Firemen to go on strike....Bonfire night

[Ian C]

Cheers.

 

I mean the Asset Co service, they are called the Emergancy Fire Crew Capability Service. They are also the scabs. As far as I know there were only 1 or 2 FF's that worked.

 

A FF in London gets 4 months full time training before they leave training school. then 4 years on the job training before they get taken off probation.

 

The clowns got 2 weeks 3 months ago and then 2 days just before the strike.

 

My god, they've offshored the fire service I made a joke at work about this recently (we had offshored infrastructure support, i.e. the people who go ON SITE and fix servers) and now to my horror it appears to be true.

 

I fully support your endeavours and I despise weasel politicians who screw everyone for their own personal gain - which is the ONLY reason any of them are in power. Maybe their house will catch fire during the strikes

[Andy-No-Knee]

Thought you may find this link funny.

 

Please bear in mind the previous posts from me.

 

If you would like any more clarification especialy after reading this just let me know....

 

Oh and by the way I would just LOVE to earn £50k.

 

As I said I am an officer, I earn £31,263 before London Weighting, which again is lower than the figure in the artical. Mine is £5,021. I then pay 11% of my earnings into my 'goldplated pention'. Of course I dont have to...but I would be mad not to. And I have been in 10 years.

 

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1324378/Firemen-striking-Bonfire-Night-want-10k-pay-rise-time-off.html

[Thorin]

Thought you may find this link funny.

 

Please bear in mind the previous posts from me.

 

If you would like any more clarification especialy after reading this just let me know....

 

Oh and by the way I would just LOVE to earn £50k.

 

As I said I am an officer, I earn £31,263 before London Weighting, which again is lower than the figure in the artical. Mine is £5,021. I then pay 11% of my earnings into my 'goldplated pention'. Of course I dont have to...but I would be mad not to. And I have been in 10 years.

 

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1324378/Firemen-striking-Bonfire-Night-want-10k-pay-rise-time-off.html

 

To be fair it says you "can earn up to £50k after overtime". No doubt some are paid more than you to start with I'm guessing, plus a boat load of overtime and there you go?

 

Whichever way you look at it, even £36k-37k a year is a decent salary.

[Gaz6002]

Whichever way you look at it, even £36k-37k a year is a decent salary.

 

The man has a good point.

[Havard]

I'm appalled that they will be on strike that night. As a human I have human rights and with no sense of self-discipline or restraint, this is the one night of the year I like to a*** about with petrol, bonfires and cheap chinese fireworks.

Surely its my basic human right to be rescued when I set fire to myself, my property or anything else in range due to my own idiocy.

 

Have you considered growing up Rob....

[Andy-No-Knee]

The man has a good point.

 

A very good point. I am not complaining about my currant pay levels though, and that isnt what the strike is about either.

 

I only raised it to show how accurate the DM was in its reporting.

 

The only way a FF can earn £50k inc over time is if they are not a FF but a senior officer, and the Brigade makes them leave the union to get the rank.

[Pete]

Don't worry, it's only in London.

[Abz]

A very good point. I am not complaining about my currant pay levels though, and that isnt what the strike is about either.

 

I only raised it to show how accurate the DM was in its reporting.

 

The only way a FF can earn £50k inc over time is if they are not a FF but a senior officer, and the Brigade makes them leave the union to get the rank.

 

Please still read the Daily Mail?

[jagman]

"Whichever way you look at it, even £36k-37k a year is a decent salary."

 

looking at it from a mortgage point of view - you are unmortgageable for any property in London ?

[Thorin]

"Whichever way you look at it, even £36k-37k a year is a decent salary."

 

looking at it from a mortgage point of view - you are unmortgageable for any property in London ?

 

Same anywhere else in the country.

 

I saw something on the TV last week where a couple had a combined income of over £60k, plus 15% deposit towards their house... and STILL couldn't get a mortgage.

[jagman]

Same anywhere else in the country.

 

I saw something on the TV last week where a couple had a combined income of over £60k, plus 15% deposit towards their house... and STILL couldn't get a mortgage.

 

Slightly higher costs in Londinium methinks!

They cant choose to live elsewhere , and rentals are also high priced , so subsidised housing ? -the very thing the government wants to cut ?

we are entering an era of strikes , and I suspect the final nail in the Unions coffin - this saddens me given the huge efforts by my parents and grandparents to give the working man the right to withdraw labour, without going to the poorhouse .

many it seems have no knowledge of what existed beforehand are suggesting removing the right or using negotiation -get real !!

Its become illegal to strike in many cases now , and I guess many people have not seen the state of modern contracts of employment ,almost victorian and certainly draconian , a trend to part time jobs with little or no protection at all .

If working people do not support working people ,then we are truly lost .....You will reap the whirlwind

Tory supporters are now joining the unions apace , given the public sector cuts , as they now face the chop ..oh the irony !!

[Tannhauser]

we are entering an era of strikes , and I suspect the final nail in the Unions coffin - this saddens me given the huge efforts by my parents and grandparents to give the working man the right to withdraw labour, without going to the poorhouse .

many it seems have no knowledge of what existed beforehand are suggesting removing the right or using negotiation -get real !!

Its become illegal to strike in many cases now , and I guess many people have not seen the state of modern contracts of employment ,almost victorian and certainly draconian , a trend to part time jobs with little or no protection at all .

 

I think that's an excellent post. I think the comment about 'no knowledge of what went before' is very true for most.

 

In every business, there's a fundamental tension. The employer needs to keep costs down to increase profit, and protection of his workers is rarely in his interests. Things were so simple for employers in days gone by, because they could dictate whatever terms they wanted, and the power structure meant that there was little that workers could do. The rise of mass action and laws to protect employees changed that and presented employers with a problem of how to reassert themselves. Globalisation has been the answer to their prayers. Now they can get around inconvenient labour laws by outsourcing. Whenever a country gets too uppity and workers start demanding - for example - a subsistence wage in some places, they up-sticks and move to somewhere else.

 

Back to the UK. Times of apparent crisis are a gift for any government who wants to erode hard-won rights. Threats of terror are used to justify, for example, detention without trial. The notion that 'we all need to make sacrifices' and 'we're all in this together' creates this sense of a nation under siege. That's a very effective propaganda tool against those taking industrial action, because it effectively casts them in the role of traitors.

[RedM]

Slightly higher costs in Londinium methinks!

They cant choose to live elsewhere , and rentals are also high priced , so subsidised housing ? -the very thing the government wants to cut ?

we are entering an era of strikes , and I suspect the final nail in the Unions coffin - this saddens me given the huge efforts by my parents and grandparents to give the working man the right to withdraw labour, without going to the poorhouse .

many it seems have no knowledge of what existed beforehand are suggesting removing the right or using negotiation -get real !!

Its become illegal to strike in many cases now , and I guess many people have not seen the state of modern contracts of employment ,almost victorian and certainly draconian , a trend to part time jobs with little or no protection at all .

If working people do not support working people ,then we are truly lost .....You will reap the whirlwind

Tory supporters are now joining the unions apace , given the public sector cuts , as they now face the chop ..oh the irony !!

 

 

I think that's an excellent post. I think the comment about 'no knowledge of what went before' is very true for most.

 

In every business, there's a fundamental tension. The employer needs to keep costs down to increase profit, and protection of his workers is rarely in his interests. Things were so simple for employers in days gone by, because they could dictate whatever terms they wanted, and the power structure meant that there was little that workers could do. The rise of mass action and laws to protect employees changed that and presented employers with a problem of how to reassert themselves. Globalisation has been the answer to their prayers. Now they can get around inconvenient labour laws by outsourcing. Whenever a country gets too uppity and workers start demanding - for example - a subsistence wage in some places, they up-sticks and move to somewhere else.

 

Back to the UK. Times of apparent crisis are a gift for any government who wants to erode hard-won rights. Threats of terror are used to justify, for example, detention without trial. The notion that 'we all need to make sacrifices' and 'we're all in this together' creates this sense of a nation under siege. That's a very effective propaganda tool against those taking industrial action, because it effectively casts them in the role of traitors.

 

Two really great posts. I have nothing to add. I merely wanted to show appreciation.

[Andy-No-Knee]

Two really great posts. I have nothing to add. I merely wanted to show appreciation.

 

 

 

 

Me too!!!

[Septic]

Two really great posts. I have nothing to add. I merely wanted to show appreciation.

 

Agreed.

[j_jza80]

I love all the anti Conservative banter on here Almost makes you forget that a significant amount of our current economic mess is largely down to the previous government, and that trade unions are partially responsible for the huge post war decline in our industries.

 

The notion that 'we all need to make sacrifices' and 'we're all in this together' creates this sense of a nation under siege.

 

It also creates a sense of unity.

 

I'm not really sure what people expect. Our country's up sh1t creek at the moment, and EVERYONE is going to have to make their contribution in some way.

[jagman]

I love all the anti Conservative banter on here Almost makes you forget that a significant amount of our current economic mess is largely down to the previous government, and that trade unions are partially responsible for the huge post war decline in our industries.

 

 

 

It also creates a sense of unity.

 

I'm not really sure what people expect. Our country's up sh1t creek at the moment, and EVERYONE is going to have to make their contribution in some way.

 

From the recent newspapers;

Britain's bosses have been accused of ignoring economic reality after boardroom pay leapt by 55% over the last year.

 

FTSE 100 directors saw their total earnings soar in the 12 months to June, thanks to sharp rises in bonuses and performance-related pay. The average FTSE 100 chief executive now earns £4.9m a year, or almost 200 times the average wage.

 

Unions reacted angrily to the report today. "Don't they know that this is meant to be austerity Britain?" said TUC general secretary Brendan Barber.

 

"These mega-pay rises blow away any claim that we are all in this together. While the poor and those on middle incomes lose out from cuts and pay squeezes, top directors continue to take home telephone number salaries without being overly troubled by tax," Barber added.

 

He called on shareholders and the government to get a tighter grip on executive pay, at a time when ordinary workers have seen their pay kept in check by the economic downturn.

 

Incomes Data Services said bonuses paid to directors of FTSE 100 companies increased by 34%, while basic pay rose by 3.6%. The amount of money waiting to be disgorged from long-term incentive schemes soared by 73%, to a total of £259m, and share option gains leapt by 90%.

 

The FTSE 100 rose by less than a fifth over the same period.

-------------------------------------------------------------

The Unity is simply flooding out !!

I could shoot down all your points ,but kindly suggest you read a bit more .

[j_jza80]

From the recent newspapers;

Britain's bosses have been accused of ignoring economic reality after boardroom pay leapt by 55% over the last year.

 

FTSE 100 directors saw their total earnings soar in the 12 months to June, thanks to sharp rises in bonuses and performance-related pay. The average FTSE 100 chief executive now earns £4.9m a year, or almost 200 times the average wage.

 

Unions reacted angrily to the report today. "Don't they know that this is meant to be austerity Britain?" said TUC general secretary Brendan Barber.

 

"These mega-pay rises blow away any claim that we are all in this together. While the poor and those on middle incomes lose out from cuts and pay squeezes, top directors continue to take home telephone number salaries without being overly troubled by tax," Barber added.

 

He called on shareholders and the government to get a tighter grip on executive pay, at a time when ordinary workers have seen their pay kept in check by the economic downturn.

 

Incomes Data Services said bonuses paid to directors of FTSE 100 companies increased by 34%, while basic pay rose by 3.6%. The amount of money waiting to be disgorged from long-term incentive schemes soared by 73%, to a total of £259m, and share option gains leapt by 90%.

 

The FTSE 100 rose by less than a fifth over the same period.

-------------------------------------------------------------

The Unity is simply flooding out !!

I could shoot down all your points ,but kindly suggest you read a bit more .

 

These same people (often) pay huge contributions in tax. Often circa 30-50% of their earnings, and run companies which also contribute massively to the British (and European) economies.

 

Their salaries may seem unfair to some, but they are also singularly highly experienced and/or qualified individuals.

 

If you have some grand scheme to make everything in the world fair though, i'm all ears

[Thorin]

Back to the UK. Times of apparent crisis are a gift for any government who wants to erode hard-won rights. Threats of terror are used to justify, for example, detention without trial. The notion that 'we all need to make sacrifices' and 'we're all in this together' creates this sense of a nation under siege. That's a very effective propaganda tool against those taking industrial action, because it effectively casts them in the role of traitors.

 

Spot on as usual sir.

[jagman]

Wasnt the head of HSBC totally unqualified in Banking?

These "singularly highly experienced and/or qualified individuals." caused the biggest collapse in economy since the beginning of time to the point of the whole system edging to the abyss.

For the last year they have been selling shares off at unprecedented rates , licking the bowl clean , before they do the runner -

All whilst the working man is left to take the pain , the very ones who in reality created the real wealth ,not paper and numbers ,smoke and mirrors - hows your pension doing ?

[supra_aero]

I also agree with some others that £36k/year is a fairly ok salary. Yes even in London.

 

House prices can no longer be used as a benchmark for what a good salary is anymore as they've gone well beyond the realms of reality for most hard working people.

[j_jza80]

it wouldn't suprise me fair play to someone who can get to such a position without any qualifications.

 

These same people have also seen us through some of the greatest financial prosperity the country has ever seen.

 

I would argue that much of the real wealth of our country left because of greedy employees and their unions many years ago. The only real wealth our country now has, which is something the current government is playing their fiddle to, is the ingenuity of our population. We still turn out world class professionals in many fields.

 

My pension is in excellent health by the way, far beyond the reaches of the chancellor, and safe from our economic problems.

[jagman]

"These same people have also seen us through some of the greatest financial prosperity the country has ever seen."

 

 

Smoke and mirrors ,financial prosperity is only paper

 

"I would argue that much of the real wealth of our country left because of greedy employees and their unions many years ago"

 

Then where is this wealth ? why is the distribution on the countries wealth by any measure used- jammed into the top 5% of the population ?

 

 

"the ingenuity of our population" has left them in the largest debts possible and reduced ability to make anything ,turning to the busted flush of finance and service . its not the ingenuity of the masses but the greed of the few

 

 

We still turn out world class professionals in many fields- so why do we outsource so much and continue to grow in outsourcing ? That would never have happened with union input

[j_jza80]

"These same people have also seen us through some of the greatest financial prosperity the country has ever seen."

 

 

Smoke and mirrors ,financial prosperity is only paper

 

This smoke, mirrors and paper seem to have kept the benefit scroungers well fed

 

"I would argue that much of the real wealth of our country left because of greedy employees and their unions many years ago"

 

Then where is this wealth ? why is the distribution on the countries wealth by any measure used- jammed into the top 5% of the population ?

 

If it's only paper, then why does it matter? The wealth I refer to was in our industries, which are all but gone now, due in part to union intervention.

 

"the ingenuity of our population" has left them in the largest debts possible and reduced ability to make anything ,turning to the busted flush of finance and service . its not the ingenuity of the masses but the greed of the few

 

We still produce among the best engineers in the world, our Forensic scientists ARE the best in the world, and are often used by other countries. We set the standard by which financial accounting is done in much of the world these days.

 

We still turn out world class professionals in many fields- so why do we outsource so much and continue to grow in outsourcing ? That would never have happened with union input

 

It doesn't happen (partly) because of union input in the past. we priced ourselves out of the (our) market.

Our country hasn't been capable of self sustenance for a long time (certainly since the baby boomers of the 1950s) due to over population.

[supra_aero]

jagman what profession are you in? Can't tell by your posts - lol.