Bodybuilders, MMA & food freaks (Advice needed)

[IDO]

Yes please that would be very helpfull.

 

 

 

Im used to rolling my shin lumps/bruises back down with a bottle, so your bottle freezing idea should work well, Im sure I have a big bottle of water somewhere.

 

Good conditioning is low kicks on a tyre (stand it upright, i used to have one mounted on a post, bit strange but works wonders, picked that tip up whilst training in thailand).. its hard so builds/harden the skin etc but has enough give not to damage to much..

 

I did Thai boxing for over 3 years but I got a bad injury and had to take a year off,..

ive lost weight during my injury and I went abit downhill eating, and not being able to train made me give up. Its actually 125lbs That I weigh

 

Wish that was the same problem i am having.. done Mauy thai for near 15 years now, was fighting at a good level, then got a injury had to take some time off, now back to training and teaching and cant get the weight off!

 

Good luck with your training...

[Supralad]

And I too am interested in your psychic powers that immediately told me I was wrong and assumed that I knew nothing about the matter!

 

My info does not come from the net, but valid books and FDA research. I simply added the links after a quick google search to give a quick broad view.

 

Very quickly:

1. Pasteurised milk fed to calves resulted in poor health and even death in infancy.

2. Fed as sole calcium supplement to humans results in poor bone density resulting from calcium deficiency.

3. Enzymes that are destroyed through the process result in the nutrients not being properly absorbed by the pancreas, even though they were present in tests on the pasteurised milk. As you should know, enzymes are the living organisms (good and bad) that are present in non-processed foods and an absolute necessity to get the best out of food. - Hence why raw fish is healthier than cooked, rare meat healthier than well done, and raw vegetables healthier than cooked!

 

The guy is here for opinions, you don't see me or anyone else commenting on other peoples advice telling them they are wrong! We are just giving our best advice so that Benyon can decide what works best for him.

 

Take a leaf out of your own book before you get your knickers in a twist!

 

 

 

A bit OTT mate. Benyon asked for advise on what to eat, not an essay on why not to drink milk....

 

 

 

 

@ Benyon - Eat 5 or 6 small meals a day rather than 3 huge meals which keeps your metabolism up and burning carbs throughout the day.

 

Each meal throughout the day wants to get less carbs and more protein.

 

An old diet example, which i used whilst training for my fights was:

 

Breakfast - Brand flakes (high in fibre to kick start your day)

Then have a blended shake of banana, proidge oats, milk, protein shake

2x Boiled eggs

 

10am - low fat youghurt - keeps your metabolism going.

 

12am Lunch no1. - Spelt flatbread wrap chicken breast crispy bacon avocado.

Spelt contains high levels of fibre to keep you feeling fuller for longer while its carbs will prevent a big unsulin spike which can lead to your body storing excess eneergy as fat. Chicken and bacon (best to be organic if possible) are high in protein to promote fullness again. Avocado is rich in manganese which helps maetabolise fat and regulate blood sugar levels.

 

2pm lunch no1. - same as above. only have 1 round with each lunch so you dont ever stuff urself, but you feel full.

 

4/5pm - if you want to snack, snack on unsalted organic nuts. few handfuls should keep you going untill dinner.

 

6/7/8pm - dinner. Small amount of carbs so like half a portion of rice, small portion of pasta etc, lots of veg (steamed veg is lovley) and meat!

 

Not sure of your goal so cant really help too much but hope it helps.

[ilicos]

A bit OTT mate. Benyon asked for advise on what to eat, not an essay on why not to drink milk....

 

 

 

.

 

This was for the benefit of Tanhauser mate. My initial post if you read my previous thread was a brief comment. Tanhauser came along and told me I'm wrong so before you say whats OTT read what he said to me mate

[Supe]

Geo,

 

fancy giving me some advice on my diet and training through PM?

[Geo]

Geo,

 

fancy giving me some advice on my diet and training through PM?

 

no worries bud, PM me with what your looking to do, goals wise??

 

cheers

[Tannhauser]

With apologies to Benyon. You can skip all this , Geo will sort you out I'm sure.

 

And I too am interested in your psychic powers that immediately told me I was wrong and assumed that I knew nothing about the matter!

 

My assumption was based on the following:

 

Keep your proteins seperate per sitting (i.e don't eat egg with chicken etc).

 

So immediately alarm bells are ringing.There are all manner of these food separation protocols, and none of them are based on anything substantial.

 

As for milk, stay away from it

 

Alarm bells ringing even more. Beginning to sound like a 'food-faddist'. No insult intended by this, but its just not part of mainstream science. For most people, there's no reason to avoid milk.

 

at the same time kills the enzimes that have the benefits.

 

Enzymes aren't alive, and at this stage I'm wondering if you know that.

 

Unless you can find certified 'raw' milk then it's not worth it.

 

This is such a sweeping statement that, yes, I'm not convinced about your knowledge base. You're advising a guy that's 9 stone and trying to put on weight to avoid a relatively cheap source of highly bioavailable macro- and micro-nutrients.

 

Buy a book called 'The Tao of Health, Sex and Longevity' by Daniel Reid;)

 

Oh dear.

 

My initial impressions are confirmed when you make the daft assertion that people live longer in the country due to drinking raw milk (or something along those lines). Obviously, there are zillions of other variables that could result in differences in life expectancy between urban and rural.

 

The guy is here for opinions, you don't see me or anyone else commenting on other peoples advice telling them they are wrong! We are just giving our best advice so that Benyon can decide what works best for him.

 

I'm also giving him an opinion. My opinion is that your advice is mistaken and that following it is pointless.

 

As for the bioavailability of calcium in raw vs pasteurised:

 

I understand that enzymes digest food. That's why we have a full complement of our own, in the gut. I don't necessarily disagree that the enzymes in food could help in its digestion (after all, bromelain from pineapple works well as a meat tenderiser), I just don't see why that would be necessary.

 

I'm surprised you cite the FDA website as supporting your position as when I looked on there the conclusion appeared to be that pasteurisation had negligible effects on all the major nutrients.

 

Also, in response to sugar, salt and calcium excretion in another post. Let's take salt: if you think this through, calcium excretion is going to be related to total salt intake. It doesn't matter whether you are getting that salt from pasteurised milk, a big Mac, or emptying the salt cellar down your throat. So the argument based on excretion doesn't work.

 

I have my own references, but that's enough for now.

[ilicos]

First off tanhauser, you are trying to come out on top by taking everything I said out of context to excuse you jumping in like a fat kid at a pool party.

 

When I said I'd stay away from milk I meant in reference for him overloading on blue top rather than don't have a cup of tea!

 

I suppose your advice of eat as much of everything you can is gospel so I'll let you take over and we should all delete our comments.

 

Keep mentioning salts and such in order to bring other irrelevant issues into the mix so that you can try to sound like you are correcting me on something I never mentioned!

 

Funny but looking through your post history you seem to be the forum's resident 'correct' man. Always telling people they're wrong.

 

Have a nice evening Tanhauser!

[Geo]

First off tanhauser, you are trying to come out on top by taking everything I said out of context to excuse you jumping in like a fat kid at a pool party.

 

Geo seems to also agree with the milk issue. When I said I'd stay away from milk I meant in reference for him overloading on blue top rather than don't have a cup of tea!

 

I suppose your advice of eat as much of everything you can is gospel so I'll let you take over and we should all delete our comments.

 

Keep mentioning salts and such in order to bring other irrelevant issues into the mix so that you can try to sound like you are correcting me on something I never mentioned!

 

Funny but looking through your post history you seem to be the forum's resident 'correct' man. Always telling people they're wrong.

 

Have a nice evening Tanhauser!

 

what milk issue??

[ilicos]

what milk issue??

 

Sorry, meant dude (edited)

[Benyon]

Wow Ive been away for a day and theres a fight breaking out:d Ive read everything and my heads spinning after reading about milk, I may lay drinking alot of milk and maybe get calcium another way.

 

@ IDO, Its Mauy thai that I do but I usually just say kickboxing, 15 years is a long time you must have been at a very good level. I got told by the hospital I should'nt go back doing it but it was driving me mad not being able to do it. Anyway ive been back into it for a few months now and everythings going well apart from my cardio & weight issue.

[Geo]

Milk = Good

[Benyon]

Milk = Good

 

Nicely put.

[Axle]

Blimey...

 

Benyon, you want to gain 10 kilos of weight (mass) is that correct? Or have i read wrong?

[ozz]

Milk = Good

 

I love milk me.

[Luxluc]

Milk = Good

 

Yeah ... milk products are fine.

 

My actual diet is 3.5 gr of protein per kg bodyweight.

 

What about you Geo?

[Geo]

Yeah ... milk products are fine.

 

My actual diet is 3.5 gr of protein per kg bodyweight.

 

What about you Geo?

 

just have a pint a day dude, ice cold cant beat it.

[IDO]

IDO, Its Mauy thai that I do but I usually just say kickboxing, 15 years is a long time you must have been at a very good level. I got told by the hospital I should'nt go back doing it but it was driving me mad not being able to do it. Anyway ive been back into it for a few months now and everythings going well apart from my cardio & weight issue.

 

Hope you find a good way to gain, for some gaining is As hard as getting rid of weight! And after coming back from injury listen to your body and don't push for results to fast as you may be worse off in the long run, I made that mistake, my injury ended up with me in hospital having open chest surgery, I was told not to train any more, stupidly after 3 months in hospital and 3 months bed rest, 4 months later I went back out to Thailand training! Not my smartest move but I just couldn't stop the sport I loved! I ended up back in hospital.... That was a couple of years back now, as said I am still training and teaching, nothing like before but I am planning a come back, so lots of hard work in front..

 

All the best with your training and bulking up, let me know you progress maybe see you at a competition sometime! I end up going to quite a few as we do mma at my gym as well (Tom 'kong' Watson trains with us).. Best of luck mate and just watch that injury!

[ozz]

Just got back from Iceland (the store) for my chicken fix, they've stopped selling the ready cooked frozen chicken!!! Nobbers, that was so easy to make into lots of healthly dishes.

[Tannhauser]

First off tanhauser, you are trying to come out on top by taking everything I said out of context

 

If I was trying to misrepresent your views by selective quoting, you would have a point. But I'm not,and that's easily seen by looking back through the posts.

 

to excuse you jumping in like a fat kid at a pool party.

 

It's a nice image. I'm jumping in because you're busy polluting the pool by taking a leak in there.

 

When I said I'd stay away from milk I meant in reference for him overloading on blue top rather than don't have a cup of tea!

 

But nobody's saying you did say that. You're claiming that it's not worth drinking pasteurised because the nutrient content is much lower and I'm disputing that.

 

I suppose your advice of eat as much of everything you can is gospel so I'll let you take over and we should all delete our comments.

 

Actually, that's not exactly what I said, but it will suffice. I'm offering an opinion, the same as you are. Feel free to delete your comments if you wish.

 

I would, however, draw a distinction between what I feel is the best strategy for Benyon, and things that I think are just plain wrong. Such as claiming that pasteurised milk is very low in calcium.

 

Keep mentioning salts and such in order to bring other irrelevant issues into the mix so that you can try to sound like you are correcting me on something I never mentioned!

 

Oh come on. Here's your quote:

Therefore, calcium in milk is not absorbed by the bloodstream. Furthermore, sugar and salt increases the rate of calcium loss through urine

 

Why did you put the last sentence in? If you're building the case that milk is no good for calcium intake, the only reason to mention this is to suggest that something in milk (such as salts) stops you from utilising it.

 

If it was irrelevant, why include it? Unless, of course, you were just blindly quoting your source.

 

Funny but looking through your post history you seem to be the forum's resident 'correct' man. Always telling people they're wrong.

 

When people get things wrong, and I'm sure of my ground, I tell them. The internet is a remarkable way of spreading knowledge, but it's also great at spreading bullshit. If we never challenge incorrect claims, the latter will spread faster than the former.There are lots of things on here I would only ever venture a meek opinion on: I don't know the first thing about cars or computers, for example.

 

Try not to take it personally.

 

Have a nice evening Tanhauser!

 

Thanks. I finished it with a mug of hot pasteurised milk. I could just feel my serum calcium levels rising.

[Tannhauser]

Actually, I do owe you an apology on one score. When you responded to my post:

 

Not true. Pasteurisation doesn't do much to the availability of calcium.

 

with this statement:

 

Quoted from a single Google search.

 

...what I thought you meant was that my information came from a single Google search. Whereas in fact you were referring to your own quote (i.e. "Here's what just one Google search showed up about pasteurised milk being useless").

 

That's why I asked you about your psychic powers. Sorry, I got hold of the wrong end of the stick.

 

You're still wrong about everything else, however.

[Axle]

So anyway...

 

Does this guy want to put on 10 kilos of mass?

[ilicos]

Actually, I do owe you an apology on one score. When you responded to my post:

 

 

 

with this statement:

 

 

 

...what I thought you meant was that my information came from a single Google search. Whereas in fact you were referring to your own quote (i.e. "Here's what just one Google search showed up about pasteurised milk being useless").

 

That's why I asked you about your psychic powers. Sorry, I got hold of the wrong end of the stick.

 

You're still wrong about everything else, however.

 

And I feel alot of what you are saying is wrong.

 

I could have replied to you post with, "Not true" As you did with mine.

 

Anyway, speaking to you reminds me of another quote I know:

 

"Never argue with a fool, cause he will bring u down to his level and beat you with experience".

 

Take that as you wish.

 

P.S. Thanks for the apology

[Benyon]

So anyway...

 

Does this guy want to put on 10 kilos of mass?

 

Yes thats right I do, But in the past putting on weight was very very hard and now I think it was because I was eating far too much protein and basically I was have like 3 craps a day. Now ive found out that its not about eating as much as you can get, I need to work out how to get the exact amount of protein I need for my weight. Also im not wanting to bulk up I just need to get my weight back to 10stone as ive lost weight since my injury.

[Tannhauser]

And I feel alot of what you are saying is wrong.

 

I could have replied to you post with, "Not true" As you did with mine.

 

You could have done, but you would be wrong.

 

Instead of name-calling, you could read the stuff below.

 

OK, you've done some research into raw vs pasteurised milk, from books and the internet. The problem is your sources. Let's take one website you cited: http://www.karlloren.com/aajonus/p15.htm. At first sight, this looks really impressive - the report is written by "International Medical Expert on raw and pasteurized milk, Dr. William Cambell Douglas, Jr. M.D. [sIC], author of the definitive book analysis of scientific and clinical study on milk, The Milk Book".

 

He's an international expert, and a doctor, and he's got a lengthy, referenced report that is really damning about pasteurised milk. But something about the way its written just doesn't ring true.

 

So let's look at William Campbell Douglass (spelled incorrectly in the article introduction):

 

1. Here's his pamphlet in which he breaks the news that smoking is good for you, and every other scientific authority in the world is wrong: http://www.randi.org/site/images/smokingisgood.pdf

 

2. The leaflet promotes him as 'Doctor of the Year'. Unfortunately, the organisation is the bogus NHF, featured on 'Quackwatch', a site that specialises in exposing dodgy qualifications: http://www.quackwatch.org/04ConsumerEducation/Nonrecorg/nhf.html

 

3. His website is full of other mad, sensationalist stuff. http://douglassreport.com/He thinks the W.H.O. tests unsafe vaccines on developing countries. Or something like that. You can also buy his book on defending yourself against the coming nuclear strike by terrorists: "That's why my War at Home report will tell you the stark realities of surviving that worst imaginable nightmare those terrorist dogs could ever dream of unleashing: A nuclear attack on U.S. soil."

 

I could go on, but the point is this: he's as mad as a box of frogs, but that doesn't stop half the internet quoting him, and I'm sure he will find his way into some of your books, too.

 

If you're still reading at this point, I'm sure you'll say that I'm just picking some irrelevant point and that there's all this evidence to prove your point. But we could do the same thing for any other part of it and get to the same conclusion.

 

You're obviously a well-meaning guy for trying to help Benyon out, but unless you think critically about your sources, you're unwittingly contributing to the mass of unscientific ordure on the internet.

[Benyon]

Hope you find a good way to gain, for some gaining is As hard as getting rid of weight! And after coming back from injury listen to your body and don't push for results to fast as you may be worse off in the long run, I made that mistake, my injury ended up with me in hospital having open chest surgery, I was told not to train any more, stupidly after 3 months in hospital and 3 months bed rest, 4 months later I went back out to Thailand training! Not my smartest move but I just couldn't stop the sport I loved! I ended up back in hospital.... That was a couple of years back now, as said I am still training and teaching, nothing like before but I am planning a come back, so lots of hard work in front..

 

All the best with your training and bulking up, let me know you progress maybe see you at a competition sometime! I end up going to quite a few as we do mma at my gym as well (Tom 'kong' Watson trains with us).. Best of luck mate and just watch that injury!

 

Thanks matey, Go easy on that ticker:thumbs: