GazzaGSi Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 Morning all, Woke up this morning to find I'd lost a dispute on paypal. I sold a ARC airbox which needed posting to Australia. I offered insurance to the buyer due to the distance but they refused and wanted the cheapest possible method. After 6 weeks the chap opened a dispute as they'd not received it. I supplied postage receipts to paypal and emails stating the buyer did not want it insured or tracked, just the cheapest method. Paypal ruled in his favour and Im now £123 and a ARC airbox out of pocket. This is complete horse plop. They can see I posted it to the buyers request and supply all evidence showing that I have done so yet they go in his favour, I mean WTF! I know it wont make a difference to paypal but I wont be using them again. You'd think that with all these paypal fees etc the buyer & seller are seure for items lost in the post. He paid, but didnt receive it. I received his money and obtained proof of postage yet Im the one that gets screwed over. What a load of fucking bollox shitting piece of fuckin crap service is that. /vbb/images/smilies/bbcode_angry.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike3.0 Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 Sorry to hear that mate, had a similar thing happen to me. Waste of time using paypal its always a gamble... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 That sucks big time, I'd be as p1ssed off as you too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GazzaGSi Posted April 27, 2009 Author Share Posted April 27, 2009 Will try giving them a call, Just gets on my tits that I pay the fees when have too, they're a multi million pound organisation because of the fees yet when the buyer and seller both do their part, its the seller that gets screwed over. Surely it should come out of paypals pot to secure both the buyer and seller either way. Especially with me even providing proof of postage and the buyers emails stating he wanted the cheapest method. Unless if the buyer has done me and has the item but thought he could have best of both worlds as he new paypal would refund him, hence him wanting it untracked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 Was it sent by surface post? If it was it can take many week to get to Australia as it goes by boat. Have you a tracking number for the parcel? If it is lost then you should be able to claim from the postal company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GazzaGSi Posted April 27, 2009 Author Share Posted April 27, 2009 Nic, the buyer didnt want it tracked or insured. Just the cheapest method possible. Yep it went by boat and royal mail state up to 12 weeks for delivery to Australia by boat. I have to wait for acouple more weeks before I can pursue a claim, was sent 27/02/09. But I will only get compensation for upto 100 1st class stamps or the value of the item - whichever is cheapest What annoys me again is that payal have closed the dispute yet the item could still arrive so the buyer will get the refund and the item. I understand if it was past 12 weeks and he'd not received it but to complete the process before it even has chance to get to the destination is wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
movistar Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 maybe insisting on the buyer to have insurance if it's to go to the other side of the world...you live and learn i guess, life can be a bitch sometimes and it always hits the kind and helpfull imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Multics Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 I had the exact experiance but with someone in Ireland, paypal did the same thing. I was sooo wound up but there was nothing I could do. I learnt my lesson and I refuse to send anything of value by normal post, at the end of the day it's the buyer who's paying. You can only rely in his honesty now, so he refunds you when/if the airbox arrives... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 If they've not taken the money back already I would remove your card details from Pay Pal so they cannot debit your account. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GazzaGSi Posted April 27, 2009 Author Share Posted April 27, 2009 maybe insisting on the buyer to have insurance if it's to go to the other side of the world...you live and learn i guess, life can be a bitch sometimes and it always hits the kind and helpfull imo. Will do next time. It was offered on the ebay auction and after he paid I offered it him again but he wasnt fussed. Just the quickest and cheapest way possible as he wasnt in a rush to get it Nic, they decided in his favour this morning. The money was took afew days ago because I paid for an item and to pay for it they cleared the -117.99 first. Been an expensive monday morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt H Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 Hate paypal with a passion. Too lessons to be learned. First; try to aviod paypal. And second, don't send things over seas of such value without tracking Sorry to hear that though, can imagine you're fuming. I'd especially be more fuming if there is a possibility of him getting a refund and your item! :rage: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snooze Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 We must have about one of these threads a week at the moment. Can't believe people are STILL using PayPal..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt H Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 We must have about one of these threads a week at the moment. Can't believe people are STILL using PayPal..... Think the problem is, there aren't any equivelents. Bank transfer is the best, but you have to be careful who you give you details out to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RED_ROCKET Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 m8 if you didnt want to loose out then you should have insured it yourself for more than what it was worth and then you could have claimed it back thats what i would have done when sending that distance, but ive been done several times now so only use it with peeps i know wont rip me off it sucks big time you wont even be able to leave negative feedback Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbleapple Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 If they've not taken the money back already I would remove your card details from Pay Pal so they cannot debit your account. You would be in breach of contract for doing so and they would legally be able to claim the money through debt recovery/court (and I know from 1st hand experience that they do). Simply rule I use on eBay. If it is over £32 (standard RM insurance) then they pay for insurance cover. You must be able to prove receipt (not postage) to defend a paypal charge back. Simple rule. Think the problem is, there aren't any equivelents. Bank transfer is the best, but you have to be careful who you give you details out to. As a buyer you woudl be mad to use bank transfer.... no guarantee or come back the seller will post the item. Nochex, moneygram etc all have ways to commit fraud so dont touch those. I have used paypal in over 150 transactions this month alone... it si perfectly safe if you live by the simple rule.... over £32 then it goes insured. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamanC Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 Insure it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keener Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 I had the exact same thing happen with an item I sold on ebay. The buyer gave me the wrong address then blamed me for her not getting it! It had a return address but has not come back to me after several weeks. She opened a PayPal dispute and, as it was a low cost item, it was sent normal mail - not tracked - so I could only supply proof of posting rather than proof of delivery. Therefor,as you've experienced, PayPal ruled in her favour and she got her refund. I had a go at PayPal and said it's ridiculous that she could have received the item (for all I know) and got her money back. They agreed and told me that that actually happens fairly often!! Nothing I could do except make sure all items are tracked in the future. However, I did file an 'Unpaid item' claim against her through Ebay. She of course denied it but, as the seller, it's up to me if I leave it or not. Of course I'll leave it unless she can prove she hasn't got the item I sent her! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 Got screwed with this a few weeks back. Exactly the same, i only have the buyers word that he didn't receive it. Never ever send anything un-recorded. I certainly won't be from now on, everything gets insured for its value too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p3te Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 whats the safest way of paying? ive only ever used paypal for buying and selling online Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 whats the safest way of paying? ive only ever used paypal for buying and selling online Cash in hand, bank transfer, cheque (once cleared), etc etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scubaman Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 the thing with paypal (as I have found out the hard way myself) is you are only protected as a seller if you: a) send the item so a signature is required and b) ONLY send to verified addresses. If you do this you wil always be covered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbleapple Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 Cash in hand, bank transfer, cheque (once cleared), etc etc Is that a joke? As a buyer if you send cash, cheque or bank transfer you have no guarantee of the seller sending the item and no come back if they don't. As a seller you are not allowed to accept cash on eBay. Cheques and bank transfers are common in fraud... Cheques if it clears is ok but there is a trick cheques between banks Paypal is safe... How hard is it to send something recorded... It costs 60p more. As a buyer you are laughing as Paypal always supports you as otherwise the credit card company will take it from Paypal anyway Word of advice 2.... Don't take Paypal and allow them to pick up.... No way to prove re buyer recieved the goods... Signing paper etc isn't enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted April 27, 2009 Share Posted April 27, 2009 Is that a joke? As a buyer if you send cash, cheque or bank transfer you have no guarantee of the seller sending the item and no come back if they don't. As a seller you are not allowed to accept cash on eBay. Cheques and bank transfers are common in fraud... Cheques if it clears is ok but there is a trick cheques between banks Paypal is safe... How hard is it to send something recorded... It costs 60p more. As a buyer you are laughing as Paypal always supports you as otherwise the credit card company will take it from Paypal anyway Word of advice 2.... Don't take Paypal and allow them to pick up.... No way to prove re buyer recieved the goods... Signing paper etc isn't enough Nope, there are lots of items on ebay, such as cars, that have to be paid on collection. Whether thats the right way to go about it or not its still the safest way. I use paypal all the time, the person asked what the safest way was.... simple... cash. Bank transfer's are fine also. To get scammed with a cheque nowadays you would need to be really dumb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GazzaGSi Posted April 27, 2009 Author Share Posted April 27, 2009 Paypal is safe... How hard is it to send something recorded... It costs 60p more. Unfortunately it wasnt quite that cheap to Australia. It was £27 and afew pence insured and tracked or £9.73 the way I sent it. Obviously looking I wish I'd of paid the extra out of my pocket but the buyer insisted the cheaper way was fine as he was in no rush for it. Ive done afew game swaps on here and all have been sent 1st class recorded. Like wise with ones Ive received. But when there's nearly £20 extra for tracking and a signature I know alot would take the cheaper route. Lesson learned anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbleapple Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 Nope, there are lots of items on ebay, such as cars, that have to be paid on collection. Only on eBay Motors... not eBay. You get your listings cancelled for stating that you accept 'cash'. I have had it done to me a few times on eBay. the person asked what the safest way was.... simple... cash. . Again on eBay Motors when you are buying face to face... not on eBay or if (like some idiots still do with me) sending cash through the post. Bank transfer's are fine also. . If you are a buyer what security do you have? To get scammed with a cheque nowadays you would need to be really dumb. Really? You know difference it takes a HSBC to HSBC cheque to clear compared to a Barclays to HSBC cheque? BIG difference. Also, if you bank with HSBC listen to their disclaimer on the phones the next time you ask them when a cheque will clear..... the statement goes along the lines of 'cheques are available of credit and interest purposes within 7 working days although a cheque could bounce at any time'..... Scott I'm sounding like an arse with the above... no insult is intended... simply trying to point out that none of the above methods are safe and so long as you know what you are doing with Paypal it's pretty idiot proof. THe buyer pays for postage so if they wont pay then they dont get the item. Simple And yes I realise it is different for eBay Motors and picking an item up (which the initial post wasn't about picking the item up) Unfortunately it wasnt quite that cheap to Australia. It was £27 and afew pence insured and tracked or £9.73 the way I sent it. Obviously looking I wish I'd of paid the extra out of my pocket but the buyer insisted the cheaper way was fine as he was in no rush for it.: Yer the 60p is for UK postage. Lesson learned anyway. Sadly for you mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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