Chasing Power - When Will It End?

[Golfpro]

Really there is no such thing as the perfect spec or setup.

 

Technology is always changing so todays cutting edge will probably be improved in the following months or years.

 

Lets face it, if you could afford it, wouldnt you keep trying to upgrade your car? If you won the lottery tomorrow, wouldnt you spend a chunk of it trying to create the ultimate car?.

 

Unfortunately most of us are on a budget. Some of us have more, some have less. But we all try to get the most of what we have.

 

Fortunately we are all starting from a great base as even the standard car is a match for most modern cars this side of 50k. Spend a few thousand and you will match anything up to 100k!

 

There is no right and no wrong. Everyone has a budget and everyone has a preferred driving style. All I know is we have a great car wether it be a streetcar at 400 bhp or a drag monster at 1000.

[Stephen G]

very true:cool:

[RoyBoy7]

Chasing Power - When Will It End?

When the bank manager says enough or my exwife finds out what I spend on my car. which ever comes first !

[evinX]

That happens with anything, especially when youve been wanting/waiting for so long...that just us humans...never happy as well alway want more!!

[Bailey.]

Golfpro-------bravo, well put!

[jevansio]

Here's another thought for you, I watch that video of the Supra vs Lambo where he ****s off from it & think, that's what I want, so I get my car to a very reasonable power level (well into 600's) then put it up against my mates 911 Turbo (500) and TBH there's not a lot in in through a quick 3rd & 4th gear pull.

 

So am I expecting too much from only 100 odd difference? I guess when you look at JP & LP Thunder Road times & there's prolly at least the same difference between them & the total mph difference over a mile (a lot more than we raced over) was only 8mph.

 

I always though 100bhp would be very noticable on the road, what do you guys think?

[imi]

Technology is always changing so todays cutting edge will probably be improved in the following months or years.

 

Technology just doesnt reside in the engine bay

 

its not all about the power now is it, its about how the power is transferred to the tarmac.

 

perhaps some of these "supercars" have a thing or two over the supra after all - not to mention I am assuming they are a lot newer than the 20yr old designed supra.

 

Lets face it, if you could afford it, wouldnt you keep trying to upgrade your car? If you won the lottery tomorrow, wouldnt you spend a chunk of it trying to create the ultimate car?.

 

nope, i'd just buy one or more. dont have the time to mess about upgrading cars, etc.......

[Golfpro]

its not all about the power now is it, its about how the power is transferred to the tarmac.

 

perhaps some of these "supercars" have a thing or two over the supra after all - not to mention I am assuming they are a lot newer than the 20yr old designed supra.

 

With an unlimited budget you could buy or develop the same technology (electronic stability control etc) that they have and you could keep testing and tweeking the car to continually improve it.

 

The reason why supercars keep getting better is that they throw truckloads of money into development and testing.

[imi]

right......ok

[The Raven]

Never been a huge power chaser.

 

BPU a TT lump and that would be enough for me 400-450 bhp. So anyone looking for an Xmas present for me get saving.

[Ricky49]

Here's another thought for you, I watch that video of the Supra vs Lambo where he ****s off from it & think, that's what I want, so I get my car to a very reasonable power level (well into 600's) then put it up against my mates 911 Turbo (500) and TBH there's not a lot in in through a quick 3rd & 4th gear pull.

 

So am I expecting too much from only 100 odd difference? I guess when you look at JP & LP Thunder Road times & there's prolly at least the same difference between them & the total mph difference over a mile (a lot more than we raced over) was only 8mph.

 

I always though 100bhp would be very noticable on the road, what do you guys think?

 

Even though JP and LP were only 8mph different how much extra power would be needed for jamie to equal lee in a standing mile.

 

I'm guessing that it would be quite a bit as you need to get the extra mph before running out of road.

 

Also what is the weight difference between your mates 911 and your Supra. If your giving away a weight disadvantage the extra 100 ponies wouldn't make much difference.

[JamieP]

Here's another thought for you, I watch that video of the Supra vs Lambo where he ****s off from it & think, that's what I want, so I get my car to a very reasonable power level (well into 600's) then put it up against my mates 911 Turbo (500) and TBH there's not a lot in in through a quick 3rd & 4th gear pull.

 

So am I expecting too much from only 100 odd difference? I guess when you look at JP & LP Thunder Road times & there's prolly at least the same difference between them & the total mph difference over a mile (a lot more than we raced over) was only 8mph.

 

I always though 100bhp would be very noticable on the road, what do you guys think?

 

It all sounds like you are talking yourself into a larger turbo to me mate:D come to WIM next week and you can have a drive of mine;)

[Miguel]

I think it all very much depends on the type of character you are and how much your adrenalin gland needs squeezed. I personally find it very hard to resist pushing for the 'ultimate spec' and I'm surprised I've lasted as long as I have without 'playing'. Had it not been for the limited options when it came to auto boxes, I'm scared to think what state of tune my Supra would have been by now - it was already getting out of hand back then. I dunno, maybe I'm turning into a woman, but the overriding thought of pouring money into modding something you'll never be happy with seems to have curbed my addiction for power.

 

With regards Jamie's comment on following the flock: I think that to be a little harsh. You have to remember at the time when these statements were being made turbo tech wasn't what it is now. I remember all too well you doing a 360 on your opinion when you had a t88 Lag, drivability, liveability will always be subjective and open to interpretation; not everyone can afford the latest turbos on the market so still have to live with the cheaper old breed. Remember one persons lag is another persons heaven.

[jevansio]

It all sounds like you are talking yourself into a larger turbo to me mate:D come to WIM next week and you can have a drive of mine;)

I think I have bud, dude if you weren't so far away I'd jump at the chance

 

I don't think it's gonna be this year, infact I know it won't be, but I wish I knew when I ordered the 67 what i know now

 

Ah well I've got the car for life so there's plenty of time for more mods later

[Ewen]

BPU is enough for me. Well actually it isn't but it is. I have so many interests and commitments that take a fair bit of funding that taking the Supra up beyond BPU just cant be done right now.

BPU suits the journeys I do and my driving style quite well TBH. Apart from a couple of early issues, I'm also enjoying a run of reliability...no worries, daily driver, easy MOT's etc...seven years and counting...that, whilst maybe not the apex of Supra potential, sure helps when the rest of my life is rather stressed out. Fair play to those who crave for, and have the funds / expertise to push out beyond 350 bhp / tonne. Part of me feels I'm missing out on something special, but part of me always backs down...(it took me five years to decide to go BPU)...maybe in a year or two's time ?

[jevansio]

I do have a very addictive personality Miguel, always have done, anything I do, I take to the extreme.

 

At work couple of guys had radio controlled cars, I couldn't rest until I had the fastest

[Miguel]

You're not alone, and I think you have answered your own query

[nigelboyne]

Has anyone reached a power level for their car and actually found it's enough & has been so for some time?

 

When I got the T67 and had Ryan set it upto 1.6BAR it was feckin mental, felt scary, I though it would be more than enough, 4th gear pull gave me that funny feeling in my tummy.

 

Now it's been a couple of weeks (yeah not even a year or anything), & the feeling of exhileration is wearing off.

 

If I didn't have my Performance Monitor to guestimate rwhp figures I'd swear it was getting slower.

 

But what's next after a T67 Billet?, do you go JP style with a T76?, is he going to find that rather mundane after a while @ 1000bhp? Will anyone EVER get sick of 1000bhp?

 

i wont be happy till my supra is a genuine 200mph car. at the moment its a genuine gps 180mph.hp doesn really interest me but i suppose you need at least 550/600bhp.this is a fantastic thread i think a lot of good information but the club needs very badly a single turbo information section. i think there has to come a point were you reach contentiment with the car some are content with stock some bpu and some single with 550 to 700hp. then there is the usual suspects who really keep the club alive pushing the big hp 700/1000.

Edited May 1, 2010 by nigelboyne (see edit history)

[imi]

then there is the usual suspects who really keep the club alive pushing the big hp 700/1000.

 

perhaps keep you alive - I would hope that club is not that shallow......

[Luxluc]

I ablsolutely understand you Jay. Once you're used to the power of your car, you get tempted to go for some more.

 

My PHR stage 1 setup was very nice on the streets .. 1 bar of boost around 3.3k and full boost (1.5 bar) at 3.8k. The 540 bhp were very nice to drive, and I kept this setup up for almost 2 years (although, I did only 2800mls in those 2 years).

My current 91-79 setup is a little bit laggier than the Stage 1 was (also due to the 264 cams I am running now). 1 bar is reached at 3.7k, and full boost (1.5 bar) at 4150 rpm.

When I am driving my car, I have 2 different modes: Relaxing mode where I often change gears around 3000/3200 rpm - Speeding mode where I push the engine harder.

 

To be honest, these 2 modes don't make me feel a big difference when comparing the 60mm against my actual 67mm tubbie. On relaxing mode, neighter does/did one of the 2 turbos give an impressing punch. On Speeding mode, the slight delay of the BW turbo compared to the Stage 1 is only felt in the selected gear to floor the car ... when changing to other gears .. there are nevertheless enough revs to keep whatever turbo happily pulling.

[nigelboyne]

I ablsolutely understand you Jay. Once you're used to the power of your car, you get tempted to go for some more.

 

My PHR stage 1 setup was very nice on the streets .. 1 bar of boost around 3.3k and full boost (1.5 bar) at 3.8k. The 540 bhp were very nice to drive, and I kept this setup up for almost 2 years (although, I did only 2800mls in those 2 years).

My current 91-79 setup is a little bit laggier than the Stage 1 was (also due to the 264 cams I am running now). 1 bar is reached at 3.7k, and full boost (1.5 bar) at 4150 rpm.

When I am driving my car, I have 2 different modes: Relaxing mode where I often change gears around 3000/3200 rpm - Speeding mode where I push the engine harder.

 

To be honest, these 2 modes don't make me feel a big difference when comparing the 60mm against my actual 67mm tubbie. On relaxing mode, neighter does/did one of the 2 turbos give an impressing punch. On Speeding mode, the slight delay of the BW turbo compared to the Stage 1 is only felt in the selected gear to floor the car ... when changing to other gears .. there are nevertheless enough revs to keep whatever turbo happily pulling.

 

do you feel your turbo{66/67mm} is the largest you could run on the stock engine, i was wondering could i run new garret gtx4294r billet think its 71mm, and the new paul whiffen manifold,i dont want any boost below 3k but dont want to wait till 5k either to get boost.

[sdistc]

Very little compelling evidence that the billet 4294 is faster spooling than the cast version (which is what I have). I'm not sure that it would be at full boost before 5k (mine certainly isn't, with a twin scroll housing on twin scroll HKS manifold) - but I'd like to see what effect the twin wastegate manifold has on it.

[Luxluc]

do you feel your turbo{66/67mm} is the largest you could run on the stock engine, i was wondering could i run new garret gtx4294r billet think its 71mm, and the new paul whiffen manifold,i dont want any boost below 3k but dont want to wait till 5k either to get boost.

 

I guess it's not the turbo that's a restricting factor on a stock engine, but the power / boost you're pushing through it with bigger turbos (>= 71mm).

 

After Ryan mapped the BW unit, my Supe pushed out 626 bhp at 1.5 bar. Although I had 1.7 bar for high boost in mind when driving to SRR, I told Ryan that I would be happy with these figures / 1.5 bar(for the moment).

 

Although some people are pushing out by far bigger numbers than I do on a stock engine, I didn't want to push it too far.

 

I have to admit that the actual power I have on my Supe is more than impressive on the roads. I don't know if another 50-100 bhp more will bring a great benefit on the streets, apart from those places where you have longer straights.

[JamieP]

Very little compelling evidence that the billet 4294 is faster spooling than the cast version (which is what I have). I'm not sure that it would be at full boost before 5k (mine certainly isn't, with a twin scroll housing on twin scroll HKS manifold) - but I'd like to see what effect the twin wastegate manifold has on it.

 

What size .ar do you have? and what boost is "full boost"?

 

when you say you dont get full boost till after 5k how are you measuring it? dyno? top gear on the street?

[sdistc]

What size .ar do you have? and what boost is "full boost"?

 

when you say you dont get full boost till after 5k how are you measuring it? dyno? top gear on the street?

 

AR is 1.05, I believe. Full boost was whatever I got with a cat installed and usually about 22 psi (this is on the street), and was a bit lower RPM than on the dyno - but still 5k+ from memory (you'll have to forgive me, as it *has* been almost 15 months since I drove it last).