Pabs Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 Hey all, Total N00b here, but from what I understand it is possible to use an Apexi SAFCII to help lean out the AFR's, and thus helping to stop the car from running rich. (RR results, comments from RR operators and people on here when looking at graphs/results) Basically, my car still runs a bit rich, and am trying to learn how this can be resolved. I already have an SAFCII installed in the car (was there when I purchased it) but I've been informed it's all set at 0 across the board (ie doing nothing) I've got the manual, and it's well over my knowledge. It's not really something I want to mess with, but instead have someone who knows what they are doing to look at it. That said - I'd like to know the theory, and how these things work. From the manual, it seems that you can set the correction values for certain RPM's - ??? I'm assuming it'd be trial and error with the right equipment (rolling road perhaps) to get this mapped as such? I'd like to think that once the settings have been achieved, it could then be saved to a data file for backup etc. I'm also likely to think that because each car is different, there is no generic data file that can be loaded on to sort this issue? I have read that a lot of supras run rich at the higher RPM's, and this is better than running lean.... If anyone can help explain, and/or even point me in the direction of someone who'd be good at this sort of thing that'd be great Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pabs Posted June 12, 2008 Author Share Posted June 12, 2008 nobody with any pointers at all?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpie Posted June 12, 2008 Share Posted June 12, 2008 Not a technical reply but... I'm sure you know that most people these days go for the EMB/EMU at this end of the market but, the SAFC was the unit of choice a few years back. So, your looking for one of the more longer standing members here to help you out....if they have not already moved on from this unit. It might be worth paying a couple of hundred to get a tuner to map it for you and they can help you understand it a little more ?? Just one of the traders: http://www.thor-racing.co.uk/Fuel_Controller_Installat-AFC_Install.asp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pabs Posted June 13, 2008 Author Share Posted June 13, 2008 thanks mate. I understand that the SAFC lost popularity for one reason or another - I just have one installed so may as well use it rather than spend money on another device. Hopefully it'll do the same job overall, just not as good as the newer devices I suppose (resolution and such) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 The trouble is without a wideband and a way of data logging whats happening its going to be a long winded and somewhat hit and miss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 I have an SAFC II installed on my car, I got it years ago before the piggyback ECUs were a cost effective alternative. I bought it in the hope that it could be used to lean things a little, get more power, save a bit of fuel - I came away from Thor with slightly more power, fuel added using the SAFC and a note that I needed bigger injectors and an uprated pump to release any more power... erm... OK... odd for a UK. Anyway I should really get the thing set up properly some time so if you do find someone who can give them a quick tweek let me know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kieren1234 Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 I have an SAFC II installed on my car, I got it years ago before the piggyback ECUs were a cost effective alternative. I bought it in the hope that it could be used to lean things a little, get more power, save a bit of fuel - I came away from Thor with slightly more power, fuel added using the SAFC and a note that I needed bigger injectors and an uprated pump to release any more power... erm... OK... odd for a UK. Anyway I should really get the thing set up properly some time so if you do find someone who can give them a quick tweek let me know. Michael, I have a friend that will be able to tweak it as long as you have an AFR guage? He is really good and lives in Rawmarsh, near Rotherham... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 Michael, I have a friend that will be able to tweak it as long as you have an AFR guage? He is really good and lives in Rawmarsh, near Rotherham... I sold the AFR gauge I had but will get a replacement at some point, I didn't like the colour of the lights on the AEM one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pabs Posted June 13, 2008 Author Share Posted June 13, 2008 well, the garage I use said they could do it on their dyno.... All I'm trying to achieve is a decent running car - not rich, not lean, but somewhere between the two. It seems silly having this device on the car with it set to 0, so I would like to utilise it if possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul mac Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 I still have an SAFC 2 controlling my T61, the problem you have is it is not very good at leaning out fueling its good point is adding fuel at the required points, it is a reasonable bit of kit that bridged the gap between a full blown stand alone ecu but has now been very much eclipsed by the e-manage type ecu which is infinately superior, i am now building a new engine and plan to run more boost so the trusty SAFC will be disconected in favour of an e-manage ultimate, my advise would be if you want to cut fuel the SAFC is not the tool of choice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pabs Posted June 14, 2008 Author Share Posted June 14, 2008 but it can do it though, right? The manual and paperwork says it'll adjust + AND -, so it must be able to do it??? Or do I misunderstand - I do not pretend to know squat about this sort of thing.. it's just the way I understand it. I'm not talking bit adjustments here, just a few tiny changes to make it run a bit better. My car isn't THAT bad.... perhaps even within manufacturers specs (I don't know) - I am just trying to achieve the best I possibly can with what I have! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul mac Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 but it can do it though, right? The manual and paperwork says it'll adjust + AND -, so it must be able to do it??? Or do I misunderstand - I do not pretend to know squat about this sort of thing.. it's just the way I understand it. I'm not talking bit adjustments here, just a few tiny changes to make it run a bit better. My car isn't THAT bad.... perhaps even within manufacturers specs (I don't know) - I am just trying to achieve the best I possibly can with what I have! i have never tried to cut fuel with the SAFC but all my research indicated it was not really possible despite what Apexi claimed, maybe someone like Ian C could confirm this but he is a very busy boy with non supra related projects so might be difficult to get hold of Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonball Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 Paul - IMHO do NOT start fiddling with the AFC m8 You should not need to touch the stock fuelling to lean it out Have you changed that FPR yet? Also - I have the stock BOV for you here to put on to make sure that you are not losing boost from the HKS If you need a hand to do this - let me know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pabs Posted June 14, 2008 Author Share Posted June 14, 2008 (edited) Hi Paul, I understand your comments about the AFC - but really don't see why it shouldn't be used unless it really makes things worse??? Yes - FPR is off, brand new stock one on, and MUCH better running and better power figures too. BOV is not leaking... checked that. I'm in a situation now where the car runs still runs a bit rich at higher RPM's, and increasing the boost doesn't give any more power. A few people have said if I can get the AFR's right, it'll run better still and the figures will follow suit. If the AFC is a waste of space, then there is no point in keeping it on the car. Certainly no point with hybrids or a single as most tuners/mappers will want the latest AEM's or standalone solutions instead. Here are my FSE and stock FPR results: http://www.mkivsupra.net/vbb/showthread.php?t=153244&highlight=FSE EDIT: Basically, I'm aiming for an AFR of somewhere around 11 - 11.5 on WOT, rather than the 10.5 ish I currently have. I don't want to run any leaner than that really, as I understand that is where it can start getting a bit dangerous... I also understand that running rich saps a bit of power - if I can sort that then I'm happy. Edited June 14, 2008 by Pabs (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pabs Posted June 14, 2008 Author Share Posted June 14, 2008 Edited post above.... Would an FMIC alter the AFR's? I understand that'll cool the air more, so make it more dense, thus leaning things out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonball Posted June 15, 2008 Share Posted June 15, 2008 Good to see it has an effect - I'll give you a shout later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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