CJ Posted January 15, 2008 Author Share Posted January 15, 2008 Ah well, at the end of the day, as the law stands it is illegal and as my first post pointed out, I didn't (and still don't) see why anyone in this country should feel they were above the law of the land. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesmark Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 Ah well, at the end of the day, as the law stands it is illegal and as my first post pointed out, I didn't (and still don't) see why anyone in this country should feel they were above the law of the land. Well said, you trouble maker you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saboteur Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 Ah well, at the end of the day, as the law stands it is illegal and as my first post pointed out, I didn't (and still don't) see why anyone in this country should feel they were above the law of the land. Bear that in mind next time you're out with your million hp supra! No-one really needs a car like the supra if they weren't planning on breaking the law... or for that moment that they "accidently" went over 70mph feel that they are above the law?? hmm... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boombastictiger Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 Ah well, at the end of the day, as the law stands it is illegal and as my first post pointed out, I didn't (and still don't) see why anyone in this country should feel they were above the law of the land. I see what your saying, but, its the fact that alot of people have been affected, and the law was passed without the government really looking into it properly. No one is trying to be above the law, its just that to be hounest it kind of hurt, forget the smoking part, its the socialising thing aswell...im 23 at uni, i go clubbing here n there gets boring after a while, but shisha was different, and people who used to go there experienced what im going on about aswell, its was the atmosphere and the place to chill and relax, without having alcohol around or over loud music...the shisha brought it all together, you share a shisha with some friends, pass it round, its not the same over a cup of tea lol.... I hope they bring out a new law for private venues and shisha cafes, at the end of the day no one can complain because they have the choice to go in there or not... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CJ Posted January 15, 2008 Author Share Posted January 15, 2008 Bear that in mind next time you're out with your million hp supra! No-one really needs a car like the supra if they weren't planning on breaking the law... or for that moment that they "accidently" went over 70mph feel that they are above the law?? hmm... No, I agree that anyone who deliberately breaks the law and gets caught should expect to be punished. If I get caught I wont whine or whinge about my civil liberties or my cultural heritage or the fact that nobody else was on the road and so it doesn't affect them. I will accept it because I will have been caught breaking the law. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren-K Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 Just because a law is introduced by a government does not make it right, this is why in a democratic country laws can be challenged, i mean look what happened to maggy thatcher after her introduction of the poll tax. she was sacked so was the tax. Gordon Brown next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesmark Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 No-one really needs a car like the supra if they weren't planning on breaking the law... or for that moment that they "accidently" went over 70mph feel that they are above the law?? hmm... Now you're being silly, there are people that actually buy the Supra because they like it for it's looks, it's reliability and the fact it has appeared on Fast and the Furious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 I aint gonna loose my cool on this when people like you be tryna provoke... You seem unable to see the difference between "discuss" and "provoke" but try to keep your knickers on eh Yea pubs sell food, but its main reason is for the alcohol RIGHT???? ..Well the main reason for a shisha cafe is the shisha....WHAT are shisha cafes called shisha Cafes for? For some people I'm sure a pub is a place to go and drink lots, myself and many others like to go and enjoy food and a couple of drinks at them, ban the alcohol and I'll still go, I'm reasonable like that - I can drink, smoke etc at home where it's legal. Hell if I had friends I could even invite them round to share the experience and socialise! Imagine! The "Shisha bar" in question is called the "Markaz Restaurant and Shisha Bar" - so is the main reason for it to be a restaurant or a shisha bar or is it trying to be both? It's a restaurant, a place that serves food... like McDonalds... should I be able to crack open a big jock-off pipe full of stuff in there too? Yea they sell food, but thats to accompany you while you smoke..., they dont really make much money from the food, thats why so many of them have gone out of business... Poor business model then I guess. Yea cant go out everynight and chill and sit down for a few hours just over a coke, well maybe some people can but thats personal choice....and if you think about it, its a stupid what your suggesting... Stupid in what way? Crikey if these Shisha things are the only way these people can exist I'm genuinely worried for them! Play chess over a nice long coffee, go for a walk... If I went into a pub to get some food, but didnt feel like having alcohol around me or people smelling of it, wouldnt i feel like and idiot and fool and stupid if I complained about it as after all it is a PUB.......same things goes with a shisha cafe and your example... Alcohol isn't banned... if it was and the pub you went into was serving it then you could probably have a little rant. Not that the alcohol would really affect you too much as it's not filling the air with nasties like this toxic smoke does. I think you need to get over the whole pub = booze thing and appreciate that there is a smoking ban in place that covers all types of smoking, if an alcohol ban came into force you wouldn't be able to open a "gin bar" to get around it. You clearly dont understand how a shisha cafe works, ok your from up north, maybe things are different there, but in london hundreds of shisha cafes have gone out of business because the MAIN 98% reason to go there was for the shisha, the food they served mainly was just small snacks to accompany it, or make it seem a little bit more upmarket than its competition... This one in Bradford is the only UK bar of it's kind I've ever heard of, I've seen the devices used as decoration before and experienced the stuff in Tunisia but it's not something that I'm all that familiar with, I can still cobble together a few words based on what I do know though. It's a shame places are going out of business but the law is the law, a lot of pubs are using the smoking ban as an excuse for their demise too but I doubt they will get a great deal of exposure because they just do as they are told and deal with the consequences. Shisha cafes are not public places in the sense that you have people in there for all types of reason...the main reason is shisha, yea you have food served there and drink, you can buy it seperatly, but thats to accompany you while you smoke....no one really goes in there just to buy a drink, because its not a newsagent... Its like a vegetarian walking into a kebab shop to buy a drink, and then walking out complaining about the meat,they would be stupid because it was THIER CHOICE to go in no one made them, I *do* get your point but there is a smoking ban in place, that removes your arguement - you need to be opposing the ban as a whole rather than suggesting a small minority of people should be exempt from it IMO. Thanks for the clarification though, I'm learning things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbleapple Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 For those who claim shisha isn't harmful: "The anti-smoking campaign group ASH claimed regular inhaling of shisha was equivalent to smoking up to 60 cigarettes a day." With regard to the Shisha bar in Bradford, when it was on Look North, there were white (Christian) people in the actual interview, so race has nothing to do with the discussion since all races are affected by the ban on Shisha. If anything the legal challenge will be whether Shisha is covered by the same umbrella as cigarettes which will be for the House of Lords to decide. My problem with the whole discussion is that people who like Shisha seem to be trying to differentiate between pubs and their own bars. Certainly the Shisha bar in Bradford shown on Look North had a bar and looked in my opinion like a pub. I also thought there was a bloke drinking a pint but perhaps I’m mistaken. From reading this forum there is also an underlying suggestion that minorities (Shisha smokers) are being picked on by the evil government.... I would point out that more were affected by the smoking ban than the small minority who smoke Shisha. I would also like to point out to Saboteur that he seems to have labelled pubs as places to only go get drunk etc. Have you been to a pub before?? If you live near Bradford I suggest you go to the Cow and Calf or Dick Hudsons (I'll even take you if you want)... the meals they have there are good and I have often spent an afternoon in their gardens overlooking the Moors (and I don’t drink). I laughed when I listed to Look North... that bloody programme is determined to cause as much hysteria as possible...and by filming Muppets breaking the law it gives the authorities hard evidence of the breaking of the law... Even that Muppet who refused to ban smoking in his pub made the fatal error of announcing that he plans to open a new pub and allow smoking.... Having said that does he now expect to get planning permission or a licence? - If they kept quiet they might get away with it. On and from a legal point Shisha bars might just become exempt from the law for the reason being that they are specialist places (i.e. it is legal to for a tabaccoist (SP) to light a cigar to check quality etc in the course of business) but using the arguement that 'it's a way of life' or 'it's Muslim bashing' just won't work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saboteur Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 No, I agree that anyone who deliberately breaks the law and gets caught should expect to be punished. If I get caught I wont whine or whinge about my civil liberties or my cultural heritage or the fact that nobody else was on the road and so it doesn't affect them. I will accept it because I will have been caught breaking the law. Absolutely, nothing to say to that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CJ Posted January 15, 2008 Author Share Posted January 15, 2008 saboteur , am i right when i say that smoking Shisha has been going on for over a thousand years ? I dont smoke either but i think the smoking ban should def take into account peoples cultures, I mean,would the burning of joss sticks and incense in churches and religous places of worship fall under the ban ? The Uk government is hypocritical. We have drank alcohol in the UK for many years. Under your reasoning I should therefore be allowed to do so in any other country even if it is against the law. Correct? You seemed to have missed this Darren. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 Pointless even paying attention to what your saying, do you even know what a shisha looks like? Smells like? u probs dont care and are joining in the discussion for the sake of arguing.....what an idiot.. You aren't willing to discuss this like a normal person without resorting to insults and I'm the idiot? I know what one looks like, smells like, tastes like and so on... I also know what a cigar tastes like, smells like etc... I can't have one of those in a Shisha bar because there is a smoking ban... Your "probably" is flawed but please continue to amuse me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesmark Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 she was sacked so was the tax. I am younger than you and even I know she resigned, ok she did not have enough support to win the leadership election but still was not sacked. And the tax was renamed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CJ Posted January 15, 2008 Author Share Posted January 15, 2008 Bear that in mind next time you're out with your million hp supra! Out here on Kos? Chance would be a fine thing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbleapple Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 I know what one looks like, smells like, tastes like and so on... I also know what a cigar tastes like, smells like etc... I can't have one of those in a Shisha bar because there is a smoking ban... Not often I agree with Michael but this is one of them Well said sir!! We have seen people breaking the law in front and on camera a few years ago in Bradford. The Police used all the video evidence and I think the last rioter brought to justice was jailed for 7 years a few weeks ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlotte Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 Shish. There's no need for fighting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren-K Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 You seemed to have missed this Darren. I didnt miss it CJ,i just decided not to answer because you and others dont like me,and i realy dont want to get on anyones nerves so i thought i would just keep myself to myself and avoid conflict. However,i dont claim to be uber brainy but i only know of 1 country where you cant drink and thats Dubai ? but i could be wrong, but even then isnt it tolerated to a degree ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colsoop Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 Shish. There's no need for fighting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren-K Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 I am younger than you and even I know she resigned, ok she did not have enough support to win the leadership election but still was not sacked. And the tax was renamed. James she was pushed out, the country was in turmoil and there were riots all over the place., technicaly yes,she resigned - with enough research you will see she was pushed. so in a way sacked. yeh, the council tax is bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbleapple Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 James she was pushed out, the country was in turmoil and there were riots all over the place., technicaly yes,she resigned - with enough research you will see she was pushed. so in a way sacked. + i dont claim to be uber brainy = (p.s. Darren I like you (in a non man love sense) ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren-K Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 + = (p.s. Darren I like you (in a non man love sense) ) well you made me laugh for the first time in days,thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesmark Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 James she was pushed out, the country was in turmoil and there were riots all over the place., technicaly yes,she resigned - with enough research you will see she was pushed. so in a way sacked. yeh, the council tax is bad. Is that not what I said in the first place, that she did not have enough support . Even when she was pushed she was not sacked. I do not really require research as I have a Conservative Party speaker beside me at work who lives conservative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbleapple Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 I do not really require research as I have a Conservative Party speaker beside me at work who lives conservative. And you expect an honest reply from that person?!?!?! Even though I actually agree with you, those Conservative speaker blokes are nutters! Worse than the KKK in terms of dedication and blindness to the other sides views Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren-K Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 Is that not what I said in the first place, that she did not have enough support . Even when she was pushed she was not sacked. I do not really require research as I have a Conservative Party speaker beside me at work who lives conservative. Well ask you conservative friend,would Maggie of stood another 4 years if she could ? Im sure she didnt leave by choice however she left,it was great to see her in tears as she walked away from number 10,after all her tears were nothing more than a fraction of the tears of the nation - the way she had us on our knees,. and i liked maggie & still do !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CJ Posted January 15, 2008 Author Share Posted January 15, 2008 ...it was great to see her in tears as she walked away from number 10,after all her tears were nothing more than a fraction of the tears of the nation - the way she had us on our knees,. and i liked maggie & still do !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.