Belgium GP *SPOILERS INSIDE*

[Pot]

youre not keeping up.....in that case ferrari got an advantage and hence they were completely entitled to under the rules of the FIA.

 

I'm fully up to speed fella, I'm agreeing with the points posted that the decision is a waste of time... Just adding more valid comments...

 

BTW - It's You're (And probably Ferrari, as they're a name )

[Pot]

in that case ferrari got an advantage and hence they were completely entitled to under the rules of the FIA.

 

I did notice the sarcasm by the way

[jim_supra]

Echoing what others have said I thought the race was brilliant, it's what racing in F1 should always be like, and was so annoyed when the FIA (Ferrari Inclined Association) handed down that stupid penalty.

 

I'm certain that if you opened the F1 rulebook, and scratched back the Tippex, you would have a hard time to find where it says that in that situation you should allow x number of car lengths between yourself and the car you've just allowed to pass and regain the lead, before re-commencing racing.

 

In the conditions at that time LH always had the advantage, which was evident by the fact that he closed down a gap of well over over a second in a matter of turns.

 

Roll on Monza.

[Thorin]

Completely stupid and biased decision by the FIA again. Bah.

[hoff]

Complete joke. They have to over turn that on the appeal:taped:

[Alex]

The precedent was set in 1995 when Fernando was told (in race) to pull over twice. But that was when we had a permanent steward who actually understood racing. Now we have 3 random members of the public loosely connected to motor sport who need 3 hrs to decide anything and then p1ss everyone off later on after the prizes are handed out.

 

The FIA's rules are not clear, consistent or well applied. Racing is measured in milliseconds not decades, decisions need to be quick and consistent - only a full time body of stewards WITH race experience can stop this happening again.

[Alex]

Lets hope for a McLaren 1-2 in Monza (Italy) this coming Sunday

[jim_supra]

Lets hope for a McLaren 1-2 in Monza (Italy) this coming Sunday

 

Yep, I would love to see Ferrari well and truly stuffed on their home race.

[johnny g]

After watching it time and time again, I actually do think it was the right decision.

 

Hamilton outbraked himself and then backed out of the move as Kimi was rightfully defending. He cut across and gained track position, he yielded first place, just but was much closer to Kimi than he ever could have been, had he taken the normal line through Bus Stop.

 

He should have fallen behind, followed him through the hairpin and had him on the straight after Eau Rouge. It's pretty black and white to me - he gained an advantage.

 

The argument back is: He was much quicker than Raikonnen so why not just let him have it? I say if he was that much quicker, he could have picked him off without cutting across the track.

 

The precedent has now been set, though. So, it will be interesting to see how this affects subsequent races, if does at all.

 

Just to say, I'm no racing expert, but have watched F1 since the late 80's and hardly missed a race in that time, I'm a fully-fledge, time-served armchair critic.

[ivan]

One thing that is pretty certain is that Ron knew he was in a tricky situation from the outset.

Why else would he be so aggressive in his interview and why else would he feel the need to brief Lewis on the podium?

 

And why did he feel the need to clarify the legality of the move with Charlie Whiting if it was black and white? He knew the FIA are looking to get the team for any minor discrepancy. Unfortunately, after last year McLaren now have to be whiter than white.

[Alex]

Indeed asking the Race Director does mean they knew it was sailing close to the wind...and he said it was ok...but this is like goals being allowed/disallowed after the event...it just ruins it all.

 

There should be someone (1 person) capable of making snap decisions who can tell Lewis to yield again...

 

I can see that indeed he didn't let Kimi pass by parking up and waiting 10secs to give him a 100m headstart in to the next corner, but where is that in the rules? The position has to be yielded, in the rules, that's all afaik.

[tbourner]

After watching it time and time again, I actually do think it was the right decision.

 

Hamilton outbraked himself and then backed out of the move as Kimi was rightfully defending. He cut across and gained track position, he yielded first place, just but was much closer to Kimi than he ever could have been, had he taken the normal line through Bus Stop.

 

He should have fallen behind, followed him through the hairpin and had him on the straight after Eau Rouge. It's pretty black and white to me - he gained an advantage.

 

Like I said before though, he was almost overtaking Kimi before the incident, had there not been a corner he would have been through, he yielded on the corner (as he should) because Kimi was in front and had the line, so really he only had to give back the position as far as having his right front wheel alongside Kimis left rear - he went further back to the point of coming round to the other side to overtake, he actually gave back MORE than he needed to!!

[johnny g]

Like I said before though, he was almost overtaking Kimi before the incident, had there not been a corner he would have been through, he yielded on the corner (as he should) because Kimi was in front and had the line, so really he only had to give back the position as far as having his right front wheel alongside Kimis left rear - he went further back to the point of coming round to the other side to overtake, he actually gave back MORE than he needed to!!

 

Yes, but he was in a false track position, he would never have been that close if he took the correct exit from Bus Stop.

[hoff]

Yes, but he was in a false track position, he would never have been that close if he took the correct exit from Bus Stop.

 

 

Fair point TBH. The crap thing is that Lewis would surely have got passed very soon after anyway and then none of this would have been an issue.

[jim_supra]

Yes, but he was in a false track position, he would never have been that close if he took the correct exit from Bus Stop.

 

The other way to look at it is that if Hamilton decided not to go for the overtake at the chicane he would have still been able to out-brake Raikonnen due to his cars better handling in those conditions meaning LH could've closed the gap further and gotten right up to the back of KR.

 

Once they'd both cleared the chicane LH would have had the same sort of distance he allowed KR and again with a better performing car been able to overtake KR at the next corner so the nett result will most certainly have been the same.

[Alex]

Indeed - lets face it the problem we have here is that Lewis likes to race and to win...he doesn't have a problem with overtaking and his enthusiasm for getting the job done has left him with a bloody nose. It's not right but I now can't see them winning an appeal.

 

I only hope to god that the FIA look at the system and fix that, as changing the results after the race isn't good - even Massa would agree with that.

[Guest Budz86]

Just registered my vote that this be over-turned, 8350 odd!

 

Can't believe this as imo LH may have gained a slight advantage, which he then gave up before crossing the line. He then over-took through excellent driving and after the tangle with Rosberg proved he was better by re-taking the lead after KR went ahead!!

 

Kimi then lost it, which could have been a big gamble by the FIA race team, sorry Ferrari, as the penalty would have been predicted by them, resulting in the drivers championship being much more within their grasp and easily winnable by a few more 'correct' decisions at a later date (Monza!)

[johnny g]

Once they'd both cleared the chicane LH would have had the same sort of distance he allowed KR and again with a better performing car been able to overtake KR at the next corner so the nett result will most certainly have been the same.

 

I have to disagree, coming out of corner he'd always be a car length later putting the power down, and in such a short straight, he'd never have been able to get him.

 

If he'd kept it neat and tidy though, he'd have nailed him out of Eau Rouge, no problems.

[tbourner]

Yes, but he was in a false track position, he would never have been that close if he took the correct exit from Bus Stop.

 

He would have been close enough, he would have been directly behind him!!

Surely you only have to give back what you've gained?

He tried a move that he shouldn't have, and the result was he went over the run off and gained 'some' position.

Before attempting the move, he was directly behind KR, he had to be to attempt an overtake, so all he would have to give back would be to bring him back behind him.

He proved he had given this much back by going round the back of him.

[johnny g]

He would have been close enough, he would have been directly behind him!!

Surely you only have to give back what you've gained?

He tried a move that he shouldn't have, and the result was he went over the run off and gained 'some' position.

Before attempting the move, he was directly behind KR, he had to be to attempt an overtake, so all he would have to give back would be to bring him back behind him.

He proved he had given this much back by going round the back of him.[/quote

 

As my previous post mate...

 

I have to disagree, coming out of corner he'd always be a car length later putting the power down, and in such a short straight, he'd never have been able to get him.

 

If he'd kept it neat and tidy though, he'd have nailed him out of Eau Rouge, no problems.

[Whitesupraboy2]

its a tricky one, He was closer then he would of been. However if Raikonnen had left enough space they would of been side by side coming out of the corner (the key to remember is they were side by side when Hamilton was forced to cut the chicane). so in reality was him being behind him on the straight infact him giving up the position, id have to say yes otherwise like i say it would of been a drag race down the straight.

[MrRalphMan]

But this isn't like a soop vs a corsa where you can back off and let the other car in front of you then boot it and dissapear.

 

These should be very closely matched cars and by slowing enough to let Kimi in front, he would have been at a disadvantage. To make up that loss in speed like that was amazing.

[Firestorm]

people were missing chicanes all over the shop and didnt get penalised. LH yeilded his position, iirc this happend to him before so he knew what to do. kimi was going slower when he came out because of the weather. lewis gave up the position lifted off and was 6kph slower before passing. stewards are wrong. if it had been a red car this wouldnt be happending. they are making a farce of F1. lets just watch them go round in a organised manner for 2hrs cos they arent approving racing!

[johnny g]

But this isn't like a soop vs a corsa where you can back off and let the other car in front of you then boot it and dissapear.

 

These should be very closely matched cars and by slowing enough to let Kimi in front, he would have been at a disadvantage. To make up that loss in speed like that was amazing.

 

6kmh isn't a lot when you consider he was about 2-3 car lengths ahead of where he should have been.

[tbourner]

coming out of corner he'd always be a car length later putting the power down, and in such a short straight, he'd never have been able to get him.

 

I can't see why this matters, we don't need to worry about what would or could have happened if this and that. He has to yield whatever he gained plain and simple, so what did he gain? I would say the point where the incident began was just before the entry to the corner, where LH was side by side with KR, so that's what he should have given back.