Guigsy Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 unlucky with the skyline. 400bhp supras dont blow up (coming from a 400bhp auto supra owner with 145000 miles on the clock) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Now I'm thinking "I just want something fun to drive that I don't have to worry about every time I put my foot down, or spends more time in the garage than on the road." =NA BPU for me Get a TT supra then 400bhp that can be driven every day for years, cover tens of thousands of miles and never need any work aside from a basic service. My last one was 428bhp at the fly, for 4 years, did 36k miles and never missed a beat. It later went single and is still going well 2 years later, still on an unopened engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMan Posted July 15, 2009 Author Share Posted July 15, 2009 Oh? I've read about quite a few turbo failures on this forum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guigsy Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 because there are a lot of people on the forum. Most of the turbo failiures ive seen have been hybrid systems. Which at one time were popular. but now are not being recomended as they seem to implode after 15k or so Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMan Posted July 15, 2009 Author Share Posted July 15, 2009 (edited) Oh can the mods delete any posts on this thread that are about the beat to death turbo vs na thing, Possibly edit the title to "If you own a turbo supra don't even look at this thread" Edited July 15, 2009 by GMan (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guigsy Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 i dont think there are any :S everyone is bored of that argument. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Oh? I've read about quite a few turbo failures on this forum Lol, you really need to learn a little more crikey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMan Posted July 15, 2009 Author Share Posted July 15, 2009 (edited) The whole second page seems to be about "no useful gains" "get a tt" "tt's are reliable" "dyno sheets to prove gains" etc.. No one seems to understand that I specifically looked for a non turbo automatic supra, or that I want it to remain a non turbo automatic supra, that it is within my means to buy a tt 6 speed and get xxx amount of hp but I don't want to, yet. Edited July 15, 2009 by GMan (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guigsy Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 not as i see it. just people wanting to know and discussing. People are asking for dyno sheets is because this kind of thing has been discussed before and people have done it and claimed xxx power increase with no proof. With any kind of mod like this if other people are going to do it they need to see the results not just what some other guy "thinks" it feels like . If it was NA bashing... you would know about it both me and homer have had/do have NA's we aint bashing them. I loved my NA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 With any kind of mod like this if other people are going to do it they need to see the results not just what some other guy "thinks" it feels like . what if that "some other guy" was a well respected long standing member who has driven many many supras? "I was sceptical about the gains but people kept asking me to do one. I admit huge surprise at what a difference removing the cat stuff on the N/A makes! It really does wake them up, especially with a decent aftermarket exhaust from the cat pipe back. The Hyper is VERY loud on the N/A with no turbos to take some energy out of the exhaust, so I personally prefer the Super Dragar system. Never heard the Blitz stuff, although I think they do make an N/A system. E-mail or ring me direct for price if interested. See sig for number. Direct e-mail is [email protected] Further mods will not be very cost effective, i doubt changing the air filter or filter and box will gain anything whatsoever, may cost power. You could spend some dosh on the handling if you like to throw the beastie around, the lighter front end should make it handle a lot better than the TT, set up right. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guigsy Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 people still like to see numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 people still like to see numbers. yeh i know but the trouble is the small gains that may be had from these mods are in the order of magnitude, or maybe less than the 'spread' of dyno results people get for an unaltered car. ie you take your car to 3 different dynos and the you'll get results that span 20-30bhp i'd expect. All said and done one NA is never going to be massively quicker than another and in a straight line will not compete with a TT stock or otherwise. Twisty circuit/back road and there is all but nothing in it but thats only because the TT doesn't get the chance to stretch its legs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benkei Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 Fair play to the OP. He's got a Skyline which gives him plenty of power, and also plenty of grief! Now he wants an N/A for stress-free driving fun. He wants to make it a bit more fun to drive by doing a BPU upgrade and showing us what he's doing (It's his car and he wants to share his Supe build, just like the rest of us) and all people keep going on about is bhp numbers and proof of mroe power?! He's already said he's not after figures, just a better driving experience! It's obvious a Turbo set up will see more power than what any n/a could accomplish at a fraction of the cost. Not only has it been covered time and time again, but isn't it obvious?! I love BPUing n/a's, it makes them more fun, and aslong as you know you're not going to see any dramatic increases in power, then it's all good fun! Just let the guy get on with his build and enjoy his Supe without people shouting about how good TT set ups are and wanting dyno figures off him. Whatever happened to 'each ot their own'? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMan Posted July 16, 2009 Author Share Posted July 16, 2009 Fair play to the OP. He's got a Skyline which gives him plenty of power, and also plenty of grief! Now he wants an N/A for stress-free driving fun. He wants to make it a bit more fun to drive by doing a BPU upgrade and showing us what he's doing (It's his car and he wants to share his Supe build, just like the rest of us) and all people keep going on about is bhp numbers and proof of mroe power?! He's already said he's not after figures, just a better driving experience! It's obvious a Turbo set up will see more power than what any n/a could accomplish at a fraction of the cost. Not only has it been covered time and time again, but isn't it obvious?! I love BPUing n/a's, it makes them more fun, and aslong as you know you're not going to see any dramatic increases in power, then it's all good fun! Just let the guy get on with his build and enjoy his Supe without people shouting about how good TT set ups are and wanting dyno figures off him. Whatever happened to 'each ot their own'? EXACTLY! Thank you:thumbs: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 Fair play to the OP. He's got a Skyline which gives him plenty of power, and also plenty of grief! Now he wants an N/A for stress-free driving fun. He wants to make it a bit more fun to drive by doing a BPU upgrade and showing us what he's doing (It's his car and he wants to share his Supe build, just like the rest of us) and all people keep going on about is bhp numbers and proof of mroe power?! He's already said he's not after figures, just a better driving experience! It's obvious a Turbo set up will see more power than what any n/a could accomplish at a fraction of the cost. Not only has it been covered time and time again, but isn't it obvious?! I love BPUing n/a's, it makes them more fun, and aslong as you know you're not going to see any dramatic increases in power, then it's all good fun! Just let the guy get on with his build and enjoy his Supe without people shouting about how good TT set ups are and wanting dyno figures off him. Whatever happened to 'each ot their own'? No one is knocking the guy for trying, but you've missed the entire point of throwing good money after bad. Spanking nearly a grand on an NA and getting near zero performance increase along with inevitable reliability issues is not a good spend. If the guy wants reliable performance, then stock TT is the only way to go. It's cheap to do, has uber reliabilty and costs no more to run. If the NA performance is okay then leave the thing alone rather than waste money on useless changes. Maybe I'm just being too logical about this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobSheffield Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 Just let the guy get on with his build and enjoy his Supe without people shouting about how good TT set ups are and wanting dyno figures off him. Whatever happened to 'each ot their own'? Each to their own is super. The problem is that this guy is saying how he has 'BPU'd an NA, which will lead many of the younger members to believe in it. Attempt to copy it, and wonder why there isnt much difference. Hence people asking for dyno sheets etc. 'feels faster' isnt much good! If it had been a case of 'just done this stuff cos i was bored and had money burning a hole' that would be fine! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMan Posted July 16, 2009 Author Share Posted July 16, 2009 (edited) OK Got some pics of the car with my phone today First the Injen/HKS hybrid intake Here is a look at the headers, I like the look of them I took a close up of the steering Shft clearance mod here You can see how tight it is even after putting the dent in it. Today on a sharp left turn while gunning it i felt it come into contact slightly, I felt the vibration through the steering wheel. I did it again in a large empty parking lot to see if it would bind the steering ut it doesn't no matter how hard I tried, under WOT with full left lock, basically a doughnut, the vibration was more intense, but i was able to easily turn the steering wheel back to the right, so I leave it alone until I have some other reason to pull the headers and ad another mm or 2 to the Dent, curiously It never touches in a right turn, maybe the 16yr old motor mounts just need replacing. Edited May 6, 2010 by GMan (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMan Posted July 16, 2009 Author Share Posted July 16, 2009 Here is a side by side shot of an identical header next to stock, people on http://www.supraforums.com have shown +14whp with the header alone, Looking at the stock one from a flow and pulse timing perspective I don't doubt it at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 It'll be normal mount flex, the clearance looks very tight indeed. he mounts don't tend to wear so unless you go for a solid mount even new ones won't make any difference (tried it before). Solid mounts are horrible though. The manifold will help peak power but as mentioned will lose you mid range torque. Supraforums HP claims are dubious at best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benkei Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 (edited) People BPU n/a's all the time! I've ONLY just got a turbo'd car, I'm 24 and this is my 6th car! I've had air intakes, exhaust systems, etc on nearly all of my other cars. My Civic Jordan is a great example of BPU on an n/a. I had a K&N panel filter in the original air box, removed the resonators for better intake air flow (and sound ) had a full Spoon exhaust system and de-cat, and I could play with EP3's all day long. I wasn't making 200bhp, the B16 only makes 160bhp, and BPU will see maybe 10bhp more? But the car felt more alive, it wasn't restricted anymore, and it WAS faster. Put it next to a turbo'd car and it wouldn't stand a chance, but by no means was it a slouch. It was fun to drive and could beat nearly any car in it's class. Just because the Supra is available in TT, doesn't mean that's the only way to go... Why would Toyota have bothered with an n/a version if the TT is so much better? An yeh Homer, I completely understand your point, it's a grand gone on about 5-10bhp, but what reliability issues will arise from a little more air in the engine? I's a strong engine, I'm sure any BPU mod will be no problem for the block to handle. After all, the TT's can hold another 100bhp easy, right? What's 10bhp on an n/a? Not gasket blowing power is it? Edited July 16, 2009 by benkei (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMan Posted July 16, 2009 Author Share Posted July 16, 2009 Here are some pics of the exhaust system installed, the pipe sicks out a bit from the bumper which is good, I always think it looks bad to see a nice car's rear bumper covered in soot due to a too short tip, It has a nice OBX-R etching on it that looks good and lets people who know a bit about exhausts, know I'm running a bargain exhaust system:) ground clearance was only slightly affected Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 People BPU n/a's all the time! I've ONLY just got a turbo'd car, I'm 24 and this is my 6th car! I've had air intakes, exhaust systems, etc on nearly all of my other cars. My Civic Jordan is a great example of BPU on an n/a. I had a K&N panel filter in the original air box, removed the resonators for better intake air flow (and sound ) had a full Spoon exhaust system and de-cat, and I could play with EP3's all day long. I wasn't making 200bhp, the B16 only makes 160bhp, and BPU will see maybe 10bhp more? But the car felt more alive, it wasn't restricted anymore, and it WAS faster. Put it next to a turbo'd car and it wouldn't stand a chance, but by no means was it a slouch. It was fun to drive and could beat nearly any car in it's class. Just because the Supra is available in TT, doesn't mean that's the only way to go... Why would Toyota have bothered with an n/a version if the TT is so much better? An yeh Homer, I completely understand your point, it's a grand gone on about 5-10bhp, but what reliability issues will arise from a little more air in the engine? I's a strong engine, I'm sure any BPU mod will be no problem for the block to handle. After all, the TT's can hold another 100bhp easy, right? What's 10bhp on an n/a? Not gasket blowing power is it? BPU/stage 1 is a term used for turbo cars. No such defintion of modifications exists for the NA - and for good reason. Changing filters to some ebay tat and killing a shed load of torque is not a modification that is advisable or recommended. There are ways to go about power increases, there are ways not to go about them. Modifying and NA is the latter. It's expensive and pointless. There are far better areas to spend the hard earned to make the car quicker - geometry, decent pads, tyre's, etc. They will make a far, far greater difference to the car then some measily 10bhp increase at the last thousand rpm. This has been covered again, again and again on here over the last 8 years or so. So far every one has either given up, gone TT, or just plain moved on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 Any assuming its all stock stuff coming off there is quite a weight saving too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 Any assuming its all stock stuff coming off there is quite a weight saving too. 4.8kg to be exact. Not a lot, but every little helps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benkei Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 I've always refered to basic breathing mods on a n/a as 'stage 1'. They're the basic mods required ot help performance. Anytihng after that involves cams and such, which is where it starts getting very expensive, and I've never been able to justify the cost to the gains. Good discs and pads are a must, on both n/as and turbos alike. Going fast is great, but being able to stop is better. Same with tyres, you need ot be stuck to the road in order for your brakes to be most effective. I've never used Ebay specials as I belive that you get what you pay for, They're cheap for a reason, and engine's are expensive. And torque never bothered me too much... It's a Honda, they don't have any to start with Granted, modifications on turbos are a lot more noticable, and power does come a lot easier, due to the turbo, but n/as still have their place, and a good breathing set up does help. The OP seems to be happier with his mods, so all is good. As long as moddifications are available for n/as, people will buy them. Back to the OP - liking the mods so far, the exhaust looks nice would like to see it from a higher angle though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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