jevansio Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Well I reported last year that when I had the housing off my turbo the turbine was showing signs of the blades being nibbled. The turbo was performing fine though. Today when I came home from work the usual DBB winding down sound had a little ryythm to it. I took the cone filter off to spin the shaft, sure enough it's catching (it appears to be on the cold side too). I'll have to wait & see what lies inside the hot side. I also don't think I'll be getting another one of these, I know I didn't buy from Garrett but I don't think I could stomach getting another one and having the same happen. So I guess the choice is T67, or do I take the opportunity to go bigger (although at the moment I feel the power the GT4088R was putting out was enough). Any other turbo choice opinions welcome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vvteye Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 I have a 4088dbb so am obviously alarmed by this news. I am sure that mine was sourced direct from Garrett so my fingers will remain crossed. I am a litle confused by your cone filter and wondered if this has the potential of letting small particles through to the blades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Sp71dbb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 i went fom 4088r to t67 on the .8? housing and i prefer it tbh.. especially in the fact there are lots of them around that take a lot of abuse and don't die!!! sorry to hear... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted May 13, 2009 Author Share Posted May 13, 2009 I have a 4088dbb so am obviously alarmed by this news. I am sure that mine was sourced direct from Garrett so my fingers will remain crossed. I am a litle confused by your cone filter and wondered if this has the potential of letting small particles through to the blades. It's been coming for a while, maybe the 1.6 BAR killed it, I do give it some abuse but I let it warm up & cool down fully. I took the filter off just so I could spin the turbo with my hand to see if the noise I was hearing was coming from the turbo & to see if it spun freely I don't run without a filter normally Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted May 13, 2009 Author Share Posted May 13, 2009 i went fom 4088r to t67 on the .8? housing and i prefer it tbh.. especially in the fact there are lots of them around that take a lot of abuse and don't die!!! sorry to hear... Yeah T67 is the logical choice, do you run a divided manifold? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 If the cold side turbine is catching, i would be inclined to say that its down to the wear in the bearings, as even if the exhaust turbine is fooked it wouldn't cause any problems with cold side turbine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted May 13, 2009 Author Share Posted May 13, 2009 If the exhaust side was out of balance (due to blades having different amount of wear) could that cause premature bearing failure? Also sometimes it spins freely & others it catches, there is def more free play in the shaft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 do you run a divided manifold? no, I went for '63 housing initially and it was asthmatic + hot, and the larger, divided housing laggy and sluggish, the '86? single was by far the best. I had a divided manifold on the 4088r as well, but the bl manifold runs a single wastegate so the two sides were linked anyway, i think it's a bit of a gimmick tbh. Only ever had negative opionions of the larger divided manifolds. the biggest improvement for me was the installation of a cast manifold, spool and throttle response are much better and flat out I can tell no difference, but if there is a flow difference the early spool and bigger powerband would have made the car long gone anyway! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 If the exhaust side was out of balance (due to blades having different amount of wear) could that cause premature bearing failure? Also sometimes it spins freely & others it catches, there is def more free play in the shaft probably.. apparently the housings sound like the culprits, and if you had a failure somewhere it is bound to put the turbine out of balance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 If the exhaust side was out of balance (due to blades having different amount of wear) could that cause premature bearing failure? Also sometimes it spins freely & others it catches, there is def more free play in the shaft Guess it would if its been doing it for a little while, think i have asked you before, what sort of EGTs are you seeing and where is the sensor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted May 13, 2009 Author Share Posted May 13, 2009 EGT's are no higher than 900 upto to 4th, 925 in 5th and 950 in 6th (although the amount of times you can hold it in 6th is negligible), sensor is in the turbine housing so those are the temps the turbine is seeing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted May 13, 2009 Author Share Posted May 13, 2009 What are peoples thoughts on the GT4094R? +ve's are it should perform very similar to the current turbo with a bit extra grunt, should be a same swap (same inlets/outlets on compressor & turbine), -ve's is it going to go the same way as the 4088R? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 What are peoples thoughts on the GT4094R? +ve's are it should perform very similar to the current turbo with a bit extra grunt, should be a same swap (same inlets/outlets on compressor & turbine), -ve's is it going to go the same way as the 4088R? Steve has the GT4094R on his motor at the moment, he pulled 682hp at SRR at the dyno day Bit laggy compared to a T67 or 4088. Have you not given any thought to the newer BL billet units or an extended tip BW unit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 EGT's are no higher than 900 upto to 4th, 925 in 5th and 950 in 6th (although the amount of times you can hold it in 6th is negligible), sensor is in the turbine housing so those are the temps the turbine is seeing Are those figures after pretty sustained runs, or are the achieved pretty quickly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 EGT's are no higher than 900 upto to 4th, 925 in 5th and 950 in 6th (although the amount of times you can hold it in 6th is negligible), sensor is in the turbine housing so those are the temps the turbine is seeing That's really high.. I saw this on my 4088, quite alarming, and on the t67 it was significantly less, especially with the bigger housings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_have Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 EGT's are no higher than 900 upto to 4th, 925 in 5th and 950 in 6th (although the amount of times you can hold it in 6th is negligible), sensor is in the turbine housing so those are the temps the turbine is seeing That seems high (low silicone pistons melt below this) Highest I've ever seen was 840 (marham straightaway) but usually below 800. Do you use water/meth inj? Have you logged your AITs at those egts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted May 13, 2009 Author Share Posted May 13, 2009 These are after sustained runs, it's only at the top of 5th I see 925 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted May 13, 2009 Author Share Posted May 13, 2009 That's really high.. I saw this on my 4088, quite alarming, and on the t67 it was significantly less, especially with the bigger housings. That seems high (low silicone pistons melt below this) Highest I've ever seen was 840 (marham straightaway) but usually below 800. Do you use water/meth inj? Have you logged your AITs at those egts? I've always seemed to suffer from higher EGT's than others, I could only dream of 840 on a long 6th gear pull. Yip I use pure water injection, AIT's from the AEM are logged at around 20 deg c or less. What else affects EGTs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted May 13, 2009 Author Share Posted May 13, 2009 (edited) Charlie, what size downpipe do you run? Reason I ask is I run 3", Mike runs 4". I'm sure I've read that increasing the dp size can help drop EGT's. I have a 4" setup sat in my garage, I could pop it on when I get going again if it'll make any difference? Am I expecting to much of a 3" setup running 1.6 BAR? Edited May 13, 2009 by jevansio (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted May 13, 2009 Author Share Posted May 13, 2009 Steve has the GT4094R on his motor at the moment, he pulled 682hp at SRR at the dyno day Bit laggy compared to a T67 or 4088. Have you not given any thought to the newer BL billet units or an extended tip BW unit? Cheers Wes, sounds like it may be a step in the wrong direction for me, I'm happy with my power and don't really want any more lag than it's got now. I've not considered any of the newer turbos yet, at the mo I could pretty much do with a quick fix (ie getting a new turbo to drop on without too much agro) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 I've always seemed to suffer from higher EGT's than others, I could only dream of 840 on a long 6th gear pull. Yip I use pure water injection, AIT's from the AEM are logged at around 20 deg c or less. What else affects EGTs? Pretty much everything has an effect on EGTs, although timing, fuelling have the most influence, i would have thought that WI would have a + impact on charge and in cylinder temps and so keep EGTs lower. I don't have the road around here to hold boost for long, but when i have had the chance for a longer run, the highest peak i have seen is 730c, i would be unhappy to see anymore than 850c. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted May 13, 2009 Author Share Posted May 13, 2009 Pretty much everything has an effect on EGTs, although timing, fuelling have the most influence, i would have thought that WI would have a + impact on charge and in cylinder temps and so keep EGTs lower. I don't have the road around here to hold boost for long, but when i have had the chance for a longer run, the highest peak i have seen is 730c, i would be unhappy to see anymore than 850c. Mine runs pretty rich by all accounts top end (over 11.5), I think Ryan preferred to keep it safe than pushing for every ounce of HP. Maybe a bigger WI jet will help (I'm sure I'm not using the biggest of the 3 in the aquamist kit). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_have Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Charlie, what size downpipe do you run? Reason I ask is I run 3", Mike runs 4". I'm sure I've read that increasing the dp size can help drop EGT's. I have a 4" setup sat in my garage, I could pop it on when I get going again if it'll make any difference? Am I expecting to much of a 3" setup running 1.6 BAR? 3" dp and HKS tubular mani. Wonder if your egt gauge is correct (or wether mine is!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michel lane Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 have you tried and tightened the cold side compressor housing , the vibration on the engine may have vibrated the screws loose slightly. i would stick with the 67dbb setup as you are getting to old and your little heart cant manage the pressure anymore.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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