America refuse bail out

[extendor]

If you went tits up how many people would be affected?

 

Obviously not as many as if a bank went tits up but it would affect some very important people such as my family and the families of the people who work for me and the business' who supply me etc etc. The knock on would not cause the earth to crumble.

 

My problem is that I feel seriously overtaxed and under served as it is. The long term projection of this situation is that the government will have no choice but to cut services and put taxes up. In my opinion we are probably bankrupt as a nation at this point anyway. Therefore my and your present situation will only get worse. As to whether it will be any worse if we said sod the banks I have my doubts. I dont trust anything the government or banks do as they do it for themselves and I doubt this is bale out is about protecting your average guy on the street.

[Gazboy]

oh thats cleared that up then

 

Ok, people lose jobs, houses, companies fold.

 

If you were to really ramp up the doom and gloom it could start a war.

[tbourner]

Surely they would decrease as it's hard enough trying to get credit for a house at the moment with lenders being a lot more scrupulous, plus an interest decrease would help encourage spending at a time where business' are feeling the pinch of customers with less money

 

I don't think it's as easy as the gov. writing down a different number in a box, they can't decide what interest rates should be (AFAIK), it changes depending on a lot of factors. They can influence where it goes, and I believe to make it go down they need to stop wages going up amongst other things.

[AndrewOW]

this is the thing all areas of spend you can justify, not everyone agrees or is happy with what its spent on but thats life/tax...........

 

...........to me its not immediately obvious what the justification is for these bail outs, its often quoted that it would be far worse if they didn't do it but no one really goes into the detail of 'worse'

 

oh thats cleared that up then

 

 

I'm with you on this point.

[Charlotte]

Ok, people lose jobs, houses, companies fold.

 

If you were to really ramp up the doom and gloom it could start a war.

 

I think people in this thread need to stop spouting and listen to Gaz, so far he's the only person to talk complete sense.

[AndrewOW]

I run a business and have done for the best part of twenty years. If I was to tits up who would bail me out. However, when I get a debtor go tits up on me no one helps me out. Why is there one rule for the small average Guy and another rule for the big rich guy?

 

 

I assume its a company based on evil? Are you trying to take over the world, per chance?

[extendor]

I think people in this thread need to stop spouting and listen to Gaz, so far he's the only person to talk complete sense.

 

Sorry Charlotte but that is just generalisation. What about specifics. Why do we specifically have to bale out the banks in this instance and how does that compare to doing nothing.

[extendor]

I assume its a company based on evil? Are you trying to take over the world, per chance?

 

 

A very nice company with very nice people muuuuhhhhaahhaaa

[Charlotte]

Sorry Charlotte but that is just generalisation. What about specifics. Why do we specifically have to bale out the banks in this instance and how does that compare to doing nothing.

 

In an ideal world the FSA should have been governing the way they were supposed to and this wouldn't have happened. But that hasn't happened so a fall back plan has to be adopted surely?

[Gaz6002]

I think people in this thread need to stop spouting and listen to Gaz, so far he's the only person to talk complete sense.

 

Yup, she's right. I've not got the time to back up what Gazboy is saying right now but I agree 100%. It's easy to make a judgement when people's understanding isn't based upon the whole truth and harder to defend a point that is true but not convenient.

[Gazboy]

Sorry Charlotte but that is just generalisation. What about specifics. Why do we specifically have to bale out the banks in this instance and how does that compare to doing nothing.

 

 

95% of the population of this island deal with the banking system one way or another. If Bank A goes under it takes with it all it's employees, the mortgage book, peoples savings, pensions etc. If Bank A has borrowed off Bank B then that too is at risk of losing money, and the whole cycle repeats.

 

Indirectly people have no confidence and are not spending their money incase they need it for other things, MFI, Rosebys, Pendragon & Woolworths have either gone under, been bought out or are on the brink, they too have employees who are also hoarding money.

 

How many 58 registration plates have you seen this month?

[extendor]

I dont understand. The government is stopping wages going up yet proposing a long term strategy that will cap wages and increase taxation with corresponding cuts in services. Many people I know work as Civil servants and are effectively on minimum wage with no promise of a useful wage rise. The poorly paid are taxed into oblivion and the rest of us continually tighten our belts whilst the government waste counless millions of idiotic schemes and consultations.

 

How can we sustain all this. We are bankrupt and GB Ltd is circling the plug hole. IMHO you cannot continually 'rob Peter to pay Paul' and a better fix has to be found.

[Gazboy]

That is pretty much what Osbourne said yesterday and what countless commentators have been saying for years- why is the UK bankrupt, it f**king shouldn't be with the amount of tax we pay though the "Welfare Culture" hasn't helped.

[Gaz6002]

I dont understand.

 

How can we sustain all this. We are bankrupt and GB Ltd is circling the plug hole. IMHO you cannot continually 'rob Peter to pay Paul' and a better fix has to be found.

 

How's about a nice big dollop of dictatorship? Maybe a sprinkle of martial law? What do you suggest?

[caseys]

How's about a nice big dollop of dictatorship? Maybe a sprinkle of martial law? What do you suggest?

 

Would you look good in a peaked cap? (and I'm not talking about the kind with leather and studs..)

 

I'm wondering when people are going to start talking about hyper-inflation akin to Zimbabwe

 

After all, the base rate set by the bank of england seems to be totally irrelevant to the inter-bank lending rate currently.

[MrRalphMan]

Communism? That worked for Russia didn't it?

[extendor]

How's about a nice big dollop of dictatorship? Maybe a sprinkle of martial law? What do you suggest?

 

 

Dead easy - do away with the olympics, close the borders, get all the tax back from those in the black market, check the credentials of everyone claiming benefit/NHS, get speeding fines from foreign motorists, scrap the idiotic consultancy schemes, cap MP's expenses etc etc . How long have you got. Why not make a few suggestions of your own which will save us all money.

[Gaz6002]

Dead easy - do away with the olympics, close the borders, get all the tax back from those in the black market, check the credentials of everyone claiming benefit/NHS, get speeding fines from foreign motorists, scrap the idiotic consultancy schemes, cap MP's expenses etc etc . How long have you got. Why not make a few suggestions of your own which will save us all money.

 

Who said I need to save money? The profession I'm in isn't exactly directly related to the credit crunch and I'm not feeling it personally. If you mean the government, I'll leave you safe in the knowledge that it really isn't as simple as you make out.

[TTRickeh]

I don't think it's as easy as the gov. writing down a different number in a box, they can't decide what interest rates should be (AFAIK), it changes depending on a lot of factors. They can influence where it goes, and I believe to make it go down they need to stop wages going up amongst other things.

 

Well yeah it's not the gov it's the BofE. I had a big massive reply, but I don't know all the answers, so it'd pretty much just be a guessing game which, to be honest, I imagine all the 'top economic advisors' are doing too, everyone can't be right. Either way, bail out or not bail out, as always in economics, there will be knock-on effects. Let's just hope everything's done on necessity rather than any sort of political point scoring.

[The Raven]

Wow how the topic has grown.

 

Interesting reading

[extendor]

Apologies to Gaz6002. Sorry for my tone it was not written as it now sounds when read back.

 

Yes the situation is over simplified and I have only taken a conveniently small part as my rant. I do not see an easy way out of this and it really is a choice of the frying in the Pan or the Fire at the present. What we need is innovative solutions and solutions which do not affect the ordinary guy. Seriously, if we were to collect the taxes that were due and should be paid and we stopped waste at all levels we should have enough. An earlier post said about Why were we so hard up after all these years of paying NI/PAYE etc etc. Its due to waste. Stop the waste is my suggestion - not peaked caps and jackboots.

[tbourner]

Apparently the government spend more on advertising than any other company except Procter and Gamble!

[Scooter]

Ok, people lose jobs, houses, companies fold.

 

If you were to really ramp up the doom and gloom it could start a war.

 

fair enough, seems like this will happen anyway, but i spose i should just accept that it would be multiples worse without the intervention...................

 

............either way seems like grim times ahead

[3LL]

am i the only one who sees this problem as to large and so far reaching, i cant get my head around all the equations and variables that need to be taken into effect on the impact this will have economically on the whole country..

 

top and bottom i think the only thing anyone can do is what they feel is best for them, at the end of the day in my own personal oppinion a house, a car, a bank account its all things we feel we need and they give us re assurance and comfort in life, but all i need is my family, without them i aint got anything and i love having my little comforts in life but id choose my family anyday.. not tryin t start a huge argument or another debate, im just saying sometimes in life you have to stop and think about the things we all sometimes take for granted are the things that means the most when it comes down to it, money can be replaced, so can homes and cars and all that stuff if god forbid the absolute worse cme to the worst.. but how do you replace the love, support and comfort you get from your family, thats something far more inportant to me.

 

just my own thoughts.

 

anyways, carry on

[ivan]

That idea of the 'merkins to impose a 0.25% tax on all stock exchange dealings sounds like a good start to me. Let them budget for their own mistakes and greed.