mathew Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Just a suggestion....why not read for yourself and form your own opinion rather than digesting and spouting someone else's propaganda... We are lucky we live in the west where literacy rates are high - lets make use of it. could you point me in the direction of something worthwhile to read to enable me to have an un biased opinion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 could you point me in the direction of something worthwhile to read to enable me to have an un biased opinion? Good place to start with the scriptures that these religions are supposedly based on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathew Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Good place to start with the scriptures that these religions are supposedly based on. where can i find these scriptures? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formatzero Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Funny how when bnp is mentioned most people get on the immigration muslim wagon,i guess that's what their best known for,however when my 20 year old daughter asked me what they stood for other than that i hadn't a clue.A few days later she says hey dad have a look at that website ive been reading,yup bnp.I had a read of it and( immigration aside)i found myself agreeing with a lot of it .Yobs,thiefs etc corporal punishment,paedophiles,murderers,terrorists,death penalty.On immigration it says foreign aid will only be paid to countries who encourage there countrymen home,sounds fair to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abz Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 i havent seen an argument. as abz said its been a discussion. i like hearing other peoples views and like giving mine on these issues. i havent, and wont, even try to start an argument. In all fairness to abz he has kept it on a friendly level with me despite my opinions which in the past on here have resulted in me being called a c*nt amongst other things by certain members. At least your asking the questions! An opinion is an....opinion, nothing to get heated about. Though if that opinion is incorrect then a discussion can correct it, in which turn it can change a person opinion (like example when we spoke about the churches in the middle east). im just going on what ive read and heard about religion. mostly the negatives about islam i find are published by other religions, the negatives of christianity are published by other religions...see a pattern emerging here??? Since 9/11 - Islam has been put next to "hate" in the dictionary, who would be to blame for this? IMO The media...why? Because if they did not give these terrorists (yes terriosts, not islamic terrorists) a platform & even give them that much appriciation as to relate them to a religion which they don't follow the basis's of then no one would pay attention. This attention caused the world to go against islam & majority tarred the religion with the same brush as these crusaders. We don't even know if it was 100% that these people was able to plan or even have the facility to achieve such a horrendous plan, but because our TV sets say they have, everyone has passed judgement. where can i find these scriptures? Matthew, this is quite different because in order to understand this properly you need to study the actually holy books. Pulling things from the internet & media will only cloud your judgement. There are loads of islamic & christians classes which you can attend, regardless of your belief to gain a better understand of the religion. Funny how when bnp is mentioned most people get on the immigration muslim wagon,i guess that's what their best known for,however when my 20 year old daughter asked me what they stood for other than that i hadn't a clue.A few days later she says hey dad have a look at that website ive been reading,yup bnp.I had a read of it and( immigration aside)i found myself agreeing with a lot of it .Yobs,thiefs etc corporal punishment,paedophiles,murderers,terrorists,death penalty.On immigration it says foreign aid will only be paid to countries who encourage there countrymen home,sounds fair to me True, and I also agree some points do make sense. Though you have to look at the underlying agenda they have. Growing up on the Isle Of Dogs & having to live with the national front was not nice I tell you, but I am taught to never pass judgement. I grew up with loads of kids who's parents were involved in the National front & BNP, they didn't understand why they should dislike us. If you watched Question time you will see what Nick's main agenda was to outlaw islam. Does he not know islam does not even consider the colour of your skin or background, we are all seen as one. Matthew as we was discussing earlier if you would like a slight insight into the islamic religion then I recommend you watch this if you have time mate. Although not a great example it shows a small insight into muslim family life. http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00ny0hn/The_Worlds_Strictest_Parents_Series_2_Lebanon/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 where can i find these scriptures? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathew Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 why the confused look? it was a genuine question. if what i read isnt a true reflection of the religion then show me what is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_jekyll Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 i wasnt suggesting ther was an argument. jus saw potential for it to develope into one and i dnt want to see people being called cu*ts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 why the confused look? it was a genuine question. if what i read isnt a true reflection of the religion then show me what is. You said earlier on... im just going on what ive read and heard about religion. mostly the negatives about islam i find are published by other religions, the negatives of christianity are published by other religions...see a pattern emerging here??? The above doesnt sound like religious scriptures to me......does it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathew Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 You said earlier on... The above doesnt sound like religious scriptures to me......does it? il ask again. where can i find info on religions which isnt biased, false or negative? is there any? if so where can i find it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 il ask again. where can i find info on religions which isnt biased, false or negative? is there any? if so where can i find it? Unbiased info on religions is harder to find than the Holy Grail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathew Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Unbiased info on religions is harder to find than the Holy Grail excactly my point. how someone can say that my view on religion isnt accurate as its all based on things such as 'media' is a bit confusing when its nigh on impossible to find anything unbiased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJI Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 could you point me in the direction of something worthwhile to read to enable me to have an un biased opinion? You only need to have a GCSE level understanding of science to know that religion is not fact. Best 'scriptures' to read are science books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carl0s Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 Life would be a lot simpler if people stopped getting emotionally charged over these silly made up fairytails. I can see there might be a need to create some sense of worth in people's otherwise empty lives, but unfortunately that has proven to be too troublesome for many humans to cope with. Let's face it, the sort of people who are going to believe this fairytake shit and obsess over it are obviously going to do other stupid and irrational things. I'm sure if the writers of these fairytales had had sufficient foresight then they would have not bothered writing them in the first place.* *that doesn't mean you can't just try to be nice and do what you think is right and acceptable, and work on the basis that you get what you give, and what goes around comes around. Fairytales not needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 excactly my point. how someone can say that my view on religion isnt accurate as its all based on things such as 'media' is a bit confusing when its nigh on impossible to find anything unbiased. you seem to be going round in circles if you are genuinely interested in what the different religions have to say then read their scriptures.........and form your own opinion - cant get simpler than that. where can i find these scriptures? try here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tourniquet Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 Sorry guys n gals, really cant be bothered to read the past 6 pages but id love to get my tuppence worth on the BNP debate :-) I read their leaflet that came through the door and found I agreed with pretty much everything they said they wanted to do and think should be done. My problem is the party is being run by a plonker who gives them all a bad name because he is so. I know that whoever runs the country will just fcuk us over and ruin the place but the problem is their ideas on immigration, thieves rapists and general scum are unfortunately what actually needs to be done. My grandparents would turn in their graves if they could see the state of the country they fought for in it's PC bend over backwards for all but their own way that it is. I just hope I get out of here before we're truly sunk, as England as much as I love her, it's colourful and brutal history and beautiful places is no longer England it's now a collecting ground for the worlds poncers and wannabe gangster scum with a more than healthy but by no means enough decent folk for my liking. It just makes me laugh that we're fighting for barbaric shat holes like Trashcanistan so we can make them run with good old british democracy....in essence to be ruined just like blighty - nice one Labour. I know we sign up to go on operations but pah-lease ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 It just makes me laugh that we're fighting for barbaric shat holes like Trashcanistan so we can make them run with good old british democracy.... Funny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carl0s Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 Sorry guys n gals, really cant be bothered to read the past 6 pages but id love to get my tuppence worth on the BNP debate :-) I read their leaflet that came through the door and found I agreed with pretty much everything they said they wanted to do and think should be done. My problem is the party is being run by a plonker who gives them all a bad name because he is so. I know that whoever runs the country will just fcuk us over and ruin the place but the problem is their ideas on immigration, thieves rapists and general scum are unfortunately what actually needs to be done. My grandparents would turn in their graves if they could see the state of the country they fought for in it's PC bend over backwards for all but their own way that it is. I just hope I get out of here before we're truly sunk, as England as much as I love her, it's colourful and brutal history and beautiful places is no longer England it's now a collecting ground for the worlds poncers and wannabe gangster scum with a more than healthy but by no means enough decent folk for my liking. It just makes me laugh that we're fighting for barbaric shat holes like Trashcanistan so we can make them run with good old british democracy....in essence to be ruined just like blighty - nice one Labour. I know we sign up to go on operations but pah-lease ! I'm sure there's been plenty of times when very bad people with very bad ideas have gotten into power because they promised to fix all that was wrong with the country. What party doesn't want to fix rapists, thieves and general scum ? The only thing they're perhaps making more of a hardline on is the immigration thing, but then again all partys are supposedly tigtening up on it aren't they, it's just that with the BNPs general Naziness it's kind of obvious that they'll be really harsh on both future immigration and I would think existing immigrants as well. Regardless of anything, it just seems far too Nazi like to me. Thankfully I'm pretty confident that as a country we could never turn into a Nazi-Germany type place. I don't think most normal people could really practice hate like that, regardless of what our leaders tried to tell us to do. I did watch a science experiment though where some people were being told to electric shock somebody, up to the point where they thought they had shocked the person into death, "because the experiment depends on it. You must do it." That was quite an eye opener. I think ~80% of participants actually (thought they had) killed the subjects, because "the country/experiment/whatever depended on it." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tourniquet Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 It's true Imi, we can't even look after ourselves yet we want to thrust our ways on other countries. I know it's good in theory but theory and reality are worlds apart. I think we should all live our own ways and go to other places to experience theirs - if you don't like the way other countries live don't go there especially to live - a visit would be different. I wonder sometime what things would have been like if Hitler won the war - I know it's a bit extreme but England's fcuked beyond repair now I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tourniquet Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 I agree, I think immigration is a massive problem and that in general it obviously is a good thing for the country BUT it's got to the point where the pi55 has been well and truly taken and now enough is enough ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abz Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 I agree, I think immigration is a massive problem and that in general it obviously is a good thing for the country BUT it's got to the point where the pi55 has been well and truly taken and now enough is enough ! I also agree with this but I would not want a party like the BNP to run the country. Let me put it in simple terms, imagine this...Al-Qaeda turn round & say sorry, but we are changing our policy & we like all non-muslims (even though they are not muslims themselves). Please now be our friends & let us into your homes. Now you know what they was like & they have been trained by the America's so they know what they are doing. Would you trust them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathew Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 if you are genuinely interested in what the different religions have to say then read their scriptures.........and form your own opinion - cant get simpler than that. i have formed my own opinion based on what ive read. just out of curiosity imi why do you practice your religion? (assuming you are religios) did you discover the religion for yourself or were you born into it? have you ever questioned your religion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 It's true Imi, we can't even look after ourselves yet we want to thrust our ways on other countries. I know it's good in theory but theory and reality are worlds apart. I think we should all live our own ways and go to other places to experience theirs - if you don't like the way other countries live don't go there especially to live - a visit would be different. I see what you are saying and I agree with most of what you have said; the bit that I found funny was us thrusting our british democracy as being the reason why we invaded iraq, afghanistan, etc....... I'll summarise it in one word - OIL - the rest is a facade IMO. i have formed my own opinion based on what ive read. nothing wrong with that, however you said earlier.... im just going on what ive read and heard about religion. mostly the negatives about islam i find are published by other religions, the negatives of christianity are published by other religions...see a pattern emerging here??? To which I said, read the scriptures and not the media propoganda (he said, she said) to get the jist of what the religion stands for and then make your own opinion based on that (whether you agree, disagree, think its bollocks or whatever). reason I suggested that in the first place was because of your 2nd hand conjecture earlier on as follows: i just did but im not sure what to take as truth or just propaganda. although i did read a bit where if a muslim converts to another faith they are punished by the death penalty being enforced! thats my suggestion and my opinion; you are entitled to your own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathew Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 what about published articles that quote lines and phrases from the religious scriptures? am i to believe those wether they are positive or negative? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 what about published articles that quote lines and phrases from the religious scriptures? am i to believe those wether they are positive or negative? I havent seen or read those articles so how can I possibly comment. In any case, wouldn't you want to go back to the source and check the authenticity of the quote and the context - or are you content to take their interpretation of it? You decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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