PC upgrade advice

[CJ]

I am pretty clueless when it comes to the inside parts of a PC and so once again, if you treat me as an idiot, I probably wont disappoint!

 

I have used CPU-Z to show what bits I have already got in my machine and have saved the info here. The performance I get is OK at the minute but I was wondering if an increase in RAM to 4gb would see major benefits?

 

I mainly use the PC for basic work but rarely (if ever) for gaming but that is more down to thinking that the graphic bits already installed wont be up to the task.

 

What thinks you chaps and chapesses?

[creative]

if you bung in another 2 gig you will need to run X64 OS system to read it all

[CJ]

if you bung in another 2 gig you will need to run X64 OS system to read it all

 

Mmm...that sounds like probably more hassle than it is worth. I guess it would mean un-installing Win 7 and reinstalling the 64 bit version? Or am I barking up the wrong tree?

[Scott]

One of the best performance upgrades you could do would be to re-format your PC.

 

Depending on what you use the PC for another 2GB probably won't make any difference to the performance but for the price of it it can't hurt. I would recommend getting another 2GB of ram and a copy of windows 7 x64. Backup all your stuff and wipe the PC, starting from scratch. If you want to see a REAL performance gain you could get a new 1tb Samsung spinpoint F1. The performance per £ is staggering to me.

 

Oh, the F3 isn't as fast so stick with the F1.

[Matt H]

Doubleing your RAM is a cheap way to get more out of your PC. It will help things load faster. I've done it with mine over the years. Started with 256mb, then went to 512 and now have the max my motherboard will support, which is 2gb. The performance increase each time has been noticable and worth the money.

 

I have basic knowledge too and found this site brilliant. It's guides are good:

 

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/427

 

Other things I've done are:

 

1) replace my CPU with the fastest my motherboard could take - another simple task and again cheap for a second hand one.

 

2) Install a graphics card to remove the demand on the RAM for graphics and obviously allows me to run things at a higher quality.

 

3) overclock the CPU slightly (that's free) and also easy to do from the bios.

 

Like Scotty says, a format will help if you've had the computer for a while and its had all sorts on it.

[stevie_b]

Mmm...that sounds like probably more hassle than it is worth. I guess it would mean un-installing Win 7 and reinstalling the 64 bit version? Or am I barking up the wrong tree?

 

Correct. I'm not sure if you'd need a 64-bit CPU to make the best use of a 64-bit OS. I haven't googled your CPU to see if it is 64-bit or not.

 

FYI, 3.5GB is about the most RAM you can make use of with a 32-bit OS.

 

I reckon you have 3 choices:

1) reformat the HDD as Scott suggests and do a clean re-install of your 32-bit OS. This would speed things up a bit...

2) ... and buy perhaps another 1GB of RAM to take you to 3GB.

3) ... or go the 64-bit route. Reformat HDD, install 64-bit OS. Make sure you can get 64-bit drivers for your on-board functions graphics, sound, etc etc) though. I've got no experience of this so not sure if it "just works" by letting Win7-64 find stuff or whether it can be problematic.

[imi]

I am pretty clueless when it comes to the inside parts of a PC and so once again, if you treat me as an idiot, I probably wont disappoint!

 

I have used CPU-Z to show what bits I have already got in my machine and have saved the info here. The performance I get is OK at the minute but I was wondering if an increase in RAM to 4gb would see major benefits?

 

I mainly use the PC for basic work but rarely (if ever) for gaming but that is more down to thinking that the graphic bits already installed wont be up to the task.

 

What thinks you chaps and chapesses?

 

looking at the high level specs of your machine it seems like you have quite a powerful setup for "basic work" use; i'd go with Scott's suggestion and setup windows from scratch (being a crappy OS it tends to get bloated after a while).

 

Best to use Win 7 as it is well worth it to.

 

upgrading to 4GB will make a difference too.

[Morpheus]

Maybe chuck an OCZ Vertex 2 Solid State Drive in it as a boot drive?

 

You could overclock that cpu to atleast 4GHz depending on motherboard spec's but if you want a cheap and easy speed increase without doing any harm, it's a doddle to get it to say, 3GHz. Probably won't even exceed a vcore of 1.2v.

 

;-)

[CJ]

Plenty to ponder on here. Thank you one and all for your comments and advice.

[Thorin]

Upgrading to 4GB will definitely see an improvement.

[Scott]

Upgrading to 4GB will definitely see an improvement.

 

 

What is leading all you guys to this assumption? For a start he is using a 32bit operating system so it won't make good use of all the memory anyway. If he isn't using memory intensive programs then he will never breach into the >2gb memory use making it absolutely pointless.

 

On my previous laptop the only time I noticed the additional memory making any difference was when using a video editing program (I don't really use anything memory intensive either, for gaming or the like).

 

Memory increases rarely help, obviously other than when you don't have enough memory for your needs. Speed increases generally come from faster processor, faster harddrive, faster operating system, faster memory.

[Matt H]

What is leading all you guys to this assumption?

 

Because even vista recommends 4GB of ram for best use. For the price of RAM, why wouldn't we recommend it?

[imi]

What is leading all you guys to this assumption? For a start he is using a 32bit operating system so it won't make good use of all the memory anyway. If he isn't using memory intensive programs then he will never breach into the >2gb memory use making it absolutely pointless.

 

On my previous laptop the only time I noticed the additional memory making any difference was when using a video editing program (I don't really use anything memory intensive either, for gaming or the like).

 

Memory increases rarely help, obviously other than when you don't have enough memory for your needs. Speed increases generally come from faster processor, faster harddrive, faster operating system, faster memory.

 

Agree - however Windows has a habbit of gobbling up as much memory as it can get - so normally chucking more memory (which is a cheap solution) does help run the OS better (as long as it can address the extra memory - referencing steve's earlier post).

 

you are right though - changing to a SSD HD transformed my MAC; much more than any processor or memory chip could do

[Thorin]

What is leading all you guys to this assumption?

 

Because you don't properly understand memory usage and limits of 32-bit Windows.

[Scott]

Because even vista recommends 4GB of ram for best use. For the price of RAM, why wouldn't we recommend it?

 

Ahh, Vista.... there's the problem right there

 

Agree - however Windows has a habbit of gobbling up as much memory as it can get - so normally chucking more memory (which is a cheap solution) does help run the OS better (as long as it can address the extra memory - referencing steve's earlier post).

 

you are right though - changing to a SSD HD transformed my MAC; much more than any processor or memory chip could do

 

4gb though? That's just insane for browsing, burning DVD/CDs and the normal everyday activities. Modern OS will gobble 1gb without even thinking about it so I would always recommend a minimum of 2gb. IMO 4gb will make absolutely no speed increase for CJ's use.

 

Because you don't properly understand memory usage and limits of 32-bit Windows.

 

Yeah... that's what it is

[imi]

 

4gb though? That's just insane for browsing, burning DVD/CDs and the normal everyday activities. Modern OS will gobble 1gb without even thinking about it so I would always recommend a minimum of 2gb. IMO 4gb will make absolutely no speed increase for CJ's use.

 

fair point - he is better off setting up win7 again - i'd even stick with 32bit unless he is absolutely sure that all the drivers for 64bit are available.

[Thorin]

Yeah... that's what it is

 

32-bit Windows (excluding Enterprise and Data Centre server editions) cannot map more than 4GB of memory. That 4GB is split into 2GB of user-mode memory for running applications, and 2GB for kernel-mode usage. Of the kernel-mode memory ~500MB will be taken up be device memory mapping which is why you'll usually see a maximum of 3.5-3.6GB of available memory.

 

Increasing the amount of memory from 2GB to 4GB will see an improvement.

[Scott]

32-bit Windows (excluding Enterprise and Data Centre server editions) cannot map more than 4GB of memory. That 4GB is split into 2GB of user-mode memory for running applications, and 2GB for kernel-mode usage. Of the kernel-mode memory ~500MB will be taken up be device memory mapping which is why you'll usually see a maximum of 3.5-3.6GB of available memory.

 

Increasing the amount of memory from 2GB to 4GB will see an improvement.

 

And I suppose if he increased the Ram to 8GB (On a 64bit system) he would see a further increase?

 

When gaming or using a memory intensive program I would agree, in this instance there will be absolutely NO benefit whatsoever. His system won't be any faster as the limit of his system with his use is not memory.

 

Nice google BTW. My point still stands.

[Matt H]

kernel

 

?

 

http://jonpedersen.com/files/3712/6230/1985/colonel-sanders.jpg

[ozz]

Its been a while since I messed with hardware but i think also the graphics card memory also needs to be taken into account as part of the memory limit. I'd still say though bang for buck upgrading the RAM to 4 gig will help, its not just about single applications, its the number you have running at one time. Now if we're talking upgrading to 3gig or 4gig then the performance increase would likely be the same, but we weren't lol and I'd stick with matching whereever possible, so 2x2gig speed matched memory.

[Thorin]

And I suppose if he increased the Ram to 8GB (On a 64bit system) he would see a further increase?

 

For CJ's use, almost certainly no. But then I don't know what else he may use the PC for.

 

When gaming or using a memory intensive program I would agree, in this instance there will be absolutely NO benefit whatsoever. His system won't be any faster as the limit of his system with his use is not memory.

 

Nice google BTW. My point still stands.

 

Your point is flawed imbecile, this is my job, I deal with this sort of thing every day.

 

I could have gone into the various 4GT tuning options (PAE, /3GB) to allow the machine to address more than 4GB of address space, or to increase the amount of memory available to user-mode applications to 3GB. However, we're already way over your head and your little brain may melt.

[imi]

I am assuming CJ got the advice that he was looking for ...

 

iBTL

[Scott]

For CJ's use, almost certainly no. But then I don't know what else he may use the PC for.

 

 

 

Your point is flawed imbecile, this is my job, I deal with this sort of thing every day.

 

I could have gone into the various 4GT tuning options (PAE, /3GB) to allow the machine to address more than 4GB of address space, or to increase the amount of memory available to user-mode applications to 3GB. However, we're already way over your head and your little brain may melt.

 

That wouldn't be anything to do with the issue at hand though.

 

CJ wants to speed his PC up for day to day use. IMO he doesn't use the 2GB he has at the moment so upping that to 4GB will make no difference.

 

If you aren't using the 2GB available to you, how will 4GB speed up the system?

 

I'm honestly curious about this now as I can't see how it will make any difference.

 

I think CJ would see far greater gains getting faster memory rather than more memory (If his RAM speed isn't already maxed out)

[Abz]

fair point - he is better off setting up win7 again - i'd even stick with 32bit unless he is absolutely sure that all the drivers for 64bit are available.

This is a very crucial point, upgrading to an 64 bit system doesn't mean all drivers and applications will work.

 

I am currently migrating all our physical servers to a Virtual Environment and to keep up to date have been building mainly Windows 2008 Servers (64 bit), these have at times been a pain with software which were only tested on 32 bit or designed for it. Heavy applications etc were fine but simple problems and some of the network tools seemed to be quite an issue, so some we reverted back to 2003 32 bit.

 

So to answer your question CJ, to which you already have some good advice here, rebuild the OS, get a better HD and quicker access memory.

If you can budget, then upgrading the processor will be very healthy too.

[Thorin]

IMO he doesn't use the 2GB he has at the moment so upping that to 4GB will make no difference.

 

He's running Windows 7 and you don't think he'll be using all of that 2GB?