imi Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Despite I reckon that is what people want from police.... I've not paid ANY attention to the G20 riot stuff so I have no clue on the events. And yet Police once again seem to get a kicking whether they do something or not and yet people will bitch and moan about them for being/not being somewhere. If people disagree soo wildly with the police why not join up and try implement changes from the inside? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Despite And yet Blimey, I need to draw pictures... I've not paid ANY attention to the G20 riot stuff so I have no clue on the events. I.... don't.... watch.... the.... news.... so.... I.... don't..... know.... the..... full..... details.... on.... what.... has.... happened..... (Was that slow enough).. Police once again seem to get a kicking whether they do something or not and yet people will bitch and moan about them for being/not being somewhere. If people disagree soo wildly with the police why not join up and try implement changes from the inside? The police in general seem to get more negative press than positive press even here in this thread. Since they are always so wrong why don't people join the police and then they can either understand the point of view or attempt to change it.. The two statements are not joined and I fail to understand your post, would you care to explain it in detail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supra_aero Posted April 15, 2009 Author Share Posted April 15, 2009 Police once again seem to get a kicking whether they do something or not and yet people will bitch and moan about them for being/not being somewhere. There is a lot of truth in that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 I hope they're doing all they can to get to the bottom of this. I definitely wouldn't like to see a member of my own family being treated like that it's quite horrible to watch especially as he's now dead. If a member of my family was on the "march" I'd beat them myself Good to see the police doing more than sitting in a car or writing in a notebook beside some harassed motorist, IMHO Quasi riots are not the ideal day out for people with dicky tickers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extendor Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 If they were on the march and intent on expressing their opinion in a law adiding way why would you want to oppress them. Personally I think you should applaud them for at least getting off their behinds and taking part in politics. More people need to get involved IMO Without people getting involved we have a dictatorship and not a democracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 I spoke to a policeman in London on Friday. He was very helpful and I never felt intimidated by him. I was a bit disturbed when he took a bite of a Kitten Burger though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Class One Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Personally I think you should applaud them for at least getting off their behinds and taking part in politics. I didn't realise Politics involved acts of violence and destroying property. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 I didn't realise Politics involved acts of violence and destroying property. See also United States foreign policy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 I didn't realise Politics involved acts of violence and destroying property. You're joking, surely? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extendor Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 I didn't realise Politics involved acts of violence and destroying property. It does not. I never said that and would NEVER condone that either. Peaceful protest is one thing but acts of violence (from whichever side) are abhorrent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbloodyturbo Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Growing up in NI I follow the rule of thumb that is as follows, 'if your not on the street, you can't get hurt'. If the police tell you to stay back or to get off the street then you do it, you don't argue or give them abuse, you just do as your told and if you don't, you take the bloody consequences. Too many people take their freedom for granted and protesters turning protests into what are essentially riots and then complaining because the police hit them is just one example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 The police in general seem to get more negative press than positive press even here in this thread. Since they are always so wrong why don't people join the police and then they can either understand the point of view or attempt to change it.. Your statement is riddled with speculation and by your own admission you haven't got a clue about this particular incident and yet choose to spout your flippant comment. Basically.....Shut Up. Hope that is clear enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Your statement is riddled with speculation and by your own admission you haven't got a clue about this particular incident and yet choose to spout your flippant comment. Basically.....Shut Up. Hope that is clear enough Hmmm, so in your bid for freedom of speech, you are imposing your views on me and attempting to silence me from making my views known? That is a hell of a contradiction in itself. I will reject your request for silence in the interest of a balanced discussion and stand by my opinions, that police for good and bad are required, however they are in a no win situation. If they stand by and let certain acts take place then they are ineffective however when they do act they are oppressive. Seems to me to be a case of jumping on the bandwagon without a larger field of view. I stated that I didn't follow the G20 protests and that I am not fully informed of what occurred, outside of the media coverage, do you have a more informed statement of facts that you would like to share that will provide a concrete basis for your opinion, or perhaps you were present on either side (police or protesters) when the events occured, if not then you are speculating as much as anybody else. You yourself have commented in the past on the one sided view of the media, or does that point not stand valid for this PARTICULAR incident? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supra_aero Posted April 15, 2009 Author Share Posted April 15, 2009 imi he is talking about in general though,.. I quite enjoy these debates personally as often many things come to light which the media may omit (deliberately or otherwise). Let's not get aggressive and spoil it. Did they show the footage of this female protestor who was attacked? I have only heard about it on radio. It's strange it only came to light now though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Think you need to calm down and think before you type and read before you reply. Most of your latest post was fairly irrelevant and I dont want to be drawn out in a tennis match, however just wanted to highlight the following... Hmmm, so in your bid for freedom of speech, you are imposing your views on me and attempting to silence me from making my views known? That is a hell of a contradiction in itself. I will reject your request for silence in the interest of a balanced discussion and stand by my opinions, that police for good and bad are required, however they are in a no win situation. If they stand by and let certain acts take place then they are ineffective however when they do act they are oppressive. Seems to me to be a case of jumping on the bandwagon without a larger field of view. I stated that I didn't follow the G20 protests and that I am not fully informed of what occurred, outside of the media coverage, do you have a more informed statement of facts that you would like to share that will provide a concrete basis for your opinion, or perhaps you were present on either side (police or protesters) when the events occured, if not then you are speculating as much as anybody else. You yourself have commented in the past on the one sided view of the media, or does that point not stand valid for this PARTICULAR incident? Allow me to refresh your short memory. I've not paid ANY attention to the G20 riot stuff so I have no clue on the events. If it still doesnt make sense and you still are imagining a contradiction, then no worries - have a drink on me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Think you need to calm down and think before you type and read before you reply. I am perfectly calm Most of your latest post was fairly irrelevant and I dont want to be drawn out in a tennis match, however just wanted to highlight the following... Allow me to refresh your short memory. You seem to need to resort to insults in order to make a point these days, without basis. IN YOUR opinion my post was irrelevant, however there will be some people who find something of interest or is it a case of my opinion is wrong because it differs to yours? Not paying attention to something does not indicate being an ostrich and putting my head in the sand, there are still some bits of information that filter through. I personally am capable of taking information in without necessarily focussing on it. In that case I will apologise for my statement and perhaps the misuse of the word ANY. If it still doesnt make sense and you still are imagining a contradiction, then no worries - have a drink on me No thanks do you have a more informed statement of facts that you would like to share that will provide a concrete basis for your opinion, or perhaps you were present on either side (police or protesters) when the events occured, if not then you are speculating as much as anybody else. I did notice you didn't not provide an answer for this, I'm not assuming either which way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 EDIT - no point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creative Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 I still stand by what I put ealier in this thread... (no not that i was bowing out! lol) peaceful protests are one thing and I think they are an excellent way for the general public to make a stand... but at what point is it ok to turn up dressed.... http://www.independent.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00158/g20masked_158781s.jpg http://www.hararetribune.com/images/stories/World/Americas_EU/g20protest.jpg Do this.... http://bristol.indymedia.org/cache/imagecache/local/attachments/apr2009/460_0___30_0_0_0_0_0_rbs_bank_photo.jpg and what about these guys....do we hear anything about these chaps ... http://a.abcnews.com/images/International/nm_G20_Protests2_090402_ssh.jpg there will be many sides to many questions and I dont pretend to know what tactics the police are taught... but what I saw and in my opinion... those that wanted to take part were dealt with appropriately. No I wouldnt have wanted to be set about by the police but in the same note I wouldnt have been anywhere near it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extendor Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 imi he is talking about in general though,.. I quite enjoy these debates personally as often many things come to light which the media may omit (deliberately or otherwise). Let's not get aggressive and spoil it. Did they show the footage of this female protestor who was attacked? I have only heard about it on radio. It's strange it only came to light now though. http://uk.news.yahoo.com/4/20090414/...e-49bfa63.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 I still stand by what I put ealier in this thread... (no not that i was bowing out! lol) peaceful protests are one thing and I think they are an excellent way for the general public to make a stand... but at what point is it ok to turn up dressed.... http://www.independent.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00158/g20masked_158781s.jpg http://www.hararetribune.com/images/stories/World/Americas_EU/g20protest.jpg http://img.timeinc.net/time/daily/2009/0904/masks_g20_0401.jpg Do this.... http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/04/03/article-1167050-0438BFBC000005DC-354_468x310.jpg http://bristol.indymedia.org/cache/imagecache/local/attachments/apr2009/460_0___30_0_0_0_0_0_rbs_bank_photo.jpg and what about these guys....do we hear anything about these chaps ... http://therearenosunglasses.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/g20-protests-g20-protests-015.jpg http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/45623000/jpg/_45623782_injured_police_man.jpg http://a.abcnews.com/images/International/nm_G20_Protests2_090402_ssh.jpg there will be many sides to many questions and I dont pretend to know what tactics the police are taught... but what I saw and in my opinion... those that wanted to take part were dealt with appropriately. No I wouldnt have wanted to be set about by the police but in the same note I wouldnt have been anywhere near it... Boy, that does look nasty. Seems like they are there to cause trouble and some did. Doesnt seem like the guy who ended up dying was part of the same group, certainly wasnt even dressed this way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supra_aero Posted April 15, 2009 Author Share Posted April 15, 2009 http://uk.news.yahoo.com/4/20090414/...e-49bfa63.html thanks the link didn't work but on looking at your article I managed to find this one. http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2009/apr/15/g20-police-tomlinson-vigil She did prevoke the cop to be honest but he did use a heavy hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creative Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Boy, that does look nasty. Seems like they are there to cause trouble and some did. Doesnt seem like the guy who ended up dying was part of the same group, certainly wasnt even dressed this way. but he was there and he didnt do as he was told by riot police... I know I bloody well would! It was unfortunate that he had a weak heart... did he know this? was he on meds for it? we will never know. Through all of this I have sat on the fence about what people have done and how the police reacted but not one person has said at what point it is right to turn up and smash things.... at that point the police should be within their rights to use any force necessary... suppose I should put the obligatory "in my opinion" line Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 thanks the link didn't work but on looking at your article I managed to find this one. http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2009/apr/15/g20-police-tomlinson-vigil She did prevoke the cop to be honest but he did use a heavy hand. Hmmm, nice language and she was definitely behaving in an aggressive manner, and she also uses physical force on the officer, with so many people around how is he to know that she didn't have a weapon of sorts? (in my opinion of course) As an alternative point of view here (wouldn't want anyone to get the wrong idea ), it may have been dealt with sooner in the manner which it was rather than let it escalate like it MAY have into a more aggressive riot. Hindsight is a wonderful thing which people like to hang on to in order to explain unpleasant situations. For example and this is hypothetical of course (again for those who may mistake this as fact) if the police did nothing and it escalated into a violent mass causing widespread destruction would people perhaps be complaining about the ineffectiveness of the police force? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extendor Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Excellent point Creative. Its a two sided coin. In some respects you could identify the uniform of a rogue by their desire to hide their identity. I hate to draw a parellel to your point but we must also consider that the copper who belted Mr Tomlinson also disguised his face and his shoulder number was missing. Is that not the same as the images you have selected. As for the coppers who got hurt. I despise the people that did that. The coin does have two sides and it is not acceptable to do that to anyone - in uniform or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creative Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Excellent point Creative. Its a two sided coin. In some respects you could identify the uniform of a rogue by their desire to hide their identity. I hate to draw a parellel to your point but we must also consider that the copper who belted Mr Tomlinson also disguised his face and his shoulder number was missing. Is that not the same as the images you have selected. As for the coppers who got hurt. I despise the people that did that. The coin does have two sides and it is not acceptable to do that to anyone - in uniform or not. for once I agree with you... but to throw it back did the officer remove his numbers or had he already been involved in an altercation and had them pulled off? as gav said.. hindsight is a wonderful thing, and yes I did choose particular images but I think they put my "personal" views across as I can be crap with words sometimes! lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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