Dash Rendar Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 The last few days, if I put my foot as much as halfway down in 2nd, even on dry roads, the wheels just spin, even with the RLTC on (in wet or dry mode). Does this mean I've got issues with my RLTC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Is it happening on decent boost Darren? In current weather that would be normal, but if it's off boost then it might be a mechanical issue rather than RLTC throwing a fit. Still, shouldn't be slipping with the RLTC on. Is the ABS working? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurnam Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Check the read on ur rear tyres. RLTC will start to slip & let go when your tread is very low. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dash Rendar Posted January 26, 2010 Author Share Posted January 26, 2010 It's only on boost. Maybe even RLTC can't handle this weather... even when relatively dry. I wish these things were easier to test. I think the tread is okay. P.S. I'll try the ABS next time I'm in the car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branners Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Racelogic should stop the wheels spinning completely in WET mode, so something is wrong. There has been a case of somebody's RLTC losing its DAT file and dropping back to 4cylinder with no real cut points. Perhaps export the DAT file and check it in Graham's RLTC program or ask somebody on here to take a look. If it is the stock file that came with it then it can be improved on anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 If it's spinning on boost then that's perfectly normal, with the auto diff the tractive effort on that setup is HUGE so wouldn't be suprised if it span from 3k rpm to redline in 2nd if the RLTC isn't doing it's thing. As JB says Racelogic on wet setting should stop the spin regardless, so there is an issue with it not coming on. Can you feel/hear any cut at all? I'm almost certain the DAT file Darren has is a Terminator one, but it's a good point that it might have reset itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dash Rendar Posted January 27, 2010 Author Share Posted January 27, 2010 (edited) The DAT file was installed by Matt Harwood, a couple of years back. I would plug my laptop into it, but the USB-to-serial cable I've got wont talk to the RLTC system (even though the drivers appeared to install properly). My laptop doesn't have a serial port. Last time I interfaced with the RLTC, I borrowed an old laptop with a serial cable. But that one was an old one from work that's since been disposed of. I'll have to see if I can find an old laptop somewhere... Edited February 2, 2010 by Dash Rendar (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminator Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 If RL is not cutting at all, check the earth is good in the cabin, cold weather and condentation might just be enough to cause a problem if the earth is not 100%. In wet mode on cold roads you should feel RL cut in, you should be able to put your and foot flat to the floor and RL make the car drivable, until you get off the throttle again. Spinning wheels in wet mode is a sure sign something is very wrong. If you can get the file out of it give me a shout and I'll look it over for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dash Rendar Posted January 27, 2010 Author Share Posted January 27, 2010 Cheers, I'll try and get the file off it. I have a backup of the file, so I can always reapply it myself, if I can get the connectivity working (which I can do when I source a laptop with a serial cable or get a USB->serial that actually works). I know it's definitely not working... I know what it feels like when it's cutting in. But the wheels are just spinning away. Where would I find the earth? Edit: I presume it just splits off where the serial connection is, so I'll look there when it's lighter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Might be a long shot, but I recall you mentioned something about changing the alarm recently, did the problems start around that time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminator Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Might be a long shot, but I recall you mentioned something about changing the alarm recently, did the problems start around that time? If that is the case I would check all RL plug connections and the earth. The earth point could be anywhere, but try looking near the stock ECU site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dash Rendar Posted January 27, 2010 Author Share Posted January 27, 2010 Yeah, that's a good call with the alarm. I had the same thought, as I had big issues with traction on Sunday morning (and this is when I found it very apparent for the first time), and I had the alarm installed on Saturday. However, I'm pretty sure I had some slippage on the way to getting the alarm fitted... I was going in convoy with the missus who was in the Scooby, and I remember putting my foot down for a little fun, but struggling to get any traction so I gave up. So, the timing is very close, but I have a feeling the problem was happening before. But I'll have a look at the connections as soon as poss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dash Rendar Posted January 30, 2010 Author Share Posted January 30, 2010 I'm struggling to source a laptop with a serial port, and I know my cable doesn't work. Can anyone recommend a USB-to-serial cable (with drivers) that is known to work with RLTC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminator Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 I tried a USB system and gave up, just get an old laptop of ebay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dash Rendar Posted January 31, 2010 Author Share Posted January 31, 2010 Doh! I ordered another cable off Ebay yesterday. I'll see how that goes,and a friend may have an old laptop that's suitable. But if those options are no good, I'll do as you say and buy an old laptop from somewhere. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dash Rendar Posted February 1, 2010 Author Share Posted February 1, 2010 Right... some updates. Firstly, I finally managed to test the ABS given the light snow / ice in our area last night. And it works fine. (I was having a surprising amount of difficulty testing it on the dry roads previously... It's quite difficult to shake the habbit of doing 'proper' emergency stops without just stamping on the brakes!) Next... I borrowed a PCMCIA serial card from a geezer at work, and it works a treat! So, I pulled out the cable from the car, and I can see the little green light flashing when the TC is turned off, and the light stops flashing when it's turned on. I presume that's all as it should be. I was able to pull the map off the car, and it all looks fine at a glance... and is in 6 cylinder mode. And the test functions definitely were doing something to the engine while it was sat on the driveway. So, everything seems fine! Based on this, I figured maybe it's just me, so I went out with the missus to test drive the car. There is definitely a difference in behaviour between RLTC turned to wet, and it turned off. When it's off, if I put my foot down, the revs shoot straight up as the car loses traction and goes nowhere. But when I put my foot down with it turned on, the car still feels to me like it's losing traction, but it's a different feel. The car was trying to veer to the side, and the engine was doing a rapid da-da-da-da noise, kind of like it was bouncing off the rev limiter, but at lower revs. So, I *think* it's working, but I don't remember it ever behaving quite like this. Before, the RLTC has always felt much less invasive, just cutting the power as required to keep the car in a straight line and keep the power down. But now, it seems to be struggling. Perhaps I've just never used it in such cold weather? I'd be interested to know if what I'm feeling is normal. I've attached some screenshots of my map. Out of interest, Matt H said that the launch control is currently disabled on my car, but it is installed and can be turned on. I've found another map saved on my machine which has the following settings for launch control: Slip override: 15% Delay slip override: 5% Slip to reinstate TC: 20% Dry hard cut: 4774rpm Dry soft cut: 4524rpm Dry start delay: 2.0s Dry slow override speed threshold: 30kmh Wet hard cut: 3750rpm Wet soft cut: 3500rpm Wet start delay: 2.0s Wet slow override speed threshold: 25kmh Do these look like good settings to apply? (I recall Matt left it turned off because he was diagnosing another issue where the TC was constantly cutting in under normal driving, and inadvertantly forgot to turn the LC back on... So I've never actually tried it!) Out of interest, is there such a thing as a users guide/manual for this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dash Rendar Posted February 2, 2010 Author Share Posted February 2, 2010 So, what do you reckon guys? I've got the alarm installers waiting on a call-back from me, as I had come to the conclusion it had stopped working after the alarm install, but now I'm not really sure if there's an issue at all, or if it has anything to do with them. It certainly seems to be communicating and such. The alarm guys did mention that the wiring in the car was a bit of a mess and could do with some tidying up anyway, but I'm not sure if it's worth it. If it ain't broke... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dash Rendar Posted February 5, 2010 Author Share Posted February 5, 2010 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 Hi Darren, Sorry to see you're having more problems. The RLTC 'should' always cut in regardless of how cold or slippery it is. In icy or very wet conditions, you will experience a certain amount of movement because even a 5% difference in wheelspeeds means the wheels are breaking traction and allowing the rear to slide slightly. Are the tyres in good condition? RLTC's working data is based on wheel speed differences between the driven and reference wheels. It's importants and worth checking that this information is still in the correct places. I have seen one case where the wheels 'seemed' to move. I always assumed it was the customer fiddling, but who knows I don't think you can disable launch control, but I do remember that I didn't set yours up to suit your car. Those launch settings, well the dry one at least, looks like it was from my car. Mine had the same turbo as yours but non DBB, so it should be similar. Depends how aggressive you want it to be The wiring in the car isn't the greatest, but it's safe. I've seen a lot worse. If I thought it needed work at the time, I would have mentioned it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 I guess I should have looked at those screen shots before posting. Yep setting the rev limits to 8000 would effectively disable it!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 Manual... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dash Rendar Posted February 7, 2010 Author Share Posted February 7, 2010 Thanks for the update Matt. I'm starting to think that I was just being paranoid. It's clearly doing something (!??) when it's turned on, and I'm wondering if I just never had the guts to apply as much throttle in the icy/wet last year as I have now, despite having the RLTC turned it. And thanks for the comment on the wiring. If you don't think it needs any work, then that's good enough for me! I think I'll go and apply the Launch Control settings I posted up previously (and I'll leave the rest of the map alone). Do you know... I've never, ever used the launch control!! I don't really know how it works! I guess I just push the button, put my foot on the clutch, give it some gas and then let go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dash Rendar Posted February 7, 2010 Author Share Posted February 7, 2010 Awesome, thanks for the manual link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dash Rendar Posted February 7, 2010 Author Share Posted February 7, 2010 P.S. The rear wheels have plenty of tread and they're Eagle F1s, so they should be okay. Next time at a meet, I'll have to try and find someone who's familiar with this kind of power and RLTC, to confirm it's working as it's supposed to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 I don't really know how it works! I guess I just push the button, put my foot on the clutch, give it some gas and then let go. Foot on clutch, flat out on throttle for a second or so, drop clutch, hold on... It's a bit brutal, so you don't want to do it too often, but if it bogs down, you need to raise the revs. If it just goes wild, you need to drop the revs. There's no correct setting unfortunately, it'll depend on the level of available grip at the time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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