Ewen Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 So you have an unstable condition then Its says so, so I must have:) As my old boss once said... "you maybe the fastest gun in town now, but theres a stagecoach full of fast-draw McGraws heading your way" Or was that John Wayne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kieran Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 LMFAO, kinda warm actually. Go on, tell us! Black is Black, Brown is asian, Yellow is.... kinda obvious?!, whats the main one I missed? Think of bruce lee, manga, and drifting. I see. Orientals then. Yellow just sounds a bit Chubby Brown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 What is your degree in then, Carl? He didn't get his monies worth. Perhaps he should have paid a little more. Did you see the last option in the poll also? Scott =op Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flukey-lukey Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 A good degree in a decent subject- a 3rd in "Victoria Beckham" from some naff uni/college doesn't cut it, a 1st in Law from Oxford has your feet well planted in 'educated'. Wealth- hundred thousand in a current account and some serious money in savings/investments??? (not including equity in property) But why is degree needed in this day and age? Prime example of why you don't need a degree: My sister was/is brainier than me at school work. She did extremely well in her GCSE's, went on to do psychology and a couple of other subjects at college for 3 years, then went on to York Uni studying psychology for a further 3 years. After Uni she found that she couldn't get a well paid job using her degree as she had no experience. catch 22 imo. She now earns circa 14k a year paper pushing in an office and is extremely unhappy. Dead end job. Me on the other hand went to school, did ok in my GCSE's, didn't go to college, didn't go to uni and just worked my way up to where I am today. Extremely happy and earning more than double my sisters salary. I can also better myself in years to come and keep climbing the ladder. Experience counts more than education in todays world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ewen Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 But why is degree needed in this day and age? Thats a whole different can of worms indeed. However, a degree certainly wont guarantee you a rung higher up on the class ladder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazboy Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 But why is degree needed in this day and age? Prime example of why you don't need a degree: My sister was/is brainier than me at school work. She did extremely well in her GCSE's, went on to do psychology and a couple of other subjects at college for 3 years, then went on to York Uni studying psychology for a further 3 years. After Uni she found that she couldn't get a well paid job using her degree as she had no experience. catch 22 imo. She now earns circa 14k a year paper pushing in an office and is extremely unhappy. Dead end job. Me on the other hand went to school, did ok in my GCSE's, didn't go to college, didn't go to uni and just worked my way up to where I am today. Extremely happy and earning more than double my sisters salary. I can also better myself in years to come and keep climbing the ladder. Experience counts more than education in todays world. You asked what "educated" was, not whether it's useful. Did your sister apply for any jobs where her degree was relevant? Some degrees are a skeleton key to open any job- Maths, Sciences and English, Law and medicine very handy too Unfortunately there are too many people doing A levels in psychology, sociology and media studies then going on to get useless mickey mouse degrees that have no relevance to any sort of vocation. A degree in floristry will not get you in the door at an investment bank, yet chemistry will get you a lucrative job selling pharmaceuticals to supermarket chains. Like you I left school at 16 and grafted my way up. Interestingly I was printing a newspaper the other day when I looked in the job section when an ad caught my eye for some office lackey on £16k but they had requested that the applicants had atleast one degree of 2.2 or above. Btw, a friend of mine has a Masters in Astro-Physics, does he work for a space agency or aerospace? Nope, he number crunched on minimum wage for a job I had turned down myself 9 years ago. The reason he did that degree? So he could call himself a Master of the Universe Big He-Man fan... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 The reason he did that degree? So he could call himself a Master of the Universe Big He-Man fan... In all honesty that is the BEST reason i have ever heard for getting a certain degree! Scott =op Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tannhauser Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 But why is degree needed in this day and age? Prime example of why you don't need a degree: My sister was/is brainier than me at school work. She did extremely well in her GCSE's, went on to do psychology and a couple of other subjects at college for 3 years, then went on to York Uni studying psychology for a further 3 years. After Uni she found that she couldn't get a well paid job using her degree as she had no experience. catch 22 imo. She now earns circa 14k a year paper pushing in an office and is extremely unhappy. Dead end job. Me on the other hand went to school, did ok in my GCSE's, didn't go to college, didn't go to uni and just worked my way up to where I am today. Extremely happy and earning more than double my sisters salary. I can also better myself in years to come and keep climbing the ladder. Experience counts more than education in todays world. I can't see how that's at all relevant to what is considered middle class or working class. However. With regards to salary and uni education: although we could all find plenty of examples of poorly paid graduates and well paid non-graduates, that doesn't really tell us anything. We would need to compare the average salaries of both groups. Now, although there's a lot of debate on this, the figure that is often bandied about is that the average graduate earns £400, 000 more over the course of their working life. Though personally, I think the monetary recompense is the least valuable aspect of Higher Education The policy makers believe that higher education is likely to become more important for employers as time goes on, not less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flukey-lukey Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Its relevant because people state you must have an education (a degree etc) if you are middle class. maybe its just me who doesn't understand all this 'I'm better than you and in a higher class' thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Just wait until the boat is sinking and we'll sort it all out *cracks knuckles* Scott =op Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tannhauser Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Some degrees are a skeleton key to open any job- Maths, Sciences and English, Law and medicine very handy too Unfortunately there are too many people doing A levels in psychology, sociology and media studies then going on to get useless mickey mouse degrees that have no relevance to any sort of vocation. A degree in floristry will not get you in the door at an investment bank, yet chemistry will get you a lucrative job selling pharmaceuticals to supermarket chains. I think you've overstated the case. Graduates work outside of their degree subject and always have. Employers have always looked at a degree primarily as a general indicator of academic excellence. For many, the subject has traditionally been an irrelevance. For example, as a degree, Philosophy has no vocational relevance to anything other than lecturing in Philosophy - yet generations of Philosophy graduates have found employment. I agree that market shortages in the natural sciences mean it's easier for graduates in those subjects to gain employment - and also that there are certain high status subjects for some employers. One should beware, however, of dismissing subjects as 'Mickey Mouse' without actually having studied them. For example, my own degree involved three subjects that are traditionally thought challenging (Philosophy, Astronomy, Biology) and one often written off as easier (Psychology). Out of the four subjects, though, the Psychology turned out to be by far the most conceptually difficult (especially animal behaviour). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ewen Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Its relevant because people state you must have an education (a degree etc) if you are middle class Alan Sugar....left school at sixteen, could now be described as 'new upper class' but didnt need a degree to get there. Even more contentious is the fact that due to his financial success and business acumen he has been awarded two honorary Doctorates of Science degrees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 All the people I have had the misfortune to work with in engineering/aerospace with degrees have been a complete waste of space, poor work ethic, full of sh*t and parasites happy to get through the day without contributing a thing. And I've worked with many that had degrees relevant to engineering, one was a lecturer with a PHD in it yet knew bugger all as he spent all his life in noddy land rather than gaining what really matters, experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tannhauser Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Its relevant because people state you must have an education (a degree etc) if you are middle class. . Right, gotcha. The way I see it, "middle class" is a label for a segment of society, but when most people talk about the middle classes, they aren't just talking about money. The term might encompass things like: levels of education, tastes, political attitudes, type of work, area lived in, etc etc. Labeling yourself as middle class doesn't necessarily imply that you're setting yourself up as better than anybody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tannhauser Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Alan Sugar....left school at sixteen, could now be described as 'new upper class' but didnt need a degree to get there. Even more contentious is the fact that due to his financial success and business acumen he has been awarded two honorary Doctorates of Science degrees. Ah, but I think he would be described as more nouveau riche by many (especially the landed gentry). Zillionaire footballers are another example - wealthy as the upper classes, and yet not upper class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Class One Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Did you see the last option in the poll also? Scott =op That was actaully a typo on my part and nothing to do with Carl, as I added the extra options to the poll earlier in the day. That typo has now been rectified. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ewen Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Ah, but I think he would be described as more nouveau riche by many (especially the landed gentry). Zillionaire footballers are another example - wealthy as the upper classes, and yet not upper class. They are the 'new' upper class as I've read described. I dont subscribe to class myself, but I'd happily say that Sir Alan has as much right to claim that dubious honour as those whos necks were once fortuitously encircled by landed genitals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tannhauser Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 And I've worked with many that had degrees relevant to engineering, one was a lecturer with a PHD in it yet knew bugger all as he spent all his life in noddy land rather than gaining what really matters, experience. You should have heard what he said about you. There you go mate, put these on the other shoulder to stop you limping: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 and why would I have a chip on my shoulder? they always get found out for what they are and get the old heave ho, I hold the door open for them when they leave:) You should have heard what he said about you. There you go mate, put these on the other shoulder to stop you limping: http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg301/Tannhauser_bucket/chips.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tannhauser Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 I'd happily say that Sir Alan has as much right to claim that dubious honour as those whos necks were once fortuitously encircled by landed genitals. I've no idea what you mean by "fortuitously encircled by landed genitals", but I like it nonetheless. And I agree, but the whole question of class is one of perception, not of worthiness. The 'new upper class' isn't really new. There has always been an uneasy relationship between the titled and those who got their money through commerce. I guess the former has always looked down on the latter as vulgar - and the lower minions don't quite know what to think. I read H.G. Wells' Tono-Bungay last year. I think it's his greatest book and it deals exactly with this theme - humble lad makes good through selling useless tonic to the masses, bit still can't escape from the strictures of the class system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tannhauser Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 and why would I have a chip on my shoulder? they always get found out for what they are and get the old heave ho, I hold the door open for them when they leave:) Good for you. If, by some freakish set of circumstances, I get a job at your place, I'll keep my head down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Good for you. If, by some freakish set of circumstances, I get a job at your place, I'll keep my head down. I can't win with you mate;) Maybe it's a class thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ewen Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 I've no idea what you mean by "necks once fortuitously encircled by landed genitals", but I like it nonetheless Being born...to priviledged parents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl_S Posted March 21, 2008 Author Share Posted March 21, 2008 What is your degree in then, Carl? He didn't get his monies worth. Perhaps he should have paid a little more. Another spelling Nazi comment? Normally I wouldnt reply but since you have posted so much and are of high standing here at least get your own grammer right before you pull me up on mine. It's "money's worth". k? http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/5733/grammarnaziso9.jpg But why is degree needed in this day and age? Prime example of why you don't need a degree: My sister was/is brainier than me at school work. She did extremely well in her GCSE's, went on to do psychology and a couple of other subjects at college for 3 years, then went on to York Uni studying psychology for a further 3 years. After Uni she found that she couldn't get a well paid job using her degree as she had no experience. catch 22 imo. She now earns circa 14k a year paper pushing in an office and is extremely unhappy. Dead end job. Me on the other hand went to school, did ok in my GCSE's, didn't go to college, didn't go to uni and just worked my way up to where I am today. Extremely happy and earning more than double my sisters salary. I can also better myself in years to come and keep climbing the ladder. Experience counts more than education in todays world. Experience does matter a hell of a lot, but thats no decent argument against a good education. I can't see how that's at all relevant to what is considered middle class or working class. However. With regards to salary and uni education: although we could all find plenty of examples of poorly paid graduates and well paid non-graduates, that doesn't really tell us anything. We would need to compare the average salaries of both groups. Now, although there's a lot of debate on this, the figure that is often bandied about is that the average graduate earns £400, 000 more over the course of their working life. Though personally, I think the monetary recompense is the least valuable aspect of Higher Education The policy makers believe that higher education is likely to become more important for employers as time goes on, not less. Amen, You should have heard what he said about you. There you go mate, put these on the other shoulder to stop you limping: http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg301/Tannhauser_bucket/chips.jpg lol.. I hear that a lot, "them graduates dont live in the real world, they got no common sense what so ever". John Major said something a bit similiar. Bless him. Well actually, he said something more like, "I see people who have an armful of qualifications and no common sense what so ever"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ewen Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 at least get your own grammer right before you pull me up on mine That would be grammar. Monies is the plural of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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