and opinions are punishable by death. i cant spell the name of the film but you know the one i mean , its on itv2 every other week. and sterio types will allways be around about people fromn different places but they are not true ..... "(barrr..quiet flossy, ill be back now )" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil_Nuts Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I'm not racist, I hate everyone....so screw you guys I'm watching Top Gear...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedrosixfour Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 They may have drunkenly fell asleep in front of the TV though More often the case than not its usually at a red light or stop sign we nod off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Septic Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 it is all nonsence , it wont be long before the world is like that film with christian bale where emotions and opinions are punishable by death. i cant spell the name of the film but you know the one i mean , its on itv2 every other week. and sterio types will allways be around about people fromn different places but they are not true ..... "(barrr..quiet flossy, ill be back now )" Equilibrium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edinlexusV8 Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I think sometimes people here really dont understand the point and then comment. So I decided to put this up from the guardian. Not even a single point mentioned by Steve Coogan is invalid or not related. From reading through the posts I can see that some of you guys are comparing your experiences of stereotyping of Brits in Mexico or elsewhere to be the same as guys on BBC/Topgear do. BBC is an organisation and they represent British media and British values outside of the boundary. Forget about political correctness, what about ethical values for people representing BBC and the nonsense they speak? As much as I like Top gear and the presenters I find their ethical values to be damn low. Looks like they are getting old and grumpy! Dont come in here and say to me that we cannot have a great Topgear show on BBC with out all of this nonsense. Top Gear's offensive stereotyping has gone too far, says Steve Coogan Comedy can't always be safe, and sometimes entertainers need to challenge social orthodoxies. But 'saying the unsayable' is different from simply recycling offensive cliches about Mexicans Comments (874) Steve Coogan guardian.co.uk, Saturday 5 February 2011 21.30 GMT Article history Steve Coogan: 'Forget the World Service; overseas, Top Gear is more frequently the public face of the BBC.' Photograph: Rex Features As a huge fan of Top Gear. I normally regard the presenters' brand of irreverence as a part of the rough and tumble that goes with having a sense of humour. I've been on the show three times and had a go at their celebrity-lap challenge, and I would love to receive a fourth invite. But I think that's unlikely once they have read this. If, however, it makes the Lads question their behaviour for a second – ambitious, I know – it will be worth it. I normally remain below the parapet when these frenetic arguments about comedy and taste break out. But this time, I've had enough of the regular defence you tend to hear – the tired line that it's "just a laugh", a bit of "harmless fun". Some of the Lads' comments again, in case you missed them. "Mexican cars are just going to be lazy, feckless, flatulent, overweight, leaning against a fence asleep looking at a cactus, with a blanket with a hole in the middle on as a coat" (Richard Hammond). Mexican food is "sick with cheese on it" (James May). Jeremy Clarkson added to the mirth by suggesting that the Mexican ambassador (a certain Eduardo Medina-Mora Icaza) would be so busy sleeping he wouldn't register any outrage. (He wasn't and he did.) OK, guys, I've got some great ideas for your next show. Jeremy, why not have James describe some kosher food as looking like "sick with cheese on it"? No? Thought not. Even better, why not describe some Islamic fundamentalists as lazy and feckless? Feel the silence. They're all pretty well organised these days, aren't they, those groups? Better stick to those that are least problematic. Old people? Special needs? I know – Mexicans! There aren't enough of them to be troublesome, no celebrities to be upset. And most of them are miles and miles away. The BBC's initial mealy-mouthed apology was pitiful. It cited the more benign rivalry that exists between European nations (ah, those arrogant French, over-organised Germans), and in doing so neatly sidestepped one hugely important fact – ethnicity. All the examples it uses to legitimise this hateful rubbish are relatively prosperous countries full of white people. How about if the Lads had described Africans as lazy, feckless etc? Or Pakistanis? What's more, this was all spouted by the presenters on one of the BBC's most successful programmes, with ratings that could only fail to impress Simon Cowell (very fast lap time). Forget the World Service; overseas, Top Gear is more frequently the public face of the BBC. The Beeb's hand-wringing suggested tolerance of casual racism, arguably the most sinister kind. It's easy to spot the ones with the burning crosses. Besides, there is not a shred of truth in Top Gear's "comic" stereotype. I can tell you from my own experience, living in the US, Mexicans work themselves to the bone doing all the dirty thankless jobs that the white middle-class natives won't do. What makes it worse is that the Lads wear this offensive behaviour as a badge of pride, pleased that they have annoyed those whom they regard, in another lazy stereotype, as sandal-wearing vegans with beards and no sense of humour. Well here's some Twitter hot news: I don't have a beard, I'm not a vegan, I don't wear sandals (unless they're Birkenstocks, of course), and I have, I think, a sense of humour. I also know something about comedy. It's true there are no hard fast rules; it's often down to judgment calls. It's safe to say, though, that you can get away with saying unsayable things if it's done with some sense of culpability. I've been fortunate enough to work with the likes of Peter Baynham, Armando Iannucci, Chris Morris, Simon Pegg, Julia Davis, Caroline Aherne, Ruth Jones, and the Mighty Boosh – some of the funniest and most innovative people in British comedy. And Rob Brydon too. It's a diverse, eclectic group of people with one common denominator: they could all defend and justify their comedy from a moral standpoint. They are laughing at hypocrisy, human frailty, narrow-mindedness. They mock pomposity and arrogance. If I say anything remotely racist or sexist as Alan Partridge, for example, the joke is abundantly clear. We are laughing at a lack of judgment and ignorance. With Top Gear it is three rich, middle-aged men laughing at poor Mexicans. Brave, groundbreaking stuff, eh? There is a strong ethical dimension to the best comedy. Not only does it avoid reinforcing prejudices, it actively challenges them. Put simply, in comedy, as in life, we ought to think before we speak. This wasn't one of those occasions. In fact, the comments were about as funny as a cold sweat followed by shooting pains down the left arm. In fact, if I can borrow from the Wildean wit of Richard Hammond, the comic approach was "lazy", "feckless" and "flatulent". Richard has his tongue so far down the back of Jeremy's trousers he could forge a career as the back end of a pantomime horse. His attempt to foster some Clarkson-like maverick status with his "edgy" humour is truly tragic. He reminds you of the squirt at school as he hangs round Clarkson the bully, as if to say, "I'm with him". Meanwhile, James May stands at the back holding their coats as they beat up the boy with the stutter. It's not entirely their fault, of course. Part of the blame must lie with what some like to call the "postmodern" reaction to overzealous political correctness. Sometimes, it's true, things need a shakeup; orthodoxies need to be challenged. But this sort of ironic approach has been a licence for any halfwit to vent the prejudices they'd been keeping in the closet since Love Thy Neighbour was taken off the air. Also, a factor little picked up on elsewhere in the Lads' remarks is that they do, after all, present a car show. And archaic attitudes are endemic in a lot of motoring journalism. I confess I am an avid consumer and I have to wade through a sea of lazy cliches to get to anything genuinely illuminating. Jeremy unwittingly cast the template for this. Twenty years ago, when I bought Performance Car magazine, his column was the first I would turn to. It was slightly annoying but unfailingly funny. Since then there have been legions of pretenders who just don't pass muster. There is a kneejerk, brainless reaction to any legislation that may have a detrimental effect on their God-given right to drive cars anywhere at any speed that they consider safe. They often remind me of the National Rifle Association in the US who, I'm sure we can all agree, are a bunch of nutters. It's a kind of "airbags are for poofs" mentality and, far from being shocking, it's just shockingly dull. It would be fine if it was confined to a bunch of grumpy men in bad jeans smoking Marlboros at the side of the Millbrook test track, but it's not. As I pointed out, it's the voice of one of the BBC's most successful programmes. The Lads have this strange notion that if they are being offensive it bestows on them a kind of anti-establishment aura of coolness; in fact, like their leather jackets and jeans, it is uber-conservative (which isn't cool). Gentlemen, I don't believe in half-criticisms and this has nothing to do with my slow lap times. But, increasingly, you each look like a middle-aged punk rocker pogoing at his niece's wedding. That would be funny if you weren't regarded by some people as role models. Big viewing figures don't give you impunity – they carry responsibility. Start showing some, tuck your shirts in, be a bit funnier and we'll pretend it all never happened. WHAT THEY SAID The comments came during a discussion about a Mexican-built sports car: Hammond (left): …Cars reflect national characteristics, don't they, so German cars are very well built and ruthlessly efficient, Italian cars are a bit flamboyant and quick, a Mexican car's just going to be lazy, feckless, flatulent, overweight... (laughter) leaning against a fence asleep, looking at a cactus, with a blanket with a hole in the middle as a coat. May: It is interesting, isn't it, because they can't do food, the Mexicans, can they? Because it's all like sick with cheese on it, I mean... (laughter) Hammond: Refried sick! May: Yeah, refried sick. Hammond: I'm sorry, but just imagine waking up and remembering you're Mexican: 'awww, no'. (laughter) Clarkson: No, it'd be brilliant… because you could just go straight back to sleep again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_jekyll Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Equilibrium thats him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted February 8, 2011 Author Share Posted February 8, 2011 I think sometimes people here really dont understand the point and then comment. So I decided to put this up from the guardian. Not even a single point mentioned by Steve Coogan is invalid or not related. From reading through the posts I can see that some of you guys are comparing your experiences of stereotyping of Brits in Mexico or elsewhere to be the same as guys on BBC/Topgear do. BBC is an organisation and they represent British media and British values outside of the boundary. Forget about political correctness, what about ethical values for people representing BBC and the nonsense they speak? As much as I like Top gear and the presenters I find their ethical values to be damn low. Looks like they are getting old and grumpy! Dont come in here and say to me that we cannot have a great Topgear show on BBC with out all of this nonsense. I posted that Coogan piece as a link in my first post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edinlexusV8 Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I posted that Coogan piece as a link in my first post. I know you did but some may not click on the link and read through it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I'm outraged at this thread, I'm not going to watch it next week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Septic Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I know you did but some may not click on the link and read through it. Yeah actually I didn't. Great read though and many valid points. Do you reckon an apology from the guys will be forthcoming or am I being too naive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlotte Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I know you did but some may not click on the link and read through it. That's why I mentioned it in my post - I don't think anyone actually saw it by what people have said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tannhauser Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Really...you won't be watching because they said something about Mexicans? Touchy much? I'm ginger, and laughed my head off at Frankie Boyle mocking ginger people for 10 minutes, some of his best stand-up. I think there's a big difference though, isn't there? Thought experiment: what if, as a result of being ginger, your parents and grandparents had been beaten, murdered and tortured and no one did a blind thing to help them? Perhaps they had been enslaved, treated like cattle, or subhumans. Maybe as a result of being ginger, you couldn't get a working wage, you were pretty much confined to poverty, and your kids were likely to be too. Your life expectancy would be lower than non-gingers. There would have been a long history of ginger routines, in which gingers were portrayed as - maybe - lazy or stupid figures of fun, and the authors of all their own problems. Meanwhile, all around you, gingers were working themselves to death. In the past, humour has been used as a way for avoiding seeing that there is actually any problem, a way of defusing it. In this scenario, if you laugh at the ginger jokes and grit your teeth and maybe make a few ginger jokes yourself, people will call you a good sport. Maybe you can make some jokes about non-gingers, then everyone can pretend you're 'giving as good as you get'. The non-gingers would use their humour as a justification for business as usual. Can you honestly say that with that history, you would still think his anti-ginger routine was funny? That's the difference. Now, I'm NOT saying that this is the experience of Mexicans - though parts of it are probably true. But in general divisions based on national or ethnic stereotypes have historically been a way in which one group behaves abominably to another group. That's why a lot of people don't want to hear them used so flippantly as they used to. I honestly don't think Clarkson, Hammond and May attend anti-Mexican rallies and such. I think they were having a joke and people got upset and complained...as people do with everything these days. I'm sure you're right, they wouldn't. And as Scott says, it's deliberate lowest-common-denominator material. It's a lazy and somewhat desperate way of stirring up controversy for a flagging show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted February 8, 2011 Author Share Posted February 8, 2011 I guess most people didn't read it because they were too busy being offended at having their right to be racist eroded by *yawn* 'political correctness gone mad'. Stewart Lee also does a brilliant routine about that too but most of the brilliant minds on here would probably fail to understand it. Just joking of course. Y'know, in a Top Gear way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted February 8, 2011 Author Share Posted February 8, 2011 As for Frankie Boyle. WTF is up with him these days? He used to be actually funny. Now though he just seems increasingly bitter and angry but without any way of dealing with it bar for some incredibly crass and unfunny one-liners. Is he actually so far beyond caring about his career that he is being deliberatly offensive or is he really just being very, very ironic. In fact, so ironic that, without any balance, he just seems like a modern Bernard Manning. FFS he writes for The Sun these days. From memory I believe he used to be far left politically. It'd be very sad if it wasn't for him being a ginger. So, f**k him. (Just joking of course. Y'know, in a Top Gear way.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackie Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I guess most people didn't read it because they were too busy being offended at having their right to be racist eroded by *yawn* 'political correctness gone mad'. Stewart Lee also does a brilliant routine about that too but most of the brilliant minds on here would probably fail to understand it. Just joking of course. Y'know, in a Top Gear way. Stewart lee used to be quite funny when he was with Rob herring, Went off him abit with his solo stuff tbh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted February 8, 2011 Author Share Posted February 8, 2011 Stewart lee used to be quite funny when he was with Rob herring, Went off him abit with his solo stuff tbh Richard Herring? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Stewart lee used to be quite funny when he was with Rob herring, Went off him abit with his solo stuff tbh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted February 8, 2011 Author Share Posted February 8, 2011 Naturally I disagree. Mind you I find the likes of Lee Evans and similar so unfunny that I'd rather see them melted down and turned into soap. Just joking, of course. You know, in a Top Gear way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackie Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Richard Herring? Yep thats who i ment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Naturally I disagree. Mind you I find the likes of Lee Evans and similar so unfunny that I'd rather see them melted down and turned into soap. Just joking, of course. You know, in a Top Gear way. I'm outraged I'm agreeing with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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